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View Full Version : Where's our "elite" coach?



Bike
01-05-2012, 06:06 PM
I was listening to Danny Parkins this morning and he was discussing that Jeff Fisher was NOT interested in either the KC or Tampa jobs, and the fact that these two teams are among the "cheapest" teams in the NFL.. Coincidence?
Miami is putting out all the stops to get Fisher, and have stated that they will not be underbid to land him. Sounds like a team that is hungry for a championship.
Are the Chiefs hungry for a championship? Will Clark ever open up his wallet to get some elite coaches and players to come to KC? Or will he just continue to bring in unproven talent and hope for the best...
Thoughts?

figcrostic
01-05-2012, 06:15 PM
I was listening to Danny Parkins this morning and he was discussing that Jeff Fisher was NOT interested in either the KC or Tampa jobs, and the fact that these two teams are among the "cheapest" teams in the NFL.. Coincidence?
Miami is putting out all the stops to get Fisher, and have stated that they will not be underbid to land him. Sounds like a team that is hungry for a championship.
Are the Chiefs hungry for a championship? Will Clark ever open up his wallet to get some elite coaches and players to come to KC? Or will he just continue to bring in unproven talent and hope for the best...
Thoughts?

Great points..... in before someone says The Cowboys and Eagles spend a ton and aren't going anywhere.

Canada
01-05-2012, 07:06 PM
I was listening to Danny Parkins this morning and he was discussing that Jeff Fisher was NOT interested in either the KC or Tampa jobs, and the fact that these two teams are among the "cheapest" teams in the NFL.. Coincidence?
Miami is putting out all the stops to get Fisher, and have stated that they will not be underbid to land him. Sounds like a team that is hungry for a championship.
Are the Chiefs hungry for a championship? Will Clark ever open up his wallet to get some elite coaches and players to come to KC? Or will he just continue to bring in unproven talent and hope for the best...
Thoughts?

Its probably gonna be a tough go for you once the league minimum cap is in place. Then what will you have to complain about? Did it ever occur to anyone that there may be a plan in place already. That being $33 million under the salary cap might be part of a bigger plan that got slightly derailed by injuries this season?? Im sorry but Im so sick and fu*kin tired of listening to people talk about us being cheap or Pioli is a control freak. Its just useless b!tching and complaining. Like Fig said...there are plenty of teams that spend a ton of money and use up draft picks to take one quick shot at a championship. Look at the Raiders...we finished around the same record but who has a brighter future??

Jrudi
01-05-2012, 07:17 PM
Its probably gonna be a tough go for you once the league minimum cap is in place. Then what will you have to complain about? Did it ever occur to anyone that there may be a plan in place already. That being $33 million under the salary cap might be part of a bigger plan that got slightly derailed by injuries this season?? Im sorry but Im so sick and fu*kin tired of listening to people talk about us being cheap or Pioli is a control freak. Its just useless b!tching and complaining. Like Fig said...there are plenty of teams that spend a ton of money and use up draft picks to take one quick shot at a championship. Look at the Raiders...we finished around the same record but who has a brighter future??


I likey the post! Plus I don't see the big fuss about Jeff Fisher, he had a lot of close to .500 seasons, and 1 SB birth in like 14 seasons with the Titans/Oilers.

The dolphins are taking on the Cowboys mentality of throwing money around because Miami is an "entertainment" market.

They are more concerned about the media and buzz, and that the games should be "Events" rather than a Football Game.

Look at how the Marlins were throwing money at Pujol's, they wanted the buzz!

TopekaRoy
01-05-2012, 07:49 PM
Miami is [pulling] out all the stops to get Fisher, and have stated that they will not be underbid to land him. Sounds like a team that is hungry for a championship.
Sounds like a team with very little talent that is desperate and hoping an "elite" coach can somehow make average players play good, to me. We don't need an "elite" coach. We have "elite" talent.

Great points..... in before someone says The Cowboys and Eagles spend a ton and aren't going anywhere.
You forgot the Redskins. :lol: And don't the Eagles have an "elite" coach?


Its probably gonna be a tough go for you ...

