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Three7s
03-24-2012, 02:44 PM
NFL Videos: Can the Chiefs win with Cassel? (http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d827d40c5/Can-the-Chiefs-win-with-Cassel)

Yep, another one. :efpge:

toyotapower
03-24-2012, 03:09 PM
I don't think we can win a superbowl, however with our talented roster we will continue to hide his weaknesses just enough to not replace him

N TX Dave
03-24-2012, 03:30 PM
What can I say that is his opinion and only time will tell if he is right or not. Is Matt an elite QB no, is the team good enough to win with him or in spite of him? Other than Manning, who would not even talk to us, who is out there better that we could get right now? Should we have given up all the draft picks it would have taken to move up to get RGIII?

TopekaRoy
03-24-2012, 03:59 PM
I knew this Dukes guy was an idiot as soon as he said "unfortunately, they went after the wrong Peyton." We DID go after Manning.

He starts by criticizing Daboll's record as OC which has gotten better every year--from 32nd to 29th, with a terrible Browns team, to 22nd with a slightly better Dolphins team. Miami's offense continued to improve all last year, going 6-3 in their last 9 games and averaging 25 points per game. So clearly he doesn't know what he is talking about.

He goes on to say that "Cassel hasn't been the same since Charlie Weiss left," which is true, but the Chiefs had a running game when Weiss was here. Last year, they didn't. This year they will.

This exchange says it all.

Other Guy (don't know his name): "They're gonna have weapons."

Dukes: "They had weapons before."

OG: "Not last year."

Dukes: "No, no. When Charlie Weiss was there ..."

So he says Cassell was good when Weiss was there and he had weapons. But he won't be good with Daboll here now that he has weapons, even though Daboll did well with a far worse offense in Miami.

Dukes doesn't know what he is talking about. He probably hardly ever watches the Chiefs because they aren't usually televised on the east coast. He doesn't like Cassel so he ignores past history and the changes that have occurred and gives a biased assessment.

And they start out by showing the Chiefs "Notable Additions" and don't say one word about how those additions are going to affect the team. It's like the Graphics department had no idea what they were going to talk about.

Complete garbage.

KCraised
03-24-2012, 04:43 PM
We might win the division but I don't see him doing much after that. It was cool to see they were attempting to bring someone in that could get the job done but here we are again. I would've made an offer to Orton to be the starter. Oh well, another year with Cassel.

TopekaRoy
03-24-2012, 04:48 PM
I would've made an offer to Orton to be the starter.

How do you know we didn't?

#58ChiefsFan
03-24-2012, 04:49 PM
Now that the O line is improving yes we will win with Cassel.

matthewschiefs
03-24-2012, 06:13 PM
The fact is YES we can win with Matt Cassel there's no NFL rule against it so we can.


Now outside of that Matt Cassel has won a number of games. He will have his weapons back this season and that's going to be a big help. Cassel has 1 AFC west title under his belt I think he's going to get number 2 this year. I no I no some want to point out the teams that he beat were not as good. But He beat teams that Phillp Rivers didn't that year. Would you call Rivers a bad QB? For me this is the make or break year for Cassel. If he can't win now with the talent around him then I think we need to move on after this year. But I think he will.

JPPT1974
03-24-2012, 06:24 PM
Hopefully Cassel will be back to where he was when the team got him a few years ago.

chief31
03-24-2012, 09:22 PM
We took a 2-14 team to 10-6 in two years with Cassel. Simply put, of course The Chiefs can win with Matt Cassel.

figcrostic
03-24-2012, 09:24 PM
This is a make or break year for Matt, we have filled a lot of holes in the FA, we have 3 good wr's, charles and moeaki are back, no todd haley, no lockout etc. If he doesn't come out and look spectacular then he's probably going to be gone, and the Chiefs will be drafting his replacement or possibly picking him up in the FA. Or we could very well see Matt look amazing and signed as our franchise qb for the next 4 or 5 years.

figcrostic
03-24-2012, 09:25 PM
We took a 2-14 team to 10-6 in two years with Cassel. Simply put, of course The Chiefs can win with Matt Cassel.

