Pollard to Texans

[DT14PRIEST]

Former Chiefs S Bernard Pollard to the*Texans - Arrowhead Pride (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/9/24/1053007/former-chiefs-s-bernard-pollard-to)

Game Over

[matthewschiefs]

good to see that he got picked up. surprised that it took that long.

[yashi]

He could probably help them with run defense if he's playing around the line of scrimmage a lot. They're ranked 32nd right now.

[Seek]

I am not surprised. If they kept stats on players who completely whiffed a tackle or let a tackle get broke after contact. Pollard would bet right there at the top. He is horrible in pass coverage.

He will definately help ther special teams unit though. Once he actually signs and it is not longer a rumor.

[wolfpack]

maybe they can teach him to wrap up more and less for going to the big hit.

[Sn@keIze]

. If they kept stats on players who completely whiffed a tackle or let a tackle get broke after contact. Pollard would bet right there at the top.
Hey Seek,if you kept stats you would know who led the team in tackles for the Chiefs last year d!psh!t.!!!!!!


I am so sick of these idiots disrespecting Bernard Pollard.

He gave us special teams play and (because he is a DB, as in DB as in someone who primarly covers TE and WR) those tackles you are talkin about are tackles the front 7 missed. Let me hear you b!tch about them.

[brish]

Drama pill anyone? I think Sn@ke has some. :D

Pollard wasn't the greatest tackler/coverage guy you have to admit that, but he did make plays at times..

[AussieChiefsFan]

What'd we get out of it?

[chief31]

What'd we get out of it?

What did we get from Jared Allen leading the league in sacks?

We got a guy who did his job well.

Not that Pollard did his job as well as Allen did his. But he was pretty good in both coverage and run support.

[honda522]

Nooo..

[Seek]

Hey Seek,if you kept stats you would know who led the team in tackles for the Chiefs last year d!psh!t.!!!!!!


I am so sick of these idiots disrespecting Bernard Pollard.

He gave us special teams play and (because he is a DB, as in DB as in someone who primarly covers TE and WR) those tackles you are talkin about are tackles the front 7 missed. Let me hear you b!tch about them.

I am not talking about yards racked on on a pathetic defense. I won't argue the frong seven. I watched every game Pollard played. He missed a ton of tackles and made first contact on numberous MORE. Hard hits... but he failed to bring down the tackle numberous times.

Obviously idiots like me who get paid to evaluate Pollard saw the same thing or he would still be a Chief.

Sorry, Stats don't tell the whole truth. Pollard wasn't the worste safety by any stretch, but he was a huge liablility. If you don't like that. To bad. The truth is the truth.

To be honest, I don't know who is a bigger idiot.

[chief31]

I am not talking about yards racked on on a pathetic defense. I won't argue the frong seven. I watched every game Pollard played. He missed a ton of tackles and made first contact on numberous MORE. Hard hits... but he failed to bring down the tackle numberous times.

Obviously idiots like me who get paid to evaluate Pollard saw the same thing or he would still be a Chief.

Sorry, Stats don't tell the whole truth. Pollard wasn't the worste safety by any stretch, but he was a huge liablility. If you don't like that. To bad. The truth is the truth.

To be honest, I don't know who is a bigger idiot.

I watched every game too. (Several, a week or two after the game was played.)

And, since he was released, the exaggeration of how Pollard was bad in coverage, and missed so many tackles has just gone wild.

It's as if many of you have just decided to attribute all of Page's mistakes to Pollard, so we can justify getting rid of the team's top defensive performer, yet again.

Over the past two seasons, Pollard accumulated 188 total tackles. (98 in '08 and 90 in '07)

We can speculate back and fourth all day. But Pollard was the one player on this defense who was getting anything done. That, aside from his value on ST, makes him too valuable to just release.

It seems obvious to most, that he was released for a personality conflict with Haley. (Imagine that. Someone doesn't like being treated like he is some 'ho' in Pimp Haley's stable.)

How many of you would like for your boss to scream and yell at you like that, and how many would likely haul off and shut his mouth for him? Can you tolerate being humiliated in front of all of your coworkers?