REP!

matthewschiefs
01-05-2012, 08:12 PM
Its probably gonna be a tough go for you once the league minimum cap is in place. Then what will you have to complain about? Did it ever occur to anyone that there may be a plan in place already. That being $33 million under the salary cap might be part of a bigger plan that got slightly derailed by injuries this season?? Im sorry but Im so sick and fu*kin tired of listening to people talk about us being cheap or Pioli is a control freak. Its just useless b!tching and complaining. Like Fig said...there are plenty of teams that spend a ton of money and use up draft picks to take one quick shot at a championship. Look at the Raiders...we finished around the same record but who has a brighter future??

THIS

Didn't we have this argument in the preseason?

The fact is you can spend all the money you want doesn't mean that you are going to win. Rember the Eagles were the "Dream Team" Can't wait to see how they do in the playoffs...... Oh wait.

Anther thing to consider about the whole 33 million under the cap. Did anyone stop to think that a portion of that money isn't just sitting there but it's there to resign our guys that we need to lock up. Bowe and Carr? You have to think ahead and can't just look at spend all we can right here right now. Dallas did that in the uncapped year wanting to host the superbowl How did that work out. Chicago also brought in big talent like Peppers that year. How did that work out. They looked at the right here right now got no backup qb and paid the price. Just because a team has cap room doesn't mean that there cheap. It could mean there thinking ahead.

As for big name coach. It's been reported that we DID TALK TO FISHER. Fisher would have to want to come to KC just as much as we would want to bring him in. And correct me if I am wrong but I think As a head coach in the NFL Fisher has as many rings a romeo. Or you or I for that matter. That's a big ZERO. Just because we would bring in a big name coach also doesn't mean we are going to be winning superbowls left and right. It's happend in many sports. See the redskins.

Bike
01-05-2012, 08:33 PM
Jeez. OK already. I was simply responding to a radio talk show discussion this morning. They were discussing, whether, or not, the Chiefs are willing to do what it takes to win a superbowl - as far as spending the dollars to bring in the talent necessary to do so. Some may argue that we don't need to spend big bucks to get these people here. Some say we do need to spend. Whether you agree or disagree, it is worth discussing. And IMHO, for what it's worth, is, well, we haven't been to a superbowl in 4 decades...

#58ChiefsFan
01-05-2012, 08:38 PM
People like Fishers Magnum PI mustache too much, he is far from elite. Better than average? Probably. Elite? Not a chance.

Bike
01-05-2012, 08:49 PM
Sounds like a team with very little talent that is desperate and hoping an "elite" coach can somehow make average players play good, to me. We don't need an "elite" coach. We have "elite" talent.
This team - with very little talent - humiliated the Chiefs - at Arrowhead - 31-3.

You forgot the Redskins. :lol: And don't the Eagles have an "elite" coach?



REP!
If a team is poorly managed, one can argue that throwing money at high-end free agents is the equivalent to throwing said money directly into the East River. I wasn't suggesting to recklessly spew money at FA's for the sake of filling up the stands. We fill up the stands in KC no matter! Spend wisely, but get the talent we need to get to the superbowl.

okikcfan
01-05-2012, 09:37 PM
So here's a question....What is or who on the market right now would you consider a "elite" Head Coach? And Why?

Bike
01-05-2012, 10:08 PM
So here's a question....What is or who on the market right now would you consider a "elite" Head Coach? And Why?
I'm not suggesting there is an "elite" HC out there. Hence the title of the original post "Where is our "elite" coach". This is the term that was used on the Danny Parkins show this morning. They were suggesting that Fisher was an "elite" HC. I disagree. I will state, however, that he is the best available at the moment. He's got 14 years of NFL head coaching experience, and he did take his team to the superbowl - (lost - oh so close). If I was to call out a couple elite coaches, they would be Cowher, Parcels, Bilechick. And you know the reasons.
I'm not even suggesting we should throw 8 mil/per year at Fisher. I don't think he's worth it. But if one of the other three were available, well, maybe...
If we get Philbin, or keep Romeo, I could live with either one. We'll see. I was suggesting, however, that to compete for the superbowl, we can't continue to have the lowest payroll in the NFL and expect great things. Keep slammin'.

