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N TX Dave
11-18-2010, 11:35 AM
Very good article we should all read and take heed to from another fan.
Are the Chiefs Set For a Free Fall Like the 2009 Broncos? - Arrowhead Pride (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/11/17/1818339/are-the-chiefs-set-for-a-free-fall-like-the-2009-broncos#storyjump)
Are the Chiefs Set For a Free Fall Like the 2009 Broncos?

http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2010/11/68.jpg by Jon Yoon (http://www.sbnation.com/users/Jon%20Yoon) on Nov 17, 2010 8:50 AM CST (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/11/17/1818339/are-the-chiefs-set-for-a-free-fall-like-the-2009-broncos) in 2010 Kansas City Chiefs Season (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/section/2010-campaign)

It was bound to happen. The Chiefs (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/teams/kansas-city-chiefs) were bound to get blown out one of these games. Now the wheels have fallen completely off the bandwagon.


Let me remind everyone of two critical points. Write them down. Study them hard. Pop quiz yourself. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

This is the first game the Chiefs lost in convincing fashion. The fact that it happened 9 games into the season isn't a bad thing
The Chiefs all season long have been an average, non-playoff team cloaked in exquisite robesDid you take notes? If you didn't, read the above points again.
Enough of this ridiculous talk about the Chiefs falling out. Enough ridiculous talk or comments about Todd Haley coaching for his job. Enough ridiculous comments about Todd Haley losing his team. Long story short, this is a team that still has talent gaps that has been largely overachieving all season long. Despite that, yesterday was the first game all season where they were never really in a position to win. That means the problem isn't with the team or the coach; the problem is with the unrealistic expectations put on this team as a result of finally winning games.
Easy schedules are a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, it's been a great ride to watch the Chiefs win games and reignite conversations that the Chiefs could be primed for a playoff run. Given the remaining schedule, there is definitely truth to those claims. They could back their way into the playoffs. The problem is, a few wins can often encourage people to take their eyes off the prize. Because the Chiefs were "so close" to being a playoff contender, we fans convinced ourselves that Randy Moss (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/3332/randy-moss) was the last missing piece to this puzzle. Yeah, we actually had that conversation. Remember that?
If there's anything we've learned the last two weeks it's that the Chiefs are more than a superstar away from being a legit playoff contender. That's soberingly bad news for some, but it's also news that I hope will keep people grounded after losses like these. That's not a bad thing. What the Chiefs have shown this season is that they are competitors and overachievers. They won their first five games by playing beyond their talent level. Even in a blowout loss, you had to like the fire and determination the offense showed to play as if a 35-point game was actually within reach. I railed on Dwayne Bowe (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/18956/dwayne-bowe) quite a bit for his key drop last week, but last week might have been a turning point for me. I don't care if it was garbage time. I've heard some people complain that he was celebrating meaningless Touchdowns or padding his stats. Who cares? What impressed me more was the way Bowe was throwing his body everywhere, taking a few heavy shots, bouncing up only to take another shot, all in meaningless minutes. The guy played every single meaningless 4th quarter snap as if it were the 4th quarter of the Super Bowl. You can't even get Randy Moss to play with that much intensity in a close game, let alone a blowout. If Bowe can show that kind of focus and determination all season long on a consistent basis, we might have the makings of a superstar.
However, the truth is, the Chiefs were also exposed in several ways. Well, "exposed" isn't the right word to use. It's more appropriate to say that the Chiefs showed their true colors in certain ways that only started to come to light when they started losing games. Some can be fixed this season and some can be fixed after the season. We just have to remind ourselves that we're not out of the rebuild just yet and that we only had so many opportunities last offseason to fix the multiple problems that existed. Here are some of those things that really stood out to me:

Depth: When a good team like the Steelers (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/nfl/teams/pittsburgh-steelers) loses a player to injury, they have a player on the bench that could probably compete for a starting position on most teams. That's what happens when you consistently make good personnel decisions via free agency or the draft. When the Chiefs lose players, they have to draw from a much shallower pool of talent. That's not uncommon for a team just starting to find their groove from a personnel standpoint. You can't build a 53-player deep roster in just 2-3 years. The Chiefs really suffered from losing Kendrick Lewis (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/nfl/players/109203/kendrick-lewis) and Jon McGraw (http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/nfl/players/1486/jon-mcgraw) and it's a big reason why the Chiefs got annihilated in the deep passing game. I wonder if we are also starting to see some small signs of fatigue.
Matt Cassel (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/1659/matt-cassel): I know the general sentiment is that Matt Cassel had a pretty good game against Denver. Not from my perspective. I don't care what his final numbers say or how well he passed against a prevent defense. What Cassel did in the second half validates what I already like about Cassel as a player and a person: he's a warrior who plays with a great deal of passion. The problem is, Cassel proved yet again that he's difficult to rely on when the team needs him most. Yet again, Cassel was extremely ineffective on 3rd downs. He single-handedly killed the first 4 drives by throwing one pass 5 yards over Charles' head, overthrowing an open Chambers, taking a coverage sack instead of throwing the ball away (forcing a longer 52-yard missed field goal), and then fumbling the ball and giving the Broncos an easy 7 points. Here's why I bring Cassel up: the Chiefs have gotten away with brutally slow starts and horrible finishes on offense all season long, largely because the defense has bailed them out. Cassel is a 50% passer in the first quarter and a 41.7% passer in the 4th Quarter when the game is within 7 points (http://www.nfl.com/players/mattcassel/situationalstats?id=CAS541133). Yikes. As the Chiefs play tougher teams, particularly in the playoffs, the Chiefs aren't going anywhere if they take a full quarter to get going and if they are that lackluster late in a close game. If this is Cassel's team, he needs to demonstrate leadership by proving to the team that he can produce when they need him the most. To me, at 14-0, the defense was crying for help. At 21-0, the defense was begging for help. In those situations, of course the defense is to blame, but a true leader does not miss the kinds of plays Cassel missed.
Clear Gaps at Skill Positions: I don't think the Chiefs have overly glaring holes at key positions like Nose Tackle and a pass rushing OLB outside of Tamba Hali (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/2371/tamba-hali), but they are glaring enough to limit the Chiefs from reaching their full potential. The Chiefs got swallowed up in the pass rush against Denver and are still several players away from being where they need to be. Once again, for a team trying to build through the draft, you expect to have a few gaps. As the Chiefs continue to draft better and start using their money on marquee free agents, those gaps will disappear. It's something that will limit the Chiefs in 2010, but it's not something that concerns me beyond 2010.
Imperfections and Mistakes: I mentioned it last week when the Chiefs lost to the Raiders (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/teams/oakland-raiders). Of course no team wants to make stupid mistakes, but overachieving teams like the Chiefs absolutely cannot afford to make those mistakes. They are going to win games through flawless execution of the gameplan, sound fundamentals, and mistake-free football. The Chiefs played less mistake-free than what we saw in Oakland, but this is still not the disciplined team we saw play against San Diego.The Chiefs could ride their easy schedule into the playoffs, but they're going to do so through overachievement and in spite of their flaws. So let's enjoy the ride: if they sneak into the playoffs, that's an added bonus. If they miss the playoffs by a few games, then they are what they were supposed to be. Either way, neither scenario should drive Chiefs' fans into a panic (even though it inevitably will).

honda522
11-18-2010, 11:42 AM
That article makes me mad.

N TX Dave
11-18-2010, 12:09 PM
That article makes me mad.

Why does it make you mad? To me it is telling it like it is, we have holes in the team still and the team has made a big improvement over the last three years teams.

tornadospotter
11-18-2010, 12:19 PM
I agree with the article.

70 chiefsfan70
11-18-2010, 12:59 PM
I see how its real easy to go fall apart from these last two games, but I believe in the coaches to step and prepare these guys to take on this easier schedule, and help themselves and pick up some wins in the coming weeks.

The good news is Cassel and Bowe seem to be clicking better, add DMC this week and the running game should be back.

brdempsey69
11-18-2010, 01:10 PM
The article does not mention DMC's absence, which has done more to hurt the Chiefs Offense than many had conceived.

Leave it to Arrowhead Pride to overlook that factor.

matthewschiefs
11-18-2010, 01:41 PM
Don't like what I read there but You can't overlook what this team has done the last two weeks. I just hope that this Sunday we show up and make the Cards pay for blowing one in Oakland and Denver running up the score. We have to show up this week.

Chiefster
11-18-2010, 02:25 PM
I see how its real easy to go fall apart from these last two games, but I believe in the coaches to step and prepare these guys to take on this easier schedule, and help themselves and pick up some wins in the coming weeks.

The good news is Cassel and Bowe seem to be clicking better, add DMC this week and the running game should be back.

I wonder what Crenell's excuse was Sunday? That defense was NOT ready to play. I would hope the coaches would do a much better job.

70 chiefsfan70
11-18-2010, 03:39 PM
I wonder what Crenell's excuse was Sunday? That defense was NOT ready to play. I would hope the coaches would do a much better job.


I'm thinking part of what went wrong was the fact that the Raiders destroyed the Broncos and we shot ourselves in the foot and still hung right in there with the Raiders, lost in OT, But could have and should have won.

And the Chiefs Coaches and Players alike thought this the Broncos game was an easy win,( money in the bank )They just totally underestimated a team that got an asx wuppin and had two weeks to hear about it,The Broncos had nothing to loose.

Its harder for a young team to come out of such a situation and win then an older more experienced team. Bottom line is the Coaches blew this one.

N TX Dave
11-18-2010, 03:47 PM
I'm thinking part of what went wrong was the fact that the Raiders destroyed the Broncos and we shot ourselves in the foot and still hung right in there with the Raiders, lost in OT, But could have and should have won.

And the Chiefs Coaches and Players alike thought this the Broncos game was an easy win,( money in the bank )They just totally underestimated a team that got an asx wuppin and had two weeks to hear about it,The Broncos had nothing to loose.

Its harder for a young team to come out of such a situation and win then an older more experienced team. Bottom line is the Coaches blew this one.

Well the coaches might not have prepaired the team correctly but the players were the ones getting beat on the field not the coaches. The players did not stop the broncos from scoring at will so yes the coaches had a bad game plan but the players should be better than what we saw. Any time a team put up 49 points (7 TD) against you it is a team loss not one player or even one side of the ball but the whole team.