The problem with being a 'hard-nosed' coach, is that the coaching style is unwelcomed by certain types of personalities. And eliminating those personalities from the list of players who are willing to play for your team, on a team with a poor record and small market, eliminates your options, when looking for talented players.

However, it has worked before. So, while I may sound sarcastic about it, I am not saying that the style is doomed to failure.

I have been seeing Cowher's name thrown around in support of 'abusive' coaching styles. But Cowher was rarely in a player's face. He was often in a ref's face. But he was more of a player's coach than a bully.

Anyone remember him kissing Joey Porter? Constantly praising his players. Rarely humiliating them.

If anything, Cowher is 'tweener. He doesn't belong in a group with the likes of Ditka, Parcells and Bobby Knight.

[DT14PRIEST]

I watched every game too. (Several, a week or two after the game was played.)

And, since he was released, the exaggeration of how Pollard...

Pollard was average (at best and even that is pushing it) in coverage and a poor tackler and thats the bottom line.

He was a very good hitter but a sure handed tackler he was not.

Considering he was apart of two sub .500 seasons with teams whose rushing defense were 28th and 30th respectively in 07 and 08, if a secondary player such as Pollard was not the leading tackler for the chiefs at the time considering the putrid state of our defense (everyone remembers michael turner dragging Pat Thomas last year) I'd have been surprised. I think its safe to say that Pollard was given more then his fair share of chances to pad his tackle stat.

Just going by this year alone it was readily apparent that he still hasn't learned how to tackle:

NFL Videos: Seahawks 14, Chiefs 10 (http://www.nfl.com/videos/kansas-city-chiefs/09000d5d8123fcaf/Seahawks-14-Chiefs-10)

watch between 1:44 - 3:58 Pollard whiffs haven't been fixed. this is 2009. he's had 3 years now in the NFL and still hasn't learned how to properly tackle.

Even Herm Edwards said that he was basically an in the box safety. A knock out hitter but not a good tackler and a guy that was never very good in coverage either.

Former Kansas City Chiefs Coach on Bernard*Pollard - Arrowhead Pride (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/9/10/1023953/former-kansas-city-chiefs-coach-on)

And this is Herm Edwards, the guy we all dislike to some degree but all seem to agree was a pretty decent DB guy/coach

[Sn@keIze]

I watched every game too. (Several, a week or two after the game was played.)

And, since he was released, the exaggeration of how Pollard was bad in coverage, and missed so many tackles has just gone wild.

It's as if many of you have just decided to attribute all of Page's mistakes to Pollard, so we can justify getting rid of the team's top defensive performer, yet again.

Over the past two seasons, Pollard accumulated 188 total tackles. (98 in '08 and 90 in '07)

We can speculate back and fourth all day. But Pollard was the one player on this defense who was getting anything done. That, aside from his value on ST, makes him too valuable to just release.
.I never thought id add to Chiefs31 rep !!

Good points Chief31


Pollard was average (at best and even that is pushing it) in coverage and a poor tackler and thats the bottom line.

He was a very good hitter but a sure handed tackler he was not.

Considering he was apart of two sub .500 seasons with teams whose rushing defense were 28th and 30th respectively in 07 and 08, if a secondary player such as Pollard was not the leading tackler for the chiefs at the time considering the putrid state of our defense (everyone remembers michael turner dragging Pat Thomas last year) I'd have been surprised. I think its safe to say that Pollard was given more then his fair share of chances to pad his tackle stat.

Just going by this year alone it was readily apparent that he still hasn't learned how to tackle:

NFL Videos: Seahawks 14, Chiefs 10 (http://www.nfl.com/videos/kansas-city-chiefs/09000d5d8123fcaf/Seahawks-14-Chiefs-10)

watch between 1:44 - 3:58 Pollard whiffs haven't been fixed. this is 2009. he's had 3 years now in the NFL and still hasn't learned how to properly tackle.

Even Herm Edwards said that he was basically an in the box safety. A knock out hitter but not a good tackler and a guy that was never very good in coverage either.