Jrudi
01-05-2012, 10:52 PM
Jeez. OK already. I was simply responding to a radio talk show discussion this morning. They were discussing, whether, or not, the Chiefs are willing to do what it takes to win a superbowl - as far as spending the dollars to bring in the talent necessary to do so. Some may argue that we don't need to spend big bucks to get these people here. Some say we do need to spend. Whether you agree or disagree, it is worth discussing. And IMHO, for what it's worth, is, well, we haven't been to a superbowl in 4 decades...

It's not like we are the only team to have not made a super bowl in a long time....

The Browns and the Lions have NEVER been to the super bowl.

The Jets have had a 41 year span since their last appearance
Minn 33 years
Miami 25 years
Cincy 22 years

Not to mention the Saints just recently made their first appearance recently the had NEVER made it either

Just saying we aren't the only team to go through a long period with no super bowl appearances...

I think we are heading in the right direction through, Better than any of the above mentioned teams.

Bike
01-05-2012, 11:02 PM
It's not like we are the only team to have not made a super bowl in a long time....

The Browns and the Lions have NEVER been to the super bowl.

The Jets have had a 41 year span since their last appearance
Minn 33 years
Miami 25 years
Cincy 22 years

Not to mention the Saints just recently made their first appearance recently the had NEVER made it either

Just saying we aren't the only team to go through a long period with no super bowl appearances...

I think we are heading in the right direction through, Better than any of the above mentioned teams.
I appreciate the response Jrudi. Please don't take this the wrong way - I could care a less about those other teams. I just know its been a loooong freeeeeekin time since we have been there. The Saints took the necessary steps to get themselves to a superbowl victory. I just hope we have the management - or soon aquire the management, and players, to get us a superbowl victory in my lifetime. I say this with a sense of urgency because I'm an old fart.

#58ChiefsFan
01-05-2012, 11:05 PM
Its not just the superbowl drought but the fact we are also #3 on the list of most consecutive seasons without a playoff win as well. Detroit and Cincinatti are both in the tournament this year so there is a chance we could move up on that list as well.

Chiefster
01-05-2012, 11:06 PM
I appreciate the response Jrudi. Please don't take this the wrong way - I could care a less about those other teams. I just know its been a loooong freeeeeekin time since we have been there. The Saints took the necessary steps to get themselves to a superbowl victory. I just hope we have the management - or soon aquire the management, and players, to get us a superbowl victory in my lifetime. I say this with a since of urgency because I'm an old fart.

You've not begun to sniff "old" ya young whipper snapper! :11:

matthewschiefs
01-05-2012, 11:10 PM
I appreciate the response Jrudi. Please don't take this the wrong way - I could care a less about those other teams. I just know its been a loooong freeeeeekin time since we have been there. The Saints took the necessary steps to get themselves to a superbowl victory. I just hope we have the management - or soon aquire the management, and players, to get us a superbowl victory in my lifetime. I say this with a sense of urgency because I'm an old fart.

I think we have a number of the players to get to the superbowl already on the roster. We need a few peaces to the puzzle but I think we are really close to being a contender. It's been a long time since I have been able to say that.

Jrudi
01-05-2012, 11:12 PM
I appreciate the response Jrudi. Please don't take this the wrong way - I could care a less about those other teams. I just know its been a loooong freeeeeekin time since we have been there. The Saints took the necessary steps to get themselves to a superbowl victory. I just hope we have the management - or soon aquire the management, and players, to get us a superbowl victory in my lifetime. I say this with a since of urgency because I'm an old fart.


Haha, I get ya, and I too hope we see a Super Bowl appearance sooner rather than later.

I think our arrow is pointing up, and one big reason the Chiefs don't get as much love in the media is because of our smaller media market. I know the Packers get a lot of love in a small market but they have been a good team since back when Favre was there, the Chiefs are still on their way up.