I think they were referring to a SB or playoff game. Everyone knows we can win with him.

chief31
03-24-2012, 09:33 PM
I think they were referring to a SB or playoff game. Everyone knows we can win with him.

Well, those who played last season improved. We will get three stars back, along with a new draft class from the 11 spot, and a very good group of free agents.

Get in the playoffs, and even Tim Tebow stands a chance to beat The Steelers. Get hot at the right time, and even The Arizona Cardinals can get to The Super Bowl.

But then, I think Matt Cassel is extremely underrated by most. He can definitely throw the ball, when he is allowed to.

Sick Dog
03-24-2012, 09:36 PM
The one thing I can see and everyone should agree is that he will be trying to show the world that he is the guy and there was no need to try to get Manning and for that matter go get Quinn even though it is for back up. He will play with a chip on his shoulder...which I think will work in his favor...this is the year do or die...

figcrostic
03-24-2012, 09:41 PM
Well, those who played last season improved. We will get three stars back, along with a new draft class from the 11 spot, and a very good group of free agents.

Get in the playoffs, and even Tim Tebow stands a chance to beat The Steelers. Get hot at the right time, and even The Arizona Cardinals can get to The Super Bowl.

But then, I think Matt Cassel is extremely underrated by most. He can definitely throw the ball, when he is allowed to.

If daboll builds the offense around Matt like they did in Denver with Tebow Matt will be very successful but if they expect matt to drop back and be Aaron Rodgers then he will fail terribly.

chief31
03-24-2012, 09:46 PM
If daboll builds the offense around Matt like they did in Denver with Tebow Matt will be very successful but if they expect matt to drop back and be Aaron Rodgers then he will fail terribly.

He did a pretty good Tom Brady impression with his first ever season as starter.

Just sayin'...

Three7s
03-24-2012, 09:53 PM
Do I think the team can win with Matt Cassel? If the defense and running game allows him to. Can he go out against a good team that is stopping our running game and wearing down our defense and win? No, in fact, we already saw what happened in our last playoff loss.

figcrostic
03-24-2012, 10:05 PM
He did a pretty good Tom Brady impression with his first ever season as starter.

Just sayin'...

Ok your right he's just as good as Brady my bad!

dennystillchiefs
03-24-2012, 10:36 PM
Dukes never gives the Chiefs or Cassel any love,either does Sapp.But I feel good about this year. As far as Cassel he will be just fine. What else is out there that is much better. beleive there is teams out there that would grab him in a heart beat.If he don't pan out they have Ricky or Quinn .our who knows maybe they will pick up another one in the draft.But for now it Cassel.Go Chiefs

azchiefsfan
03-24-2012, 11:01 PM
I know we can win with him. I also think this is his year to show what he can do. I think his biggest problem last year was Haley. Cassel was clearly upset with the run, run, pass play calling. I think he will make believers out of everyone, even if we struggle and miss the playoffs. It's his show now that Haley is gone. I trust he will step up to the challenge.

figcrostic
03-24-2012, 11:01 PM
Do I think the team can win with Matt Cassel? If the defense and running game allows him to. Can he go out against a good team that is stopping our running game and wearing down our defense and win? No, in fact, we already saw what happened in our last playoff loss.

:bananen_smilies046:

azchiefsfan
03-24-2012, 11:03 PM
Jamie Dukes is going to give his unvarnished opinion, whether anyone agrees or not. It's why I like him. But he has a thing for the "glory teams": Green Bay, New Orleans, New England and Pittsturd. Outside of that, he discounts all else. I don't know if he's the ultimate bandwagoner or he just has blinders on outside those teams.

#58ChiefsFan
03-24-2012, 11:08 PM
Weis built a gameplan around Cassel. Haley tried to force plays on him and Muir was just a bad OC. Daboll will build his scheme based on Matt's ability. You will not see that same crap we have had to endure since Charlie left.

When we make the playoffs this team is not wet behind the ears anymore. They were embarrassed in Arrowhead against the Ravens, now as a team they know how playoff football differs from season games.