Former Kansas City Chiefs Coach on Bernard*Pollard - Arrowhead Pride (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/9/10/1023953/former-kansas-city-chiefs-coach-on)

And this is Herm Edwards, the guy we all dislike to some degree but all seem to agree was a pretty decent DB guy/coachI could show you more positive plays on Pollard, than negative plays like the one you've shown. And again I emphasize our weak front 7 which increases his responsibility to do their job.

Every player has a missed tackle. And yes, Pollard has more than his share. But we (like Page) developed him and went through the growing pains with him. And now, guess what!.. an offensive minded coach decides we should cut him!


And yes i agree that Herm was nothin but a DB guy. Herm drafted him (and wouldnt elaborate on whether he agree or disagreed on Pollards release in your link) and resposible for most of our 2ndary.

And when it comes to WR talent, chances are I wont question Haley. I think our WR situation as it stands is above expectations, thats Haley area.

I fully anticipate us talkin about Pollard success later in the future.

[DT14PRIEST]

I could show you more positive plays on Pollard...

I can recall a few good plays but for every 1 good play he made I can recall one to counter it as well in the same game. The game is about consistency not the one good play you make a game and Pollard by demonstration proved time and time again he was a liability.

It doesn't take an offensive minded or defensive minded coach to see that the guy was a liability. I'll give him credit though, he did lay out guys and make some pretty vicious hits but I'd take a player who is a the same guy day in and day out over a head hunter any day of the week.

And I doubt even Herm is dumb enough to endorse the cutting of one of his draftee's; it's bad PR if he's ever looking to get back into coaching at some point.

[doobs_05]

It was awesome not to have tom brady for a full nfl season for everyone to talk about lol

[Hayvern]

I can recall a few good plays but for every 1 good play he made I can recall one to counter it as well in the same game. The game is about consistency not the one good play you make a game and Pollard by demonstration proved time and time again he was a liability.

It doesn't take an offensive minded or defensive minded coach to see that the guy was a liability. I'll give him credit though, he did lay out guys and make some pretty vicious hits but I'd take a player who is a the same guy day in and day out over a head hunter any day of the week.

And I doubt even Herm is dumb enough to endorse the cutting of one of his draftee's; it's bad PR if he's ever looking to get back into coaching at some point.

Bah, the same could be said about a lot of members of this team. Even Bowe has had his inconsistencies since he has come here. He was a young player that was not coached well his first seasons here, but made some big contributions to a pretty sad team.

We have players on this team that are not as good as he was, Pollard was let go for more than missed tackles.

[chief31]

I can recall a few good plays but for every 1 good play he made I can recall one to counter it as well in the same game. The game is about consistency not the one good play you make a game and Pollard by demonstration proved time and time again he was a liability.

It doesn't take an offensive minded or defensive minded coach to see that the guy was a liability. I'll give him credit though, he did lay out guys and make some pretty vicious hits but I'd take a player who is a the same guy day in and day out over a head hunter any day of the week.

And I doubt even Herm is dumb enough to endorse the cutting of one of his draftee's; it's bad PR if he's ever looking to get back into coaching at some point.

Well, it's pretty easy to remember the one that gets your attention, a missed tackle, and overlook the 6-7 tackles that he had in a game. Especially in a loss.

I remember him getting blamed for missed coverage alot last season. But I rarely remember those situations being his assigned coverage.

More often than not, I would hear the complaints of how he blew some big play, only to see the game later and realize that it was just Pollard trying to fall back and cover Page's responsibilty.

Missed tackles? As stated, everyone will miss some. But he was probably the most consistent tackler we had on this team last season.

Did he struggle with the defensive changes this preseason? Sure. Is that unusual? No. Changing how you do things isn't always going to go real smooth, right out of the gates.

I can't help but think that our top defensive performer from last season was released due to a personality clash with our new HC.

But we try to justify that by downplaying the player's worth on the field.

And, try as you might, there really isn't a case for releasing him, without including a conflict with the coaching staff.

Being so far below the salary cap, paying him as nothing more than a ST player would have been just fine. So he certainly wasn't released to make room under the cap.

As most everyone has stated, he was a good ST player. Even if you think he is completely worthless as a Safety, we still lost a valuable player, for nothing.

[Hayvern]

Well, it's pretty easy to remember the one that gets your attention, a missed tackle, and overlook the 6-7 tackles that he had in a game. Especially in a loss.

