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Coach
11-21-2011, 11:53 PM
This is bad. National tv and they are getting their teeth kicked in. And what's worse is that it is going to get much worse before it gets better. The chiefs will be lucky to win 2 more games this season. I won't be shocked if the chiefs don't win again this season. I'm left asking some very important questions.

Do we have the right coach?
Do we have the right qb?
Do we have the right o.c.?
Do we have the right d.c.?

Right now I would have to say no to all of those questions. I'm sick of getting embarrassed.

What say you?

matthewschiefs
11-21-2011, 11:56 PM
I have been saying for weeks Haley should be shown the door. If the Head coach isn't doing his job witch It's Clear whit the way this team is getting blown out time and time again that he's not then the players are not going to be in a good spot to do there job. It's the coaches job to have his team ready make adjustments so far this season Haley has not done much of either.

70 chiefsfan70
11-21-2011, 11:59 PM
I think the DC is good enough to keep, the rest got to go.

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 12:04 AM
We are playing the worst secondary in the league at the moment, and we don't even try to push them. then we toss into triple coverage. wonderful coaching. I don't expect tons from a bad QB, but we shouldn't be in this position. blows

Coach
11-22-2011, 12:07 AM
I think the DC is good enough to keep, the rest got to go.
Really? Check the past scores of the chiefs games this year?
Kansas City Chiefs - Schedule - NFL - Yahoo! Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/teams/kan/schedule)

Outside of the raiders game when they faced two qb's who hadn't played all season, the chiefs have given up at least 17 points per game. Having given up 40+ points on multiple occasions.

Of all the positions I mentioned, dc is our strongest and it is still suspect at best.

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 12:17 AM
I think the DC is good enough to keep, the rest got to go.
You're nuts. We can't pressure a QB to save our lives. We did better tonight than any time this year, and we're getting out butts handed to us.

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 12:39 AM
That Sucked! Can't even tackle!

70 chiefsfan70
11-22-2011, 12:41 AM
You're nuts. We can't pressure a QB to save our lives. We did better tonight than any time this year, and we're getting out butts handed to us.

Nope not NUTS, just optimistic! Our D is not playing to their full potential. Why would they break their backs just to loose, they spent far too much time on the field. Even if they only allow 4 points they still loose.They know its no use. Even GREAT defenses won't win games,when offenses don't score. and did I mention I'm not "NUTS":D

KCdrummer
11-22-2011, 12:44 AM
You're nuts. We can't pressure a QB to save our lives. We did better tonight than any time this year, and we're getting out butts handed to us.

Are you kidding me we sacked Brady quite a bit.

chief31
11-22-2011, 12:45 AM
Nope not NUTS, just optimistic! Our D is not playing to their full potential. Why would they break their backs just to loose, they spent far too much time on the field. Even if they only allow 4 points they still loose.They know its no use. Even GREAT defenses won't win games,when offenses don't score. and did I mention I'm not "NUTS":D

That's just not true.

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 12:56 AM
Are you kidding me we sacked Brady quite a bit.
We had 9 sacks coming into this game. and sacked him tiwce in the first quarter. maybe there was a 3rd I missed. after that, it was zero match. you don't give up this many points all season and think it's ok

Ryfo18
11-22-2011, 12:58 AM
We are playing the worst secondary in the league at the moment, and we don't even try to push them. then we toss into triple coverage. wonderful coaching. I don't expect tons from a bad QB, but we shouldn't be in this position. blows

I'm sorry I don't get your post at all...You first get mad b/c they didn't take shots downfield, then cite one time when we tried to take a shot downfield, our backup quarterback making his first ever start throws into triple coverage. And then you go on to blame the coaching?

If anything, it was great coaching not letting Palko take shots down the field. He was extremely inaccurate on any throw > 10 yards.

70 chiefsfan70
11-22-2011, 12:59 AM
That's just not true.


You called me on this: Now show me a team that has allowed an average of less then 6 points per game.

Three7s
11-22-2011, 01:04 AM
You called me on this: Now show me a team that has allowed an average of less then 6 points per game.
Great defenses create their own scoring for the team.