Chiefs Will.

N TX Dave
03-24-2012, 11:10 PM
I agree if he does not win this year he should be out! But we can win with him as long as they don't ask him to be something he is not. He is not a gun slinger, he is not a scrambler and he is not a QB that can carry the team with his arm, but he can manage the offense and protect the ball.

chief31
03-25-2012, 12:24 AM
Ok your right he's just as good as Brady my bad!

A bit melodramatic, don't ya think?

Chiefster
03-25-2012, 12:51 AM
In short: yes, the Chiefs can win with Cassel. I hope this helps to clear things up.

matthewschiefs
03-25-2012, 01:00 AM
In short: yes, the Chiefs can win with Cassel. I hope this helps to clear things up.

Thank you for clearing this issue up with such great points. Can't argue with your logic at all :D




When we make the playoffs this team is not wet behind the ears anymore. They were embarrassed in Arrowhead against the Ravens, now as a team they know how playoff football differs from season games.

Chiefs Will.


That playoff game wasn't as bad as the score would make you think either. People don't remember that the Chiefs lead that game till just about Halftime. The Ravens got momentum going into the half and the Chiefs like many 1st time playoff teams before them couldn't get it going back there way. The game got away from them. But they made the Ravens work for it a good part of that game.

Chiefster
03-25-2012, 01:01 AM
Thank you for clearing this issue up with such great points. Can't argue with your logic at all :D ...

No problem young man; just doing what I can. :D

SBV_Eagle_Bull
03-25-2012, 01:21 AM
:chiefs: YES we can win with Matt Cassel, He's a great QB with a tremendous amount of talent. Our CHIEFS will shine this year, and all you haters will forget about the past years when cassel struggled, go CHIEFS

Eydugstr
03-25-2012, 01:47 AM
Yes. We can win with (and not in spite of) Matt Cassel. If anything getting a break from Todd Haley screaming in his face should raise his passing stats an extra hundred yards a game! But I do agree that it's going to be a make or break year for Matt.

The bigger question in my mind is whether or not we'll improve the O-line enough to really dominate or at least put some fear into other teams. Guess we'll get the answer to that one when September rolls around.

#58ChiefsFan
03-25-2012, 09:08 AM
That playoff game wasn't as bad as the score would make you think either. People don't remember that the Chiefs lead that game till just about Halftime. The Ravens got momentum going into the half and the Chiefs like many 1st time playoff teams before them couldn't get it going back there way. The game got away from them. But they made the Ravens work for it a good part of that game.


27 unanswered points is embarrassed.

kcchiefsfan18
03-26-2012, 02:46 AM
Yes.

KCraised
03-26-2012, 09:36 AM
How do you know we didn't?

Well, Topeka, I don't. Guess I was thinking more of an offer that would beat Dallas, but by how Pioli's comments of Dallas making a "very, very, generous offer" to Orton, he must consider Orton overpaided. So, i will correct this for you and say "I wish scott pioli would've offered more than Dallas. I very much doubt he did. I stand corrected.

Bike
03-26-2012, 11:48 AM
There's no reason to think we can't win a couple games with Cassel. Win in playoffs? No.

OPLookn
03-26-2012, 11:53 AM
Well, Topeka, I don't. Guess I was thinking more of an offer that would beat Dallas, but by how Pioli's comments of Dallas making a "very, very, generous offer" to Orton, he must consider Orton overpaided. So, i will correct this for you and say "I wish scott pioli would've offered more than Dallas. I very much doubt he did. I stand corrected.

Yes they made him a very, very generous offer being that they're paying him to hold a clip board. Heck I'll hold a clip board for 3 million a year. Are you hiring?

:lol:

OPLookn
03-26-2012, 11:59 AM
I know we can win with him. I also think this is his year to show what he can do. I think his biggest problem last year was Haley. Cassel was clearly upset with the run, run, pass play calling. I think he will make believers out of everyone, even if we struggle and miss the playoffs. It's his show now that Haley is gone. I trust he will step up to the challenge.