:whipping1: This is what we took last week.

matthewschiefs
11-18-2010, 04:05 PM
Well the coaches might not have prepaired the team correctly but the players were the ones getting beat on the field not the coaches. The players did not stop the broncos from scoring at will so yes the coaches had a bad game plan but the players should be better than what we saw. Any time a team put up 49 points (7 TD) against you it is a team loss not one player or even one side of the ball but the whole team.

:whipping1: This is what we took last week.

agree 100% Players can't let tim tebow to go untouched into the endzone. We got outcoached AND OUTPLAYED.

Digitech
11-18-2010, 04:26 PM
I say the Chiefs will easily beat Arizona.

It's a home game against a shaky opponent. A good opportunity to get back in the right direction.

Chiefster
11-18-2010, 04:59 PM
I say the Chiefs will easily beat Arizona.

It's a home game against a shaky opponent. A good opportunity to get back in the right direction.

I sure hope you're right, however, at this point I don't know if the Chiefs "easily" beat anyone.

honda522
11-18-2010, 05:31 PM
Why does it make you mad? To me it is telling it like it is, we have holes in the team still and the team has made a big improvement over the last three years teams.

Its saying we are the Broncos from last year. We are not the Broncos...we played our hard games first. Looking at our schedule there should be no reason to get less than 5 wins. Wins against Az, Denver, Oakland, Seattle and STL. By Denver we should have DMC, and Kendrick back...and grudge.

N TX Dave
11-18-2010, 05:56 PM
Its saying we are the Broncos from last year. We are not the Broncos...we played our hard games first. Looking at our schedule there should be no reason to get less than 5 wins. Wins against Az, Denver, Oakland, Seattle and STL. By Denver we should have DMC, and Kendrick back...and grudge.

Read it again he is not saying we are the broncos of last year he is stating why we are not the broncos of last year. He is saying we were bound to have one of these games and we may still get into the playoffs but no matter what the rest of the year plays out like the team has met many of the goals for the season already. Then he went on to explain why we are not a "good team" yet as Todd says. We have holes to fill still and he talks about them and tells us fans not to be down about the game because things are looking up.

brdempsey69
11-18-2010, 06:11 PM
Its saying we are the Broncos from last year. We are not the Broncos...we played our hard games first. Looking at our schedule there should be no reason to get less than 5 wins. Wins against Az, Denver, Oakland, Seattle and STL. By Denver we should have DMC, and Kendrick back...and grudge.
.
The games versus Seattle and St. Louis are on the road. I would highly advise against chalking those up in the Win column ( or any game ) until the games are played.

Canada
11-18-2010, 06:17 PM
I dont put too much on this game. We got out as#es handed to us and I hope it wakes these guys up. I think they got used to being good and took wins for granted. Back to reality...last year we got our as$es handed to us by Den and we came baKC the next game and took them apart. A division rival with two weeks to prepare is gonna be tough every time. I think they get their heads straight and take it to the Cards this weekend. Haley should know a thing or two about some of those guys. It sucks that we have lost a couple in a row but we can get baKC on traKC and finish strong. The sky isnt falling yet, we are still tied for 1st in the West.:bananen_smilies046:
:chiefs3:

Canada
11-18-2010, 06:18 PM
.
The games versus Seattle and St. Louis are on the road. I would highly advise against chalking those up in the Win column ( or any game ) until the games are played.

I hear ya, games are gonna be tight for the rest of the year.

wilqb16
11-18-2010, 08:36 PM
Matt Cassel (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/players/1659/matt-cassel): ...In those situations, of course the defense is to blame, but a true leader does not miss the kinds of plays Cassel missed.


How does missing throws make Matt Cassel not a "true leader" this makes no sense.

Yoon is pretty much a Cassel hater so there is no surprise here, but he should at least try to make sense.

Also, he forgets that Cassel actually completed the first 3rd down to Charles, however, Charles was called for illegal motion (bad call IMO) and Chiefs had to redo it. Pass was high cause he got hit as he threw. Ditto on the pass to Chambers.

Remember, too, that Cassel had one of the best 4th quarter QB ratings in the NFL last season...

Otherwise, the article is pretty much no news. I don't think I've heard anyone around here thinking we were going to go 13-3 and shoot through to the superbowl. I think 90% of Chiefs fans realize exactly what he is saying.

In the words of Lenny from the Simpson: "He's thinking what were all saying"

josh1971
11-18-2010, 08:50 PM
I'm just not ready to panic. We are an improved team, and we have more work to do. Water is wet.

We got beat by division opponents on the road. We'll have to see how the rest of the season goes.

Pro_Angler
11-18-2010, 08:57 PM
chiefs blew it!!! they had thier chance..maybe next year... always maybe next year!! I AM SICK OF THIS &^%$$&^$

CapitalT
11-18-2010, 08:57 PM
I dont put too much on this game. We got out as#es handed to us and I hope it wakes these guys up. I think they got used to being good and took wins for granted. Back to reality...last year we got our as handed to us by Den and we came baKC the next game and took them apart. A division rival with two weeks to prepare is gonna be tough every time. I think they get their heads straight and take it to the Cards this weekend. Haley should know a thing or two about some of those guys. It sucks that we have lost a couple in a row but we can get baKC on traKC and finish strong. The sky isnt falling yet, we are still tied for 1st in the West.:bananen_smilies046:
:chiefs3:

I agree with you Canada. We got beat but there is no reason we can't get back on the right TraKC (LOL). Coaches comment, that this team might have needed a beat down .... rings true to me.