Ryfo18
11-22-2011, 01:11 AM
The defense played well enough to win this game...You can only expect to hold the Patriots back for so long until they make adjustments. The Chiefs should have went into halftime with a 17-10 lead (at the very least). The offense was atrocious.

tornadospotter
11-22-2011, 01:13 AM
Great defenses create their own scoring for the team.
Yes they do.

tornadospotter
11-22-2011, 01:15 AM
The defense played well enough to win this game...You can only expect to hold the Patriots back for so long until they make adjustments. The Chiefs should have went into halftime with a 17-10 lead (at the very least). The offense was atrocious.
But did nothing to help win this game.

KCraised
11-22-2011, 01:31 AM
It's pretty surprising to see people thinking this was going to be a great winning record season. They had a horrible preseason matched with the schedule from Hell. This year was doomed from the get go. I heard people talking about this stretch of the schedule since they posted it. It's really not a shock. I'm personally just ready to get this season under our belts and move onto the next one. They played New England great in the first half...nice to see successful blitzing. So, they have alittle more game footage to build on. Gonna be a long cold winter...

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 01:41 AM
I'm sorry I don't get your post at all...You first get mad b/c they didn't take shots downfield, then cite one time when we tried to take a shot downfield, our backup quarterback making his first ever start throws into triple coverage. And then you go on to blame the coaching?

If anything, it was great coaching not letting Palko take shots down the field. He was extremely inaccurate on any throw > 10 yards.
Great coaching? really. what f'n game were you watching.

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 01:46 AM
I'm sorry I don't get your post at all...You first get mad b/c they didn't take shots downfield, then cite one time when we tried to take a shot downfield, our backup quarterback making his first ever start throws into triple coverage. And then you go on to blame the coaching?

If anything, it was great coaching not letting Palko take shots down the field. He was extremely inaccurate on any throw > 10 yards.
had all game to pick apart a secondary that had issues, and we tossed short passes to the flat. I said tripple coverage is an issue because someone else had to be open, or throw it away. who cares anyway. We're a long way from from being good. Can't wait till sunday night, that should be fun.

azchiefsfan
11-22-2011, 08:43 AM
The first half was pretty good. I was satisfied with what I saw for the most part. I watched the entire first half and could see the writing on the wall after our first drive in the second and only checked back occasionally in the second half. Palko has promise but, after a couple good drives, started looking desperate as he ran for his life. The defense had great coverage and hit Brady several times in the first half, but came out looking like Crennel made ever wrong adjustment in the second half. I still think we could be a good team with an improved OL. But I am still leaning toward the main problem being Haley. I want him to prove me wrong, but each game-even when we win-I see blown opportunities and wasted time.

Three7s
11-22-2011, 08:49 AM
The first half was pretty good. I was satisfied with what I saw for the most part. I watched the entire first half and could see the writing on the wall after our first drive in the second and only checked back occasionally in the second half. Palko has promise but, after a couple good drives, started looking desperate as he ran for his life. The defense had great coverage and hit Brady several times in the first half, but came out looking like Crennel made ever wrong adjustment in the second half. I still think we could be a good team with an improved OL. But I am still leaning toward the main problem being Haley. I want him to prove me wrong, but each game-even when we win-I see blown opportunities and wasted time.
It wasn't that the Chiefs made bad adjustments. The Patriots realized the Chiefs were playing the pass and started using pure power formations to run it down their throats. Brady didn't pass it as well as I thought he would.

Also, don't confuse Palko having promise with the Patriots 32 ranked bend don't break defense. He has no arm, no accuracy, and makes stupid decisions.

azchiefsfan
11-22-2011, 08:54 AM
It was his first game, for heavens sake. Can we try to look at the positives for a game or two before we throw him under the bus?

pojote
11-22-2011, 09:10 AM
I'm from Chile, a very unfootballized (great invented word) country and I know that Crennel did his best on this game. If anyone can tell me how can you pressure the QB (an elite one) all the time and not getting burned, please let me know. In both TD by Gronkowski, our secondary was in place to cover, but they just can't stop him. Who's mistake was? Crennel's for wrong play design? Or Pioli's for not giving suitable players, players that can tackle a TE?

Three7s
11-22-2011, 09:25 AM
It was his first game, for heavens sake. Can we try to look at the positives for a game or two before we throw him under the bus?
There is nothing positive about multiple INT games. You can say I'm being ignorant, but saying Palko was good other than the INTs is like saying the Titanic was good without the iceberg. Bad is bad.

azchiefsfan
11-22-2011, 09:34 AM
Why do you do that 7? Seriously! Do really have such lack of confidence in your beliefs you have to put words in someone's mouth to justify them? Please copy and paste where I posted that PALKO was good. You are the definition of a fair weather fan. You never have anything good to say about this team if we aren't winning. Just wow...

nicfre2011
11-22-2011, 09:44 AM
It looked like Crennel started to actually use some zone blitz packages to get to Brady in the first half - and it definitely looked like that approach rattled Brady.