:whipping1: That's what you get for bringing this back up! I had ALMOST forgot it but no...you have to go and rip the band aid off.

:lol:

KCraised
03-26-2012, 02:32 PM
Yes they made him a very, very generous offer being that they're paying him to hold a clip board. Heck I'll hold a clip board for 3 million a year. Are you hiring?

:lol:

No, that's pretty sweet money to not get hit and hold a clipboard. But what qb in the nfl DOESNT want to start???? You think the clipboard is really Orton's preference? I liked our chances this year with Orton, given what was out there. Heck, I liked the idea, regardless! I haven't a clue what we tried to give him, if we even did, but given the organization was more than willing to throw thier hat in the ring for Manning, would tell you they were ready to publicly move on from the Cassel experiment. So, why not give him the opportunity to play here? He has some games under his belt with our HC, he knows the AFC west? It just made sense to come over the top and make him a starter...just my opinion

KCraised
03-26-2012, 03:25 PM
I'm still waiting for my darkside cookies;-D

TopekaRoy
03-26-2012, 04:14 PM
Well, Topeka, I don't. Guess I was thinking more of an offer that would beat Dallas, but by how Pioli's comments of Dallas making a "very, very, generous offer" to Orton, he must consider Orton overpaided. So, i will correct this for you and say "I wish scott pioli would've offered more than Dallas. I very much doubt he did. I stand corrected.

I know you didn't mean we should have promised him he would start. But I'm sure it was made clear that if he outperformed Cassel, he would have a chance to start.

I have no idea what we did offer him, but I'm still baffled by his choice to go to Dallas. I know Romo is injury prone, and makes a lot of bad decisions with the ball, but I still think Orton would've had a better chance to start here.

Maybe the allure of a bigger market like Dallas - FT. Worth, with a chance to play 6 games a year that would be televised in New York, Washington DC., and Philadelphia had something to do with it.

KCraised
03-26-2012, 04:43 PM
I know you didn't mean we should have promised him he would start. But I'm sure it was made clear that if he outperformed Cassel, he would have a chance to start.

I have no idea what we did offer him, but I'm still baffled by his choice to go to Dallas. I know Romo is injury prone, and makes a lot of bad decisions with the ball, but I still think Orton would've had a better chance to start here.

Maybe the allure of a bigger market like Dallas - FT. Worth, with a chance to play 6 games a year that would be televised in New York, Washington DC., and Philadelphia had something to do with it.

Could be right, Topeka. It's actually a debate without having all the info to accurately debate it. Wish we knew what took place around the Chief's negotiation process with him, whatever extent that was.

2010chiefs
03-26-2012, 10:23 PM
I've watched the Monday night game on Halloween against the Chargers over and over again this offseason. It's the only game I have on my DVR. I'm not thrilled about Cassel but after watching that game. I think we can win with him if he has protection. I would rather have Orton but that's all said and done. One more year for Cassel. He has the ability. I just hope it shows up every game.

MissingTBone
03-27-2012, 09:27 AM
There are plenty of qbs that have won Super Bowls that weren't "elite" qbs, but we're good at what they needed to do to move the chains when necessary. With a strong D, and running game we can easily win with Cassel.

figcrostic
03-27-2012, 12:37 PM
A bit melodramatic, don't ya think?

Not at all I've been on here long enough to know how unreasonable you are so no point in debating any further.

chief31
03-27-2012, 01:22 PM
Not at all I've been on here long enough to know how unreasonable you are so no point in debating any further.

You mark me as having said that Cassel is as good as Brady, which I didn't, and then complain that I am unreasonable?

Good one. :D

Three7s
03-27-2012, 10:25 PM
You mark me as having said that Cassel is as good as Brady, which I didn't, and then complain that I am unreasonable?

Good one. :D
This debate will never end.....

You say Cassel=good QB

Me and a few others say Cassel=mediocre QB at best

One way or another, all questions will be answered this season. There's just one thing I want done at the end of next season. If Cassel comes out and has a great season with over 3500 yards and a 25-10 TD/INT ratio, helps win the division, and wins a playoff game, then I'll gladly come out and say he proved me wrong.