This is still a very young team that is doing a lot better than most of us would have guessed before the season started.

I thought the win against SF was impressive. This is still that team. We need to get better but we still have a lot to be proud of.

CapitalT
11-18-2010, 09:13 PM
How does missing throws make Matt Cassel not a "true leader" this makes no sense.

Yoon is pretty much a Cassel hater so there is no surprise here, but he should at least try to make sense.

Also, he forgets that Cassel actually completed the first 3rd down to Charles, however, Charles was called for illegal motion (bad call IMO) and Chiefs had to redo it. Pass was high cause he got hit as he threw. Ditto on the pass to Chambers.

Remember, too, that Cassel had one of the best 4th quarter QB ratings in the NFL last season...

Otherwise, the article is pretty much no news. I don't think I've heard anyone around here thinking we were going to go 13-3 and shoot through to the superbowl. I think 90% of Chiefs fans realize exactly what he is saying.

In the words of Lenny from the Simpson: "He's thinking what were all saying"

Yeah you're right - the writer painted our faults several shades too dark.

Ratings and statistics matter little to me. A quarterback who can find a way to make plays when the team is struggling ... that's the guy we want.

Although he made some mistakes, Cassel showed great character last Sunday. It would have been easy for him to give up on that game but he never did. I've been critical of Cassel, and I may be again, but Cassel's performance was the one bright spot I will take away from that ugly game.

macdaddy123
11-18-2010, 09:25 PM
I think Cassle needs to step up this game and play like a team leadr or he needs to step down, he is single handed going to take us down if he doesn't get with it. The fans will not take another season with him if he looses anymore games like he did in Denver.

70 chiefsfan70
11-18-2010, 09:36 PM
Yeah you're right - the writer painted our faults several shades too dark.

Ratings and statistics matter little to me. A quarterback who can find a way to make plays when the team is struggling ... that's the guy we want.

Although he made some mistakes, Cassel showed great character last Sunday. It would have been easy for him to give up on that game but he never did. I've been critical of Cassel, and I may be again, but Cassel's performance was the one bright spot I will take away from that ugly game.

I would have to agree, Cassel and Bowe were at the top of there game,

I still think this team will step up and play well again, get several more wins and possibly make the playoffs.

wilqb16
11-18-2010, 09:38 PM
I think Cassle needs to step up this game and play like a team leadr or he needs to step down, he is single handed going to take us down if he doesn't get with it. The fans will not take another season with him if he looses anymore games like he did in Denver.

OK - I'll give how exactly is it that Cassel lost us this game in Denver?

CapitalT
11-18-2010, 09:39 PM
I think Cassle needs to step up this game and play like a team leadr or he needs to step down, he is single handed going to take us down if he doesn't get with it. The fans will not take another season with him if he looses anymore games like he did in Denver.

???? Are you for real? ... likely a troll.

No one could possibly believe it was Cassel's fault we gave up 49 points.

Have fun trying egg us on trolly! ... and if you are really a Chief's fan ... what are you smoking?

kckidd8870
11-18-2010, 10:00 PM
N TX DAVE ,YOu are 100% correct.Everything you said is true,even though us Chiefs fans don't want to believe it,but we arent quite there yet.We won a few games and we will win a few more this year.We have way to many holes right now.I love Cassels heart but he isnt the answer.He can't hit wide open targets most of the time,unless there is no pressure on him and he is down by 28 pts.I just don't think he plays well under pressure.We need to find a different QB.We have needs all over the team.Like another WR to compament Bowe.A real play make.Even if Bowe was catching everything ,he needs someone to help him.Besides QB being a huge need,we need some guys on D-fense that can get some pressure on the dam QB.We need a pure pass rusher.Hali can't do it by himself either.We are slowly building a team.We just need to be patient.As much as you want to believe Cassel is the man ,you will soon see he is not.I hope I'm wrong but I have watch him for to years now over throw wide open recievers or throw it at there feet ,when they are wide open.It is true he doesnt have a great recieving group but,it doenst matter he won't get it to them anyway.He has great heart but a lame arm.Good luck Chiefs and be patient Chiefs fans.One last comment I'm not quit sure ole Charle Wies is the right fit either.Only time will tell.

kckidd8870
11-18-2010, 10:21 PM
I remember the play and yes Cassel had alittle pressure on him but come on it's the dam nfl,Cassel Needs to complete them passes.The good QB's do.Quite making excuses for Cassel.You will soon see he is not the QB of the future for the Chiefs.He suck.I don't want to hear about tthe 450 yards passing he had against denver.They were playing loose coverage,after they got a big lead.Cassel has a big heart but a noodle arm.Im not saying they lost becuase of Cassel at all.Denver was on fire.Ive been watching Cassel for 2 years now.He either under throws or over throws his recievers almost every time in a crucial situation.BY the way Canada we make almost evey game tight.It's caused by three things crappy QB and no WR's and not much pressure on the oppents QB.I hope we sneak into the playoffs but we might not do much once we get there.It is alot better than what we had the last 2 years. Go Chiefs. Go Haley

tornadospotter
11-18-2010, 10:21 PM
???? Are you for real? ... likely a troll.