I listed to ESPN radio every day, and The Scott Van Pelt show tends to quietly give the Chiefs some love every once in awhile. The Co-Host Ryen Russillo covers college football, and raves about how he has loved our recent drafts due to the rich SEC talent we are building our team with like McCluster, Lewis, Dorsey, Berry, Succop, Houston, etc.

I'm liking the way we are building this team, and I really think we are 1-2 players away on either side of the ball to becoming a regular contender.

Oh yeah, and it would be nice to have that Franchise QB and consistent HC but I think we will get it figured out haha

tornadospotter
01-05-2012, 11:17 PM
You've not begun to sniff "old" ya young whipper snapper! :11:
I totally agree that you have not snifft old yet. Just take a sniff of Chiefster, now that is old.:smile

Chiefster
01-05-2012, 11:19 PM
I totally agree that you have not snifft old yet. Just take a sniff of Chiefster, now that is old.:smile


That's because I grew up before there was soap.

Bike
01-05-2012, 11:20 PM
You've not begun to sniff "old" ya young whipper snapper! :11:
I can only wish I was as young as you!! :wheelchair:

Chiefster
01-05-2012, 11:24 PM
I can only wish I was as young as you!! :wheelchair:

...And then you woke up. :lol:

Bike
01-05-2012, 11:25 PM
Haha, I get ya, and I too hope we see a Super Bowl appearance sooner rather than later.

I think our arrow is pointing up, and one big reason the Chiefs don't get as much love in the media is because of our smaller media market. I know the Packers get a lot of love in a small market but they have been a good team since back when Favre was there, the Chiefs are still on their way up.

I listed to ESPN radio every day, and The Scott Van Pelt show tends to quietly give the Chiefs some love every once in awhile. The Co-Host Ryen Russillo covers college football, and raves about how he has loved our recent drafts due to the rich SEC talent we are building our team with like McCluster, Lewis, Dorsey, Berry, Succop, Houston, etc.

I'm liking the way we are building this team, and I really think we are 1-2 players away on either side of the ball to becoming a regular contender.

Oh yeah, and it would be nice to have that Franchise QB and consistent HC but I think we will get it figured out haha
I'm thinking your are correct sir. Getting rid of Haley is a good start. But I said the same thing when we got rid of Herm. Here we go again!

Bike
01-05-2012, 11:26 PM
...And then you woke up. :lol:

I wear quadruplefocals....:punk:

tornadospotter
01-05-2012, 11:27 PM
That's because I grew up before there was soap.
Soap? What is this? New thing to try to figure out. :sAng_scream:

TopekaRoy
01-05-2012, 11:51 PM
Here is my "2 games" theory.

I believe that the Head coach gets too much of the credit or blame when a team does well or poorly. It is my contention that a very good coach can, at best, get you 2 extra wins and a very bad coach can cost you 2 games. Now, this is not an insignificant number. For an average team (8-8), the difference between a good coach and a bad coach can be 6-10 or 10-6. a good team (10-6) with a bad coach can go 8-8 and miss the playoffs.

But I think the biggest factor in how good a team is, is the players themselves. After that, I think the positions coaches, who take that raw talent and develop it in practice everyday have a far greater impact on a teams success than the Head coach does.

Even so, you want to have as good a coach as you can get, but the most important thing is to get the right players, so you have a chance to compete. No coach is going to take a team with 4-12 talent and get them to the playoffs.

Chiefster
01-06-2012, 12:01 AM
I wear quadruplefocals....:punk:

Try quintuple-focals!

Soap? What is this? New thing to try to figure out. :sAng_scream:

You guys crack me up! :lol: :lol:

Bike
01-06-2012, 12:05 AM
Here is my "2 games" theory.

I believe that the Head coach gets too much of the credit or blame when a team does well or poorly. It is my contention that a very good coach can, at best, get you 2 extra wins and a very bad coach can cost you 2 games. Now, this is not an insignificant number. For an average team (8-8), the difference between a good coach and a bad coach can be 6-10 or 10-6. a good team (10-6) with a bad coach can go 8-8 and miss the playoffs.