If he has a bad year where he throws for less than 2500 yards and has a TD/INT ratio of even or worse, then I want you to come out and say you were wrong and he's crap and it's time to change things

If you agree to it, I won't say another word about Cassel until the season starts.

figcrostic
03-27-2012, 11:48 PM
You mark me as having said that Cassel is as good as Brady, which I didn't, and then complain that I am unreasonable?

Good one. :D


Cool story bro

figcrostic
03-27-2012, 11:49 PM
This debate will never end.....

You say Cassel=good QB

Me and a few others say Cassel=mediocre QB at best

One way or another, all questions will be answered this season. There's just one thing I want done at the end of next season. If Cassel comes out and has a great season with over 3500 yards and a 25-10 TD/INT ratio, helps win the division, and wins a playoff game, then I'll gladly come out and say he proved me wrong.

If he has a bad year where he throws for less than 2500 yards and has a TD/INT ratio of even or worse, then I want you to come out and say you were wrong and he's crap and it's time to change things

If you agree to it, I won't say another word about Cassel until the season starts.

I think Cassel is about an average qb, he's not terrible but he's not remarkable either if we play to his strengths he can have a 2010 esque season

TopekaRoy
03-28-2012, 01:56 AM
I think Cassel is about an average qb, he's not terrible but he's not remarkable either if we play to his strengths he can have a 2010 esque season

I think a 2010-esque season could get us deep into the playoffs this year. With more receiving threats, an improved O-line and a defense that will keep us in a lot of games, he doesn't have to be great, just decent.

There will be no excuses this year. Cassel has to play like he did in 2010 and the Chiefs will be a team to be reckoned with. If he doesn't, show him the door.

I think he can do it.

figcrostic
03-28-2012, 10:50 AM
I think a 2010-esque season could get us deep into the playoffs this year. With more receiving threats, an improved O-line and a defense that will keep us in a lot of games, he doesn't have to be great, just decent.

There will be no excuses this year. Cassel has to play like he did in 2010 and the Chiefs will be a team to be reckoned with. If he doesn't, show him the door.

I think he can do it.

Completely agree this team is actually better then the 2010 team he has no excuses even if Charles isn't at full form we have in my eyes the best backup Rb or the best FB in the league as well.

eggersonian
03-28-2012, 01:16 PM
They can win with Cassel but the wins won't necessarily be because of him. He is quickly becoming surrounded by talent not only in the backfield but Dwayne Bowe is continuing to become a better receiver and hopefully we will see Jon Baldwin emerge as well.

chief31
03-28-2012, 08:22 PM
This debate will never end.....

You say Cassel=good QB

Me and a few others say Cassel=mediocre QB at best

One way or another, all questions will be answered this season. There's just one thing I want done at the end of next season. If Cassel comes out and has a great season with over 3500 yards and a 25-10 TD/INT ratio, helps win the division, and wins a playoff game, then I'll gladly come out and say he proved me wrong.

If he has a bad year where he throws for less than 2500 yards and has a TD/INT ratio of even or worse, then I want you to come out and say you were wrong and he's crap and it's time to change things

If you agree to it, I won't say another word about Cassel until the season starts.

I do not say that he is a good QB. I say that he is not a bad QB, and that he could be a good QB.

And, unless he does just terrible, I am not likely to say that I was wrong, because I don't say that he is a good QB.

Should he under-perform by my expectations, which would be a first for him (Season-wise), then I have no problem seeing him go.

But my stance on Matt Cassel is not that he is good, or bad. It's that I don't know but... he has done pretty good so far.

Hard to be wrong on "I don't know".

However, my expectations for his 2012 would be for him to perform very near to, or better than his 2010.

If he doesn't, then I won't be defending him much.

Three7s
03-28-2012, 08:39 PM
I do not say that he is a good QB. I say that he is not a bad QB, and that he could be a good QB.

And, unless he does just terrible, I am not likely to say that I was wrong, because I don't say that he is a good QB.

Should he under-perform by my expectations, which would be a first for him (Season-wise), then I have no problem seeing him go.