No one could possibly believe it was Cassel's fault we gave up 49 points.

Have fun trying egg us on trolly! ... and if you are really a Chief's fan ... what are you smoking?
It was lack of Defense that gave up all those points. But it was lack of offense in the first Quarter that also allowed this to happen. Be it from type of play calling, or what ever, when we needed a first down, we did not get it. I

CapitalT
11-19-2010, 12:36 AM
It was lack of Defense that gave up all those points. But it was lack of offense in the first Quarter that also allowed this to happen. Be it from type of play calling, or what ever, when we needed a first down, we did not get it. I


I see what you're saying. Our lack of offense gave them more opportunities to score against us. Perhaps this also led to poor morale for the team as a whole.

However I still think, with the way the defense was playing, they would have scored a lot of points against us. We shouldn't expect our offense to score 35 to 40 points to win a game ... it would be nice but ...

Chiefster
11-19-2010, 08:43 AM
...Like Tom Petty.

chiefnut
11-19-2010, 10:55 AM
???? Are you for real? ... likely a troll.

No one could possibly believe it was Cassel's fault we gave up 49 points.

Have fun trying egg us on trolly! ... and if you are really a Chief's fan ... what are you smoking?


why resort to name calling, we are all upset over that loss, but remember we are all CHIEFS fans and all want the same thing, the total destruction of the raders and broncs at ARROWHEAD, a division title, a conference championship, a super bowl victory, the beginning of a dynasty.:chiefs:

70 chiefsfan70
11-19-2010, 11:11 AM
why resort to name calling, we are all upset over that loss, but remember we are all CHIEFS fans and all want the same thing, the total destruction of the raders and broncs at ARROWHEAD, a division title, a conference championship, a super bowl victory, the beginning of a dynasty.:chiefs:

Yep! All of the above.:chiefs:

honda522
11-19-2010, 11:13 AM
.
The games versus Seattle and St. Louis are on the road. I would highly advise against chalking those up in the Win column ( or any game ) until the games are played.
Seattle is a horrible team...even worse than when we played Cleavland.

brdempsey69
11-19-2010, 11:33 AM
Seattle is a horrible team...even worse than when we played Cleavland.

Really? Watch them probably become world beaters when the Chiefs play them up in Seattle.

chiefnut
11-19-2010, 12:17 PM
realistic predictions;
arizona-win
seattle-win
denver-win
sandiego-loss
stlouis-pick
tennesee-loss
oakland-win

that should give us 9-10 wins and the division, after that its a brand new season

wilqb16
11-19-2010, 01:54 PM
.He either under throws or over throws his recievers almost every time in a crucial situation.

Everytime? So I guess those key overtime throws vs. the Bills were all way off target. So was the throw vs. Dallas last year on 4th down to tie the game...Oh yeah and the 4th quarter throw to Bowe to give us the lead vs Oakland (down 4 on 3rd and 11) that was a duck, too.

You are blinded by the fact that you have already made up your mind about Cassel.

No QB makes ever throw perfect. Matter of fact, many of the most memorable throws in NFL history were hardly strikes. Staubach's "hail mary" throw to a wide open Drew Pearson to win the game vs Minnesota in the '75 play-offs slowed him down to a stop (letting the DB almost make a play), "the catch" thrown by Joe Montana was nearly out of the reach of Dwight Clark or what about the culmnination of the drive where John Elways pass to Mark Jackson was in the dirt?

If Cassel had many any of these throws, by your standards, you'd have to rag on him for his lack of accuracy.

The point is that not every throw is going to be perfect, so you can't go on "some feeling" you have about Cassel. If you do that, all you are going to do is focus on any throw he misses as "evidence" to that fact that he isn't any good. This isn't fair since every QB misses throws.

Objectively, here is what the facts are, currently. The Chiefs are 5-4 and doing better than anyone thought they would. Cassel is the 9th ranked passer in the NFL with an excellent rating of 94.5 and a 2nd in the NFL TD-INT ratio of 16-4.
Granted, Cassel's 3rd down passer rating could use improvement but part of this is that 8 of the Chiefs 12 dropped passes have come on 3rd down. The Chiefs overall 3rd down conversion problems are as much a result of a complete failure to convert 3rd and 2 or less on the ground as much as it is Cassel's passing.

Further, this isn't the whole picture. Cassel's 3rd down passing conversion percentage is at 37.8% which granted isn't good (ranking @ 22 in the NFL). You know whose at #20, though? Tom Brady at a nearly identical 39.2%. Guess you'd dump Brady, too. Peyton Manning is only at #15 at 42%. On the other hand, the king of 3rd down conversions this year is Carolina's Matt Moore @ 50%. I guess he is the best QB In the NFL.

Look Cassel is not perfect, but I think the 9th ranked passer rating is pretty accurate for where Cassel sits. You want a different QB, but who? Brady? Manning? Brees? Rivers? Good luck.