But I think the biggest factor in how good a team is, is the players themselves. After that, I think the positions coaches, who take that raw talent and develop it in practice everyday have a far greater impact on a teams success than the Head coach does.

Even so, you want to have as good a coach as you can get, but the most important thing is to get the right players, so you have a chance to compete. No coach is going to take a team with 4-12 talent and get them to the playoffs.
I agree to a point - but you have to admit that it is the HC that decides on the players he acquires for his roster and places on the field. Or has at least a major say in the decision-making. And it is the HC that normally decides who his position coaches will be. If he screws up the draft and/or position coach selections, flubs up game planning, or loses the locker room, I can see a HC being much more demeaning to a team than just 2 losses.

Canada
01-06-2012, 01:03 AM
I'm not suggesting there is an "elite" HC out there. Hence the title of the original post "Where is our "elite" coach". This is the term that was used on the Danny Parkins show this morning. They were suggesting that Fisher was an "elite" HC. I disagree. I will state, however, that he is the best available at the moment. He's got 14 years of NFL head coaching experience, and he did take his team to the superbowl - (lost - oh so close). If I was to call out a couple elite coaches, they would be Cowher, Parcels, Bilechick. And you know the reasons.
I'm not even suggesting we should throw 8 mil/per year at Fisher. I don't think he's worth it. But if one of the other three were available, well, maybe...
If we get Philbin, or keep Romeo, I could live with either one. We'll see. I was suggesting, however, that to compete for the superbowl, we can't continue to have the lowest payroll in the NFL and expect great things. Keep slammin'.I disagree. I will take Romeo Crennel and his 5 Super Bowl rings!! :bananen_smilies046:

dbolan
01-06-2012, 10:13 AM
Its probably gonna be a tough go for you once the league minimum cap is in place. Then what will you have to complain about? Did it ever occur to anyone that there may be a plan in place already. That being $33 million under the salary cap might be part of a bigger plan that got slightly derailed by injuries this season?? Im sorry but Im so sick and fu*kin tired of listening to people talk about us being cheap or Pioli is a control freak. Its just useless b!tching and complaining. Like Fig said...there are plenty of teams that spend a ton of money and use up draft picks to take one quick shot at a championship. Look at the Raiders...we finished around the same record but who has a brighter future??

There is a freaking HUGE difference in being under the cap or at the cap each year VS. over the cap like many others.

The Chiefs are most always way under the cap and need to spend some cash.

TopekaRoy
01-06-2012, 10:34 AM
There is a freaking HUGE difference in being under the cap or at the cap each year VS. over the cap like many others.

The Chiefs are most always way under the cap and need to spend some cash.
The new CBA allows teams to carry over unspent cap space to this year's spending, this year only. It basically gives teams double the cap space. This will allow the Chiefs to go after pretty much anybody they want this year. I think it's a brilliant strategy.

Next year every team has to spend the full salary cap amount. Teams that don't will be "fined" the amount of unused cap space and the MFL Players Association will redistribute that money to players in the form of a "bonus" check, So under spending is no longer an issue with the Chiefs.

Canada
01-06-2012, 11:16 AM
There is a freaking HUGE difference in being under the cap or at the cap each year VS. over the cap like many others.

The Chiefs are most always way under the cap and need to spend some cash.This would have been a great point 2 years ago. Now, not so much. But if you like I can look up a ton of underacheiving teams that have speny their money. The Raiders come to mind.

dbolan
01-06-2012, 11:16 AM
Love it!!

dbolan
01-06-2012, 11:19 AM
This would have been a great point 2 years ago. Now, not so much. But if you like I can look up a ton of underacheiving teams that have speny their money. The Raiders come to mind.

Don;t get me wrong here...I completely realize that teams spend and over-spend while netting little. I do beleive the Chiefs could have been more aggrssive and less "thrifty" over the years and it could have been very helpful.

Canada
01-06-2012, 11:26 AM
Don;t get me wrong here...I completely realize that teams spend and over-spend while netting little. I do beleive the Chiefs could have been more aggrssive and less "thrifty" over the years and it could have been very helpful.Thats years past. Different management and ownership. No relevance in what is going on here now.