But my stance on Matt Cassel is not that he is good, or bad. It's that I don't know but... he has done pretty good so far.

Hard to be wrong on "I don't know".

However, my expectations for his 2012 would be for him to perform very near to, or better than his 2010.

If he doesn't, then I won't be defending him much.


It seems odd that you go to such lengths to defend a QB you claim to be mediocre, since you say he isn't good or bad.

figcrostic
03-28-2012, 11:25 PM
It seems odd that you go to such lengths to defend a QB you claim to be mediocre, since you say he isn't good or bad.

The funny thing about Chief31 is that we feel the exact same way about Cassel it's an ok qb, and if he has plenty of time, a good OC, and a good run game he's a good qb (which is the sign of being average). Yet he's such a contrarion he always wants to argue with me over slight wordings in my post, he's silly like that. :meow:

TopekaRoy
03-29-2012, 12:08 AM
It seems odd that you go to such lengths to defend a QB you claim to be mediocre, since you say he isn't good or bad.

I really don't think it's that odd. Everyone agrees that Cassel is not an "elite" QB. There are a couple of people who insist that he is a bad QB, but the discussion is not really about how good he is; it's about whether or not he is good enough for the Chiefs to win a Super Bowl, or at least make a deep playoff run.

We all, pretty much, agree on how good he is. Where we disagree is, "how good can the Chiefs be with him at QB?"

I think it's a good debate.

KristofLaw
03-29-2012, 07:38 AM
Can Cassel win for the Chiefs is a better question. We are getting better in a number of areas and could be a very lethal team with the right guy at quarterback. We have Matt Cassel and I have long thought he has the capabilities to lead this team to wins but that hasn't happened very often. This year I hope he takes control and gathers a few wins by himself, that would be an excellent thing to witness.

Yes, I think he can win for us.

chief31
03-29-2012, 11:28 PM
It seems odd that you go to such lengths to defend a QB you claim to be mediocre, since you say he isn't good or bad.

I didn't say that either.

I think Matt Cassel has to potential to be a top-notch QB, or to fizzle out.

He has been around for four seasons. His first year was exceptional, then he had a bad year. He followed that with another very good year, and then looked bad last season.

How anybody can think that they know what kind of QB he is, at this point, is a mystery to me.

The closest I can come to that is to say that he has done well, whenever his situation has not been terrible.

As I see it, he has shown way too much potential to give up on him right now.

hardcorechiefsfan
03-31-2012, 11:07 AM
50/50 chance is the vibe I get from him.

figcrostic
03-31-2012, 08:37 PM
50/50 chance is the vibe I get from him.

He's a 50/50 player. He looks great sometimes and other times her looks terrible, very inconsistent in my book.

bigwigbob
03-31-2012, 10:47 PM
I like Cassel, he is the definition of mediocre. He is a middle of the road QB. Is that good enough to win? Yes. He proved that when surrounded with talent and given the right circumstances he can thrive. He has won 11 games and 10 games in separate seasons.

matthewschiefs
04-01-2012, 12:08 AM
I like Cassel, he is the definition of mediocre. He is a middle of the road QB. Is that good enough to win? Yes. He proved that when surrounded with talent and given the right circumstances he can thrive. He has won 11 games and 10 games in separate seasons.

I agree. I don't think Cassel is a great qb that is going to make the talent around him a lot better then what they are. But if Cassel has good talent around him I think that he can be a really good NFL qb. We are going to have that talent around him this season if no one gets hurt like last season. To me if the talent around him stays healthy and he struggles then he will be looking for a new team.

fairladyZ
04-04-2012, 06:36 PM
a very good read on matt.

http://echointhehead.blogspot.com/2012/04/case-for-matt-cassel.html?spref=tw

slc chief
04-04-2012, 07:56 PM
in a roung about way most of the articles on him say.he is a mediocre qb when he has a good team around him.when some of the team gets injured or things dont workout at first kiss the season goodbye. because matt cassell is not a leader and does not have enough raw talent to overcome such circumstances

TopekaRoy
04-04-2012, 08:22 PM
Good article and I agree, for the most part. With the salary cap, free agency and the draft order, it's not possible to have the best player in the NFL at every position on the team. What you need to do is have the right combination of players that can compensate for each other's weaknesses and capitalize on each other's strengths.