I remember him getting blamed for missed coverage alot last season. But I rarely remember those situations being his assigned coverage.

More often than not, I would hear the complaints of how he blew some big play, only to see the game later and realize that it was just Pollard trying to fall back and cover Page's responsibilty.

Missed tackles? As stated, everyone will miss some. But he was probably the most consistent tackler we had on this team last season.

Did he struggle with the defensive changes this preseason? Sure. Is that unusual? No. Changing how you do things isn't always going to go real smooth, right out of the gates.

I can't help but think that our top defensive performer from last season was released due to a personality clash with our new HC.

But we try to justify that by downplaying the player's worth on the field.

And, try as you might, there really isn't a case for releasing him, without including a conflict with the coaching staff.

Being so far below the salary cap, paying him as nothing more than a ST player would have been just fine. So he certainly wasn't released to make room under the cap.

As most everyone has stated, he was a good ST player. Even if you think he is completely worthless as a Safety, we still lost a valuable player, for nothing.

Agreed, but what done is done, the only issue is that we are likely to see this scenario pay out again with another player. This time, the player is likely to be Dewayne Bowe.

[chief31]

Agreed, but what done is done, the only issue is that we are likely to see this scenario pay out again with another player. This time, the player is likely to be Dewayne Bowe.

Performing well for this team, has been a sure-fire way to get yourself a new job, the past few seasons.

Let's hope that that trend has already ended.

[DT14PRIEST]

I can't help but think that our top defensive performer from...

I already outlined the rest.

The defense as a whole was terrible (especially the run defense 28th and 30th overall in 07-08) Pollard had more then his fair share of chances to pad his tackle stat. He should of easily had a 100+ tackles if he was a consistent gamer.

I think its more telling to his general worth and the league's view on him as well (as well as the overall talent on this team) that Pollard fell through waiver wire and was on the market 3 games into the regular season before anyone made an offer to claim him.

I won't deny that he was a good ST player but to say he was a quality starter is a discrediting 31 other teams in the NFL who didn't pursue him.

There was a reason why he wasn't picked up after the 53 man cut and still wasn't picked up quickly after he fell through waivers.

[josh1971]

And I think it has to do with his pass coverage skills, not his tackling.

[chief31]

I already outlined the rest.

The defense as a whole was terrible (especially the run defense 28th and 30th overall in 07-08) Pollard had more then his fair share of chances to pad his tackle stat. He should of easily had a 100+ tackles if he was a consistent gamer.

I think its more telling to his general worth and the league's view on him as well (as well as the overall talent on this team) that Pollard fell through waiver wire and was on the market 3 games into the regular season before anyone made an offer to claim him.

I won't deny that he was a good ST player but to say he was a quality starter is a discrediting 31 other teams in the NFL who didn't pursue him.

There was a reason why he wasn't picked up after the 53 man cut and still wasn't picked up quickly after he fell through waivers.

You are speculating Bout how many teams pursued him. Ther is no way to know that.

And teams go all out to save the 53 men that do make their final cut. It is not surprising at all that those teams would be reluctant to go ahead and cut one more, after they just congratulated him for making the squad.

You saw far more bad things from him han most did.

Same as everyone was so high on Bobby Wade last week.

Two missed tackles in the most recent game overshadows good tackling over the past two seasons.

But he was the top performer on this defense last season.

He did a pretty good job here, over the past two seasons, and The Texans will be glad that they have him.

[texaschief]

Pollard's release is just too stupid for words when you're now relying on a guy in Brown who probably couldn't even tell you when he last played a full season and Jon McGraw as your SS. ugh

[josh1971]

So if Mike Brown plays the whole season this year without injury will everyone shut up about that?

And frankly, McGraw has played really well this year- especially on special teams.

We're losing games in the trenches. Period. If we could generate pressure up front, or block it, we'd be doing a lot better.

jb

[DT14PRIEST]

You are speculating...

Maybe it is speculation at this point but when its outlined plainly (4-5 missed tackles in that pre season footage against the Seahawks in 2009 alone) its pretty obvious that people have fallen for the 1-2 big plays that Pollard was known for rather then the big picture.