How about the other guys like Romo, Schaub or Flacco? Are these guys better than Cassel...probably not, in the same class, yes, but certainly not substantially better, if not lesser...

Keep in mind, too that Cassel has gotten where he is with the benefit of a good running game but - in spite of - arguably one of the worst WR corps in the NFL. BTW - if having a good running game keeps from being a good QB you probably wouldn't want Ben Roethlisburger, either.

Ryfo18
11-19-2010, 01:58 PM
Everytime? So I guess those key overtime throws vs. the Bills were all way off target. So was the throw vs. Dallas last year on 4th down to tie the game...Oh yeah and the 4th quarter throw to Bowe to give us the lead vs Oakland (down 4 on 3rd and 11) that was a duck, too.

You are blinded by the fact that you have already made up your mind about Cassel.

No QB makes ever throw perfect. Matter of fact, many of the most memorable throws in NFL history were hardly strikes. Staubach's "hail mary" throw to a wide open Drew Pearson to win the game vs Minnesota in the '75 play-offs slowed him down to a stop (letting the DB almost make a play), "the catch" thrown by Joe Montana was nearly out of the reach of Dwight Clark or what about the culmnination of the drive where John Elways pass to Mark Jackson was in the dirt?

If Cassel had many any of these throws, by your standards, you'd have to rag on him for his lack of accuracy.

The point is that not every throw is going to be perfect, so you can't go on "some feeling" you have about Cassel. If you do that, all you are going to do is focus on any throw he misses as "evidence" to that fact that he isn't any good. This isn't fair since every QB misses throws.

Objectively, here is what the facts are, currently. The Chiefs are 5-4 and doing better than anyone thought they would. Cassel is the 9th ranked passer in the NFL with an excellent rating of 94.5 and a 2nd in the NFL TD-INT ratio of 16-4.
Granted, Cassel's 3rd down passer rating could use improvement but part of this is that 8 of the Chiefs 12 dropped passes have come on 3rd down. The Chiefs overall 3rd down conversion problems are as much a result of a complete failure to convert 3rd and 2 or less on the ground as much as it is Cassel's passing.

Further, this isn't the whole picture. Cassel's 3rd down passing conversion percentage is at 37.8% which granted isn't good (ranking @ 22 in the NFL). You know whose at #20, though? Tom Brady at a nearly identical 39.2%. Guess you'd dump Brady, too. Peyton Manning is only at #15 at 42%. On the other hand, the king of 3rd down conversions this year is Carolina's Matt Moore @ 50%. I guess he is the best QB In the NFL.

Look Cassel is not perfect, but I think the 9th ranked passer rating is pretty accurate for where Cassel sits. You want a different QB, but who? Brady? Manning? Brees? Rivers? Good luck.

How about the other guys like Romo, Schaub or Flacco? Are these guys better than Cassel...probably not, in the same class, yes, but certainly not substantially better, if not lesser...

Keep in mind, too that Cassel has gotten where he is with the benefit of a good running game but - in spite of - arguably one of the worst WR corps in the NFL. BTW - if having a good running game keeps from being a good QB you probably wouldn't want Ben Roethlisburger, either.

Awesome post, been saying the same thing for weeks now.:postpimp4ib:

Anyone who watches any other quarterback (yes even the Mannings, Brady, etc.) will see bad throws every game. If we went by a lot of people's logic on here, there is no such thing as a good quarterback.

I just got into a discussion with a guy saying the Chiefs should trade for Kevin Kolb...Seriously? People see a couple good games this guy plays and think he's the next hall of fame franchise QB. I've watched Kolb play...he has no pocket presence, is INACCURATE (as evidenced by his career 10/11 TD/INT ratio), and a lot of his game is heightened by the fact that he's throwing to stud WR's like Maclin and Desean Jackson. To sum it up, he's Jay Cutler with less mobility.

Sorry to get off on a tangent, I just was really peeved earlier to see that people have given up on Cassel (for no reason) and are ready to start the experiment over by trading more draft picks (likely a 1st, at least a 2nd) for another QB. The grass isn't always greener on the other side when it comes to getting new QBs. People think a lot of quarterbacks look better than the one we have (because ours is always under the microscope). Bring a new one and the same thing will happen. Kolb was less than impressive in most of his starts I have seen. When it comes down to it, the odds are against us finding the next Brees, Manning, Brady...But Cassel in my opinion is making great strides and is the future of this franchise.

chiefnut
11-19-2010, 02:20 PM
I still do not think cassel will be a great QB nor is he the right QB for the CHIEFS but we can't bash him for his play the last 2 weeks. they were team losses and he would have to been great to pull them out without help from the rest of the team. let's look forward to just making the playoffs/winning the division

OPLookn
11-19-2010, 03:31 PM
Awesome post, been saying the same thing for weeks now.:postpimp4ib:

Anyone who watches any other quarterback (yes even the Mannings, Brady, etc.) will see bad throws every game. If we went by a lot of people's logic on here, there is no such thing as a good quarterback.

I just got into a discussion with a guy saying the Chiefs should trade for Kevin Kolb...Seriously? People see a couple good games this guy plays and think he's the next hall of fame franchise QB. I've watched Kolb play...he has no pocket presence, is INACCURATE (as evidenced by his career 10/11 TD/INT ratio), and a lot of his game is heightened by the fact that he's throwing to stud WR's like Maclin and Desean Jackson. To sum it up, he's Jay Cutler with less mobility.