I think the Chiefs have done a good job of putting the right players around Cassel so that he can be successful, given his particular skill set. Give him a good o-line, a powerful running game (like we had in 2010) and a strong defense that will keep games close and he can do very well.

We should have all of that, this year! :D

fairladyZ
04-05-2012, 04:41 PM
not a leader you say huh?

Lilja defends Cassel as Chiefs’ QB - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2012/04/04/3536820/lilja-rides-to-cassels-defense.html)

oh and another good read..

http://kansascity.sbnation.com/2012/4/5/2928221/kansas-city-chiefs-matt-cassel-is-too-good-and-thats-the-problem

slc chief
04-05-2012, 09:10 PM
not a leader you say huh?

Lilja defends Cassel as Chiefs’ QB - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2012/04/04/3536820/lilja-rides-to-cassels-defense.html)

oh and another good read..

Kansas City Chiefs' Matt Cassel Is Too Good, And That's The Problem - SB Nation Kansas City (http://kansascity.sbnation.com/2012/4/5/2928221/kansas-city-chiefs-matt-cassel-is-too-good-and-thats-the-problem)
no not a leader on the field. cassell is not the guy who single handedly will put a team on his back and take a gameover.lets be real here he is just like alex smith,trent dilfer and others. he is asked to manage the game and not make mistakes.

fairladyZ
04-05-2012, 09:22 PM
we will agree to disagree.

Anytime the game needed to be on his shoulders the team has crumbled around him. He can't block for himself and he can't catch his passes.

He put NE on his shoulders plenty of times and even this team plenty of times. 4 games pop into my mind instantly, Titans, Vikings, Seahawks, 49ers. All matt thru the team up on his shoulders and had hell of a game.

Now other games where we needed him to pop into my head. Raiders, Chargers. Well the raiders game i'm sorry but when you run for your life your usually not going to be that great your going to just try to survive. Chargers he actually was throwing the team on his shoulders and made a mistake... **** happens!

Other games like Colts, Texans, Ravens, Raiders by FG both times.... Sorry but matt doesn't play defense people..

jason1981
04-07-2012, 11:09 PM
you all are beating a dead bush. in one way or another yall are saying hes just a mediocor qb. which he is. but yall have different defintions or opinion on midiocor. however u spell it. lol. hes servicable and can at times be good. but to inconsistent. he has good games snd bad games whichis mediocor.

#58ChiefsFan
04-08-2012, 10:31 AM
2012 will determine his mediocrity. Personally I think Haley's playcalling was a large part of that. Daboll already stated he will build a gameplan around his players strengths the same way Weis did when Cassel played decent. His 08 and 10 seasons werent exactly mediocre, 09 and 11 he sucked with Haley and that bum Muir/Haley "calling" terrible plays.

Hang him after week 6 if he can't get it done but until then let the kid play.

nigeriannightmare
04-08-2012, 10:58 AM
Everyone seems to ignore the fact that hes gone thru as many oc's as he has been seasons here in kc. The organization has been inconsistant thus the player has. This argument is old. We will win the west, make a run, but im sure it will be inspite of matt......no haley us gonna be really good for number 7.


HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE! ENJOY YOUR FAMILIES TODAY!

TopekaRoy
04-08-2012, 02:11 PM
2012 will determine his mediocrity. Personally I think Haley's playcalling was a large part of that. Daboll already stated he will build a gameplan around his players strengths the same way Weis did when Cassel played decent. His 08 and 10 seasons werent exactly mediocre, 09 and 11 he sucked with Haley and that bum Muir/Haley "calling" terrible plays.

Hang him after week 6 if he can't get it done but until then let the kid play.

I think you make a very good point regarding Daboll. I mean, he made Matt Moore look pretty good, didn't he? Moore finished the season as the 12 ranked QB in the NFL with a passer rating of 87.1! He lost his first 4 starts but went 6-3 after that.