That kind of goes along with what I have been saying I would like to see from the Chiefs....a defense that has the versatility like Green Bay and Pittsburgh to be aggressive and conservative. My problem with the "bend-but-don't-break" defense that Crennel adheres to is not built to carry an offense...it's biggest responsibility seems to be the hold the opposing offense back just enough to allow the offense to outscore the opponent. What we need is a defense that can create turnovers...force the issue....attack offenses and when needed sometimes carry the team because our offense is in reality a state of disarray.

wolfpack
11-22-2011, 09:52 AM
i think it boils down to hunt being cheap the last 3 years and not getting spending the money on talanted starters and good back ups

kcvet
11-22-2011, 10:29 AM
if the fans stop showing up what happens then???

chiefnut
11-22-2011, 10:43 AM
had all game to pick apart a secondary that had issues, and we tossed short passes to the flat. I said tripple coverage is an issue because someone else had to be open, or throw it away. who cares anyway. We're a long way from from being good. Can't wait till sunday night, that should be fun.

the jets could not exploit that seconary either and they have good coaching but also lack a great QB, and we have to play them as well

figcrostic
11-22-2011, 12:28 PM
We need to put make Gilberry an OLB him and Hali are great at making QB's lifes a living hell. Love that guy!

ps we should have never gotten rid of Jared Allen!!

figcrostic
11-22-2011, 12:31 PM
It looked like Crennel started to actually use some zone blitz packages to get to Brady in the first half - and it definitely looked like that approach rattled Brady.

That kind of goes along with what I have been saying I would like to see from the Chiefs....a defense that has the versatility like Green Bay and Pittsburgh to be aggressive and conservative. My problem with the "bend-but-don't-break" defense that Crennel adheres to is not built to carry an offense...it's biggest responsibility seems to be the hold the opposing offense back just enough to allow the offense to outscore the opponent. What we need is a defense that can create turnovers...force the issue....attack offenses and when needed sometimes carry the team because our offense is in reality a state of disarray.

I think our defense did surprisingly well considering we played one of the best offenses in the league that scores 30 points a game and we threw 3 interceptions.

okikcfan
11-22-2011, 12:49 PM
What were we all really expecting? I mean really, These were the Pats not the Rams, not that the over all out come would have been any better. Palko made mistakes and one would have been kind of a fool not to have expected that. He did not do that bad all in all. He was not great. He completed more passes and put up more yards then an avg game with Cassel at QB. Next week will be no better if not worse. It doesn't take long for the other team to catch on to our game plan. it took the Pats one quarter. What we want and what we really have are two entirely different things. We need to except that and deal with it in the draft and off season.

loyalchief91
11-22-2011, 12:54 PM
I agree with him /\

nicfre2011
11-22-2011, 01:28 PM
I think our defense did surprisingly well considering we played one of the best offenses in the league that scores 30 points a game and we threw 3 interceptions.

Fig,
That's what I was saying...it seemed Crennel went with more zone blitz packages than he usually does. It seems like for the most part Crennel lines up the front in the base and relies on standard rush packages...in this game I think he departed from that type of vanilla front to a more zone blitz attack....defenders crowding the line....tight coverage on the receivers. The zone drop to cover the tight ends seemed to be what hurt us the most. Welker didn't do anything...I think teams are starting to understand to minimize Welker's impact you need to throw off his routes with contact in the first 5 yards...he runs timing and sit-down zone drops. Brady has that internal clock with Welker...and if you get physical with him you can throw Brady off. But now they have their two tight ends that can hurt you over the middle and in medium routes if you focus too much on Welker...that's what was ultimately our undoing.

But I do think Crennel realizes now (albeit fairly late in the season) that it is impossible for us to pressure the quarterback with just Houston and Hali as pass rushers. Jackson and Dorsey get little to no push.....so he is finally understanding he needs to disguise some blitz packages.

chief31
11-22-2011, 01:36 PM
You called me on this: Now show me a team that has allowed an average of less then 6 points per game.

That is not where you were challenged......