Sorry to get off on a tangent, I just was really peeved earlier to see that people have given up on Cassel (for no reason) and are ready to start the experiment over by trading more draft picks (likely a 1st, at least a 2nd) for another QB. The grass isn't always greener on the other side when it comes to getting new QBs. People think a lot of quarterbacks look better than the one we have (because ours is always under the microscope). Bring a new one and the same thing will happen. Kolb was less than impressive in most of his starts I have seen. When it comes down to it, the odds are against us finding the next Brees, Manning, Brady...But Cassel in my opinion is making great strides and is the future of this franchise.

People complain about Cassel because just like the President (no this isn't going political) he's the head figure that is on the field and the only one on the field (hopefully) that is touching the ball EVERY offensive play. I'm an admitted reformed Cassel hater. What it comes down to is those that see him as the general and we lose it's Cassel's fault. So there's always something that could have been done better which goes under the always room for improvement.

On the flip side of that we have those that will defend Cassel because they see improvements and it's always the wide receivers fault for not getting "seperation" or the O-lines fault for not blocking better or the backs fault because if they'd have done better they'd be wondering about the run. They don't see that yeah he's good but if all you ever want is good you were reeeeeeally happy back in the days when we made the playoffs every year only to get knocked out. With that said Cassel is making huge improvements this year, he's stepping up into the pocket, he's recognizing defenses and adjusting and calling out his receivers when they make mistakes.

That leaves the edge of the coin where to me you're realistic about things. You know that no one is perfect and realize that for every bad play there's going to be a good play. Has he thrown bad passes absolutely, has he thrown great passes absolutely and a pass that's great to you might be horrible to me. I like to think I'm the edge of the coin but in the small amount of football I play (played in high school and walked on to college and promptly got walked off...) I was always told if you ran the right route and could get a hand on the ball it was a good pass and you should have caught it. If you couldn't get a hand on the ball it was the QB's fault. End...of...story. You can't argue with what I think it's my opinion (copyright pending) and you're welcome to yours.

So there's my two cents on the topic, I'll take my change now.

figcrostic
11-20-2010, 10:05 AM
...Like Tom Petty.

YouTube - Tom Petty - Free Fallin'

chiefnut
11-20-2010, 10:32 AM
people complain because they are frustrated, we had one of the winningest franchises in the nfl but could not win a playoff game, then we nosedive into the depths of despair for 3 seasons now a surprising glimmer of hope only to have it dashed by the despicable pathetic broncos....can you blame yhem

Canada
11-20-2010, 03:04 PM
I don't think 5-4 and tied for 1st in the West is a "glimmer" I think its a pretty good spot to be in going into Week 11 of the season. While it sucks that we lost to the Donx, I think its a little fu#ked that peoples hope in the season has been dashed.

brdempsey69
11-20-2010, 06:37 PM
youtube video

Hey figcrostic, unfortunately, the Chiefs pass defense as of late has more resembled these guys:


YouTube - Devo - Whip It (Video)

figcrostic
11-20-2010, 08:26 PM
Hey figcrostic, unfortunately, the Chiefs pass defense as of late has more resembled these guys:


YouTube - Devo - Whip It (Video) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIEVqFB4WUo)

LOL I think you mean


YouTube - Ray LaMontagne - Trouble [Live]

Boxermm187
11-20-2010, 09:14 PM
I am going to laugh when the chiefs turn things around and all these negative people are going to jump back on to the band wagon. rebuilding season and a winning record says a lot. coming off some terrible seasons, there should be some more support. take it one game at a time. this coulda, woulda, shoulda is really getting old. go chiefs!!!

Canada
11-20-2010, 09:29 PM
I am going to laugh when the chiefs turn things around and all these negative people are going to jump back on to the band wagon. rebuilding season and a winning record says a lot. coming off some terrible seasons, there should be some more support. take it one game at a time. this coulda, woulda, shoulda is really getting old. go chiefs!!!

Get used to it man, its a weekly thing around here!! :bananen_smilies046:

Boxermm187
11-20-2010, 09:49 PM
Get used to it man, its a weekly thing around here!! :bananen_smilies046:
yeah, i guess we just have to dwell on every loss just to have something to b@%@# about.

Chiefster
11-21-2010, 12:32 AM
I am going to laugh when the chiefs turn things around and all these negative people are going to jump back on to the band wagon. rebuilding season and a winning record says a lot. coming off some terrible seasons, there should be some more support. take it one game at a time. this coulda, woulda, shoulda is really getting old. go chiefs!!!