Its also speculative for management of any team to say that they want to 'keep all 53 of the final cuts at any cost' when our own team in the Chiefs were willing to part ways with one of those 53 quickly when a player from another team (RT or what not that replaced Barry Richardson) hit the WW.

If Pollard was as highly regarded a player as many here seem to think he was wouldn't there have been an inkling of interest in him at the beginning of his free fall through waivers?

Wouldn't a team desperate for a safety such as the Lions (who has familiarity with Pollard's play in Gunther) have shown some interest in signing him if he was that good or as good as others are outlining him to be? Why were other players who were chopped and made it to waivers taken quickly while a gamer like Pollard left to fall through the cracks and ultimately sit idle waiting for someone to pick him up?

He wasn't picked up until ultimately another team had a player fall on the IR in Huston. I think that says a lot.

I give him credit for what he did (big plays)...but I don't disregard the amount of bad plays that was accredited to him when he started. I'd trade big plays for consistent play any day of the week and Pollard was anything but consistent.

[honda522]

So if Mike Brown plays the whole season this year without injury will everyone shut up about that?

And frankly, McGraw has played really well this year- especially on special teams.

We're losing games in the trenches. Period. If we could generate pressure up front, or block it, we'd be doing a lot better.

jb

Finally, this is what I was talking about. Its not the LB's, QB's or DB's. Its both side of the lines.

[Sn@keIze]

So if Mike Brown plays the whole season this year without injury will everyone shut up about that?


jb


Better yet. If Mike Brown stays healthy, and leads this team in tackles and assist.


Lets release him.

[chief31]

Maybe it is speculation at this point but when its outlined plainly (4-5 missed tackles in that pre season footage against the Seahawks in 2009 alone) its pretty obvious that people have fallen for the 1-2 big plays that Pollard was known for rather then the big picture.

Its also speculative for management of any team to say that they want to 'keep all 53 of the final cuts at any cost' when our own team in the Chiefs were willing to part ways with one of those 53 quickly when a player from another team (RT or what not that replaced Barry Richardson) hit the WW.

If Pollard was as highly regarded a player as many here seem to think he was wouldn't there have been an inkling of interest in him at the beginning of his free fall through waivers?

Wouldn't a team desperate for a safety such as the Lions (who has familiarity with Pollard's play in Gunther) have shown some interest in signing him if he was that good or as good as others are outlining him to be? Why were other players who were chopped and made it to waivers taken quickly while a gamer like Pollard left to fall through the cracks and ultimately sit idle waiting for someone to pick him up?

He wasn't picked up until ultimately another team had a player fall on the IR in Huston. I think that says a lot.

I give him credit for what he did (big plays)...but I don't disregard the amount of bad plays that was accredited to him when he started. I'd trade big plays for consistent play any day of the week and Pollard was anything but consistent.

Who says he was sitting idle, waiting for someone to pick him up?

He may well have rejected some teams before deciding to go to Houston.

Either way, one bad game is hardly a reasonable way to assess anyone. The Steelers are 1-2. Patriots were damn close to that. Alot of things look different with a small sample size to evaluate.

Pollard has been the most solid player on this defense the past two seasons. And could easily have been coached into further improvements.

But, as opposed to failing to coach, this would be a failure to attempt to coach.

And I have only seen the man make two good hits. I am certainly not letting those two plays overshadow anything.


So if Mike Brown plays the whole season this year without injury will everyone shut up about that?

And frankly, McGraw has played really well this year- especially on special teams.

We're losing games in the trenches. Period. If we could generate pressure up front, or block it, we'd be doing a lot better.

jb

Probably not. Not without this team showing a big turnaround from where they are right now.

Rather Brown manages to play a full season or not, it is unwise to take that risk, without an insurance policy.

[DT14PRIEST]

Who says he was sitting idle, waiting for someone to pick him up?

Either way, one bad game is hardly a reasonable way to assess anyone...

Pollard has been the most solid player on this defense...

But, as opposed to failing to coach, this would be a failure to attempt to coach.

And I have only seen the man make two good hits. I am certainly not letting those two plays overshadow anything.