Even GREAT defenses won't win games,when offenses don't score.

Would you like me to show teams that have won games without getting any points from their offense?

Would you like me to show you teams who's defense has outscored their opponent in a couple of games?

Those would be in direct relation to where you were challenged.

Are you implying that you meant that they don't win "a lot" of games, but did not clarify?

If so, then would it not be safe to imply that you also meant "When their offense doesn't score A LOT"?

If you are to be taken literally, then all I have to do is show a team that has won two games without an offensive TD to prove you wrong.

And if you were not to be taken literally, then All I have to do is show a team that has won a couple games with a minor offensive contribution.

Both will be extremely easy.

Which do you prefer?

drstandley31
11-22-2011, 01:39 PM
if the fans stop showing up what happens then???
Exactly!

Hayvern
11-22-2011, 01:47 PM
if the fans stop showing up what happens then???
They move the team to another market is what happens. could you see the LA Chiefs?

nigeriannightmare
11-22-2011, 03:34 PM
What were we all really expecting? I mean really, These were the Pats not the Rams, not that the over all out come would have been any better. Palko made mistakes and one would have been kind of a fool not to have expected that. He did not do that bad all in all. He was not great. He completed more passes and put up more yards then an avg game with Cassel at QB. Next week will be no better if not worse. It doesn't take long for the other team to catch on to our game plan. it took the Pats one quarter. What we want and what we really have are two entirely different things. We need to except that and deal with it in the draft and off season.

Mew England does have the leagues worst pass defense. Just sayin.

SIC J
11-22-2011, 04:05 PM
We are playing the worst secondary in the league at the moment, and we don't even try to push them. then we toss into triple coverage. wonderful coaching. I don't expect tons from a bad QB, but we shouldn't be in this position. blows

Wait it's the coaches fault Palko threw the ball into triple coverage? LOL. I'm pretty sure they don't teach that, not even in pop warner. LOL

SIC J
11-22-2011, 04:11 PM
Lets also keep in mind that the Chiefs were in the Pats territory 8 times and only came away with 3 points! I put that on Palko!

Chiefster
11-22-2011, 05:07 PM
This is bad. National tv and they are getting their teeth kicked in. And what's worse is that it is going to get much worse before it gets better. The chiefs will be lucky to win 2 more games this season. I won't be shocked if the chiefs don't win again this season. I'm left asking some very important questions.

Do we have the right coach?
Do we have the right qb?
Do we have the right o.c.?
Do we have the right d.c.?

Right now I would have to say no to all of those questions. I'm sick of getting embarrassed.

What say you?

I was thinking much the same.

70 chiefsfan70
11-22-2011, 05:57 PM
That is not where you were challenged......



Would you like me to show teams that have won games without getting any points from their offense?

Would you like me to show you teams who's defense has outscored their opponent in a couple of games?

Those would be in direct relation to where you were challenged.

Are you implying that you meant that they don't win "a lot" of games, but did not clarify?

If so, then would it not be safe to imply that you also meant "When their offense doesn't score A LOT"?

If you are to be taken literally, then all I have to do is show a team that has won two games without an offensive TD to prove you wrong.

And if you were not to be taken literally, then All I have to do is show a team that has won a couple games with a minor offensive contribution.

Both will be extremely easy.

Which do you prefer?


I was saying our D is not that bad, I think we have nearly the right personel, You thought we should scrap the D (not in thise words though). My point was even the teams with Great D's will loose when their offense only scores 5 points as our offense has in the last 3 games.

winning = 9 or more wins per season
looseing= 7 or more losses in a single season

I was just saying even if our d played their very hardest we would still loose. Even with a great D. I think our D has given up as it seems last night. They played their heart out till they saw the O didn't show up.

#58ChiefsFan
11-22-2011, 06:01 PM
I was thinking much the same.

Haley needs to take risks as coach - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2011/11/21/3279835/haley-needs-to-take-risks-as-coach.html)

Interesting take on Haley from Mellinger

azchiefsfan
11-22-2011, 06:21 PM
As our team sinks into a deeper and darker hole, it is getting harder to find signs of light and life and to argue against the writers premise. I am still on the fence with Haley. He and Cassel are alike in that they both seem to have a lot of upside and have shown streaks of brilliance, then crash and burn. Leaving me to be torn between cautious optimism and rational doubt. I think the biggest question I have as we watch this season burn to the ground is what is Hunt thinking? Is he satisfied and hoping we stay on the wagon, or is he disgusted and wanting to clean house?