This is a good point. I just mentioned Tom Petty because the title of the thread reminded me of the song. :bananen_smilies046:

Boxermm187
11-21-2010, 02:06 AM
This is a good point. I just mentioned Tom Petty because the title of the thread reminded me of the song. :bananen_smilies046:
LOL!:toast2:

Bike
11-21-2010, 06:21 AM
I am going to laugh when the chiefs turn things around and all these negative people are going to jump back on to the band wagon. rebuilding season and a winning record says a lot. coming off some terrible seasons, there should be some more support. take it one game at a time. this coulda, woulda, shoulda is really getting old. go chiefs!!!
We are no doubt going through some growing pains. I'm not trying to be negative here, but we have lost 4 of our last 6 games. And the rest of the AFC west is starting to win games. We need to get this thing turned around. Now.:smile

Canada
11-21-2010, 07:29 AM
We are no doubt going through some growing pains. I'm not trying to be negative here, but we have lost 4 of our last 6 games. And the rest of the AFC west is starting to win games. We need to get this thing turned around. Now.:smile

We have won 5 out of the last 9 games and we have been blown out once. These guys are on the fringe but they gotta close out games. We will get straight against the Cards at home. Its the road games that worry me the most. If we can win next week in Seattle then I will feel much better about the rest of our season. :bananen_smilies046:

pbatrucker
11-21-2010, 09:30 AM
Hey figcrostic, unfortunately, the Chiefs pass defense as of late has more resembled these guys:


YouTube - Devo - Whip It (Video) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIEVqFB4WUo)

You do realize that Kendrick Lewis has missed three games and we have lost all three.
He lines up 20 yds deep and covers every thing deep and the other guys stack 8 and 9 in the box against the run. We don't have another saftey they can do that with.

brdempsey69
11-21-2010, 11:40 AM
You do realize that Kendrick Lewis has missed three games and we have lost all three.
He lines up 20 yds deep and covers every thing deep and the other guys stack 8 and 9 in the box against the run. We don't have another saftey they can do that with.

Yes, I'm quite well aware of that. That's the problem. The other guys like Flowers & Berry haven't been able to pick up the slack & McGraw has been hurt and there's been no pass rush to help out ( at least not last week ).

In case you don't know it, I watch every one of the Chiefs games and listen to all the audio broadcasts by Mitch Holthus & Len Dawson. So yes, I know what is going on with the Chiefs and that the pass-defense has been about as comical as Devo for a variety of reasons for the last six quarters of play.

chief31
11-21-2010, 01:35 PM
This is a good point. I just mentioned Tom Petty because the title of the thread reminded me of the song. :bananen_smilies046:

Speaking of Tom Petty, let's see if this one fits for the rest of the season.....


YouTube - Tom Petty And The Heartbreakers - I Won't Back Down

Boxermm187
11-21-2010, 08:22 PM
"DOWN FALL".......Not this week. there is going to be an article about how the chiefs are going to win the Super Bowl now. lol game at a time!

N TX Dave
11-22-2010, 04:01 AM
I guess I read the article different than most of you it was not saying the Chiefs were in free fall. It was talking about how far they have come this year and pointing out that there are still areas that need updated and that the team was an improved team which is what most of us wanted at the beginning of the year.

Chiefster
11-23-2010, 07:37 PM
Speaking of Tom Petty, let's see if this one fits for the rest of the season.....


YouTube - Tom Petty And The Heartbreakers - I Won't Back Down (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvlTJrNJ5lA)

I like! :bananen_smilies046:

Seahawkdude
11-25-2010, 01:55 PM
"DOWN FALL".......Not this week. there is going to be an article about how the chiefs are going to win the Super Bowl now. lol game at a time!


Just thought I would say hi to you Chiefs fans and hope for a great game this Sunday. I hope the Chief players bring some earplugs. Although your venue is pretty tough as well!

Canada
11-25-2010, 01:56 PM
Just thought I would say hi to you Chiefs fans and hope for a great game this Sunday. I hope the Chief players bring some earplugs. Although your venue is pretty tough as well!

We are used to it, your stadium is almost as loud as ours!! :bananen_smilies046:

Seahawkdude
11-25-2010, 01:59 PM
Definitely true, we both have the loudest venues in the NFL. Hope its a failr officiated game. We got some head scratchers from Carey last week. And he's usually pretty good.

Canada
11-25-2010, 02:01 PM
Definitely true, we both have the loudest venues in the NFL. Hope its a failr officiated game. We got some head scratchers from Carey last week. And he's usually pretty good.

I think we should match up pretty well (although so far we have not been able to close out games on the road) Should be a good game!! :bananen_smilies046:

ps Welcome to the Crowd!! :sign0104:

Seahawkdude
11-25-2010, 02:02 PM
Thanks! Just FYI our best receiver Williams will probably be out, which will balance out your loss of Flowers and maybe McGraw.

Seahawkdude
11-25-2010, 02:04 PM
Bad for us that your Jones are Charles are healthy and rearing to go. Real bad. Happy Thanksgiving guys, and here's to a good game.:meow::bananen_smilies046:

Three7s
11-26-2010, 01:46 AM
Thanks! Just FYI our best receiver Williams will probably be out, which will balance out your loss of Flowers and maybe McGraw.
Exactly what I thought. When I first heard that Flowers is probably out, my first thought was, "Gonna be a long day for the secondary." With Williams likely out, looks like things even up.

AussieChiefsFan
11-26-2010, 02:05 AM
That article makes me mad.
It's kinda realistic but It makes me mad too. It portrays the Chiefs as a team that is getting NOWHERE

Chiefster
11-26-2010, 09:35 AM
We are used to it, your stadium is almost as loud as ours!! :bananen_smilies046:

They definitely have their own 12th man.