Maybe he wasn't sitting idle but I only heard of the Texans working him out since he's hit the market and usually when teams workout a player (or a player of high regard in Pollard's case in some views) there is usually some form of news or report that he's working with a team.

Speculation again...

Pollard has been hit or miss for most of his career. He was a hit in ST but was a shaky game day performer for as long as I can remember when asked to be a full time starter. The Seattle game is merely a headline as to how it still hasn't changed since we've drafted him (06).

Pollard may have been the most solid player on our defense in your opinion but I'd beg to differ that Flowers has been a much more consistent. Pollard has been our hammer (our big hitter) I give him that but he's been anything but consistent. Once again I point to the run defense i.e. the front seven.

[chief31]

Maybe he wasn't sitting idle but I only heard of the Texans working him out since he's hit the market and usually when teams workout a player (or a player of high regard in Pollard's case in some views) there is usually some form of news or report that he's working with a team.

Speculation again...

Pollard has been hit or miss for most of his career. He was a hit in ST but was a shaky game day performer for as long as I can remember when asked to be a full time starter. The Seattle game is merely a headline as to how it still hasn't changed since we've drafted him (06).

Pollard may have been the most solid player on our defense in your opinion but I'd beg to differ that Flowers has been a much more consistent. Pollard has been our hammer (our big hitter) I give him that but he's been anything but consistent. Once again I point to the run defense i.e. the front seven.

Fair enough.

I think he would have done far better with a decent team and system around him, and that he did pretty well, in spite of those factors.

But anyone getting cut from a 2-14 team instantly carries the tag of a guy who has been cut by a 2-14 team. Not like alot of teams were lining up to go picking through our 'garbage'.

But The Texans may well have happened across a diamond bracelette in our 'garbage'.

[texaschief]

So if Mike Brown plays the whole season this year without injury will everyone shut up about that?

And frankly, McGraw has played really well this year- especially on special teams.

We're losing games in the trenches. Period. If we could generate pressure up front, or block it, we'd be doing a lot better.

jb

No, because Pollard is 24 while Brown is 31. 7 YEARS difference. Who do you think would've contributed to this team longer?

[Seek]

I watched every game too. (Several, a week or two after the game was played.)

And, since he was released, the exaggeration of how Pollard was bad in coverage, and missed so many tackles has just gone wild.

It's as if many of you have just decided to attribute all of Page's mistakes to Pollard, so we can justify getting rid of the team's top defensive performer, yet again.

Over the past two seasons, Pollard accumulated 188 total tackles. (98 in '08 and 90 in '07)

We can speculate back and fourth all day. But Pollard was the one player on this defense who was getting anything done. That, aside from his value on ST, makes him too valuable to just release.

It seems obvious to most, that he was released for a personality conflict with Haley. (Imagine that. Someone doesn't like being treated like he is some 'ho' in Pimp Haley's stable.)

How many of you would like for your boss to scream and yell at you like that, and how many would likely haul off and shut his mouth for him? Can you tolerate being humiliated in front of all of your coworkers?

The problem with being a 'hard-nosed' coach, is that the coaching style is unwelcomed by certain types of personalities. And eliminating those personalities from the list of players who are willing to play for your team, on a team with a poor record and small market, eliminates your options, when looking for talented players.

However, it has worked before. So, while I may sound sarcastic about it, I am not saying that the style is doomed to failure.

I have been seeing Cowher's name thrown around in support of 'abusive' coaching styles. But Cowher was rarely in a player's face. He was often in a ref's face. But he was more of a player's coach than a bully.

Anyone remember him kissing Joey Porter? Constantly praising his players. Rarely humiliating them.

If anything, Cowher is 'tweener. He doesn't belong in a group with the likes of Ditka, Parcells and Bobby Knight.


Sorry, but my exaggeration of Pollard wasn't since his release. It was well stated while he was still a Chief.

As I said many times before, he is nothing more than a special teams player and back up. It was always a make or break year for him. I don't see where he made it other than rest of the teams performance eclisped his play.

There is a reason so many people wanted to convert him to a line backer. I wasn't a fan of that, but there is a reason.

Don't get me wrong. I would have prefered Pollard of John McGraw, Brown or Morgan, but as far as I see. Their times are short here.