#58ChiefsFan
11-22-2011, 07:09 PM
Hunt/Pioli need to bring in a real long term offensive coordinator.

Hunt/Pioli need to fix the offensive line.

Hunt/Pioli must find a QBOTF

Hunt/Pioli need to seriously evaluate this 3-4 failure and put the players we have in a system they can succeed in

Haley/Cassel have one more year regardless.

Chiefster
11-22-2011, 07:35 PM
Haley needs to take risks as coach - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2011/11/21/3279835/haley-needs-to-take-risks-as-coach.html)

Interesting take on Haley from Mellinger

Interesting in deed, and I agree. Haley is a mere shadow of his former self.

chief31
11-22-2011, 08:43 PM
I was saying our D is not that bad, I think we have nearly the right personel, You thought we should scrap the D (not in thise words though).

Not in any words, whatsoever.

I'll tell you what.... You show me which words of mine could ever be interpreted that way. Ok?


My point was even the teams with Great D's will loose when their offense only scores 5 points as our offense has in the last 3 games.

winning = 9 or more wins per season
looseing= 7 or more losses in a single season

I was just saying even if our d played their very hardest we would still loose. Even with a great D. I think our D has given up as it seems last night. They played their heart out till they saw the O didn't show up.

Well, what you meant is not what you said.

I don't challenged what you are saying now. I challenged the initial, highly exaggerated, statement.

I mean, seeing as how The Chiefs have averaged just under 15 points per game, for the year (Disgusting as that is), who would ever guess that you were going off the last three games? All while using 9-7 (a whole season) to mean "win games"?

It doesn't make any sense, so who would assume that you meant it that way?

kcnation
11-23-2011, 01:01 AM
if the fans stop showing up what happens then???



im only going this sunday for the BBQ,then heading out....why go see them bums on the field.


as far as the question

we have no-O.C

our QB-stinks

our head coach is a -JERK

ill keep our D.C.


our front office,owner needs to go out and get some quality players already,this is depressing

2010chiefs
11-23-2011, 01:45 AM
Yup! Not looking forward to games anymore. Unless we pick up KYLE ORTON!

kcvet
11-23-2011, 10:17 AM
They move the team to another market is what happens. could you see the LA Chiefs?

now that's cruel.

okikcfan
11-23-2011, 10:31 AM
Mew England does have the leagues worst pass defense. Just sayin.


This is true but we also had Palko, a guy that has never started an NFL game and has been passed around from team to team since 2007.

70 chiefsfan70
11-28-2011, 11:34 AM
This is bad. National tv and they are getting their teeth kicked in. And what's worse is that it is going to get much worse before it gets better. The chiefs will be lucky to win 2 more games this season. I won't be shocked if the chiefs don't win again this season. I'm left asking some very important questions.

Do we have the right coach?
Do we have the right qb?
Do we have the right o.c.?
Do we have the right d.c.?

Right now I would have to say no to all of those questions. I'm sick of getting embarrassed.

What say you?



I think the statement the DC and the D made last night made against the steelers answered your question about the DC. I know they have given up in recent games but they spent way to much time on the field. right now money would be better spent on new head coach and (or) OC. These play calls are really getting old.

nicfre2011
11-28-2011, 11:42 AM
I think the statement the DC and the D made last night made against the steelers answered your question about the DC. I know they have given up in recent games but they spent way to much time on the field. right now money would be better spent on new head coach and (or) OC. These play calls are really getting old.

I think if the team hired a new head coach, more than likely he would have his own candidates to create a coaching staff...atleast I would hope so. So if that is the case, I am ok with Crennel being let go. He has done a good job teaching the fundamentals of the 3-4 to what was once a largely 4-3 roster. So now that we have the foundation, and the players understand the roles and responsibilities...and have shown they can handle them, I would like to see us find a long term coordinator that can help them take the next step into a consistently top-tier defense.

#58ChiefsFan
11-28-2011, 11:47 AM
Dick Lebeau is about 100 so Romeo could be a long term solution if we can keep him happy.

kcvet
11-28-2011, 12:08 PM
this offense can't score in a cat house

okikcfan
11-28-2011, 05:43 PM
this offense can't score in a cat house

lol, sorry but most of the problem i saw I blame on Palko, just sayin.