Cassel is not a rookie and Daboll will have a full off-season to work with him, so I don't expect the slow start that Moore had. I think the Chiefs also have better offensive weapons than Miami did, so that should play in our favor. Plus, both QBs are named Matt! :smile


Everyone seems to ignore the fact that hes gone thru as many oc's as he has been seasons here in kc. The organization has been inconsistant thus the player has. This argument is old. We will win the west, make a run, but im sure it will be inspite of matt......no haley us gonna be really good for number 7.


HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE! ENJOY YOUR FAMILIES TODAY!

If Cassel can put up similar numbers to what he did the year before last (and I think he can) then I think he deserves to share in the credit for a successful offense. No, he's not a great QB, but there are some things he does very well. The key will be to stay away from doing the things he doesn't do well. I think we are set up well for that with the pieces we have in place, and Daboll should be able to get the most out of him.

AkChief49
04-08-2012, 05:25 PM
I think you make a very good point regarding Daboll. I mean, he made Matt Moore look pretty good, didn't he? Moore finished the season as the 12 ranked QB in the NFL with a passer rating of 87.1! He lost his first 4 starts but went 6-3 after that.

Cassel is not a rookie and Daboll will have a full off-season to work with him, so I don't expect the slow start that Moore had.




You're not implying that Moore was a rookie last year?

TopekaRoy
04-08-2012, 08:09 PM
You're not implying that Moore was a rookie last year?

No, I guess I worded that poorly. What I meant was that Cassel has been "the" starter for 3 years, four if you count his last year at NE when Brady couldn't play.

Moore only played in 21 games in his 4 years (out of 64) at Carolina and was even a backup to Chad Henne when last year started.

Instead of saying "is not a rookie," I guess I should have said "is an experienced established starting quarterback."

AkChief49
04-09-2012, 04:56 PM
No, I guess I worded that poorly. What I meant was that Cassel has been "the" starter for 3 years, four if you count his last year at NE when Brady couldn't play.

Moore only played in 21 games in his 4 years (out of 64) at Carolina and was even a backup to Chad Henne when last year started.

Instead of saying "is not a rookie," I guess I should have said "is an experienced established starting quarterback."
Just checking:D

Subversion
04-10-2012, 03:42 PM
I am not a Cassel supporter.
With that being said here is why:

Who was the last quarterback to win a Superbowl that wasn't in the future hall of fame talk or a perennial pro bolwer? Trent Dilfer? He won because of having one of the best defenses ever created on the opposite side.

Cassel is a serviceable quarterback, but I don't think he will ever be able to take us to the promised land (Super Bowl) no matter what the Chiefs put around him. Cassel will give give us winning seasons and a few playoff appearances and at best...actually win a playoff game. Sadly, that is the ceiling for the Chiefs with the Cassel at the helm.

Until the Chiefs actually invest in a franchise quarterback I will always be rooting for my team to "upset" someone instead of knowing they will win. I feel bad for all the players at all the skill positions we have now, I think with our improving defense and home run hitters on offense this team could compare to any team in the league. The quarterback position is our biggest weakness and I feel like we're wasting away some of the best years on a mediocre quarterback nobody will remember.

Chiefs777
04-11-2012, 07:51 AM
I am not a Cassel supporter.
With that being said here is why:

Who was the last quarterback to win a Superbowl that wasn't in the future hall of fame talk or a perennial pro bolwer? Trent Dilfer? He won because of having one of the best defenses ever created on the opposite side.

Cassel is a serviceable quarterback, but I don't think he will ever be able to take us to the promised land (Super Bowl) no matter what the Chiefs put around him. Cassel will give give us winning seasons and a few playoff appearances and at best...actually win a playoff game. Sadly, that is the ceiling for the Chiefs with the Cassel at the helm.

Until the Chiefs actually invest in a franchise quarterback I will always be rooting for my team to "upset" someone instead of knowing they will win. I feel bad for all the players at all the skill positions we have now, I think with our improving defense and home run hitters on offense this team could compare to any team in the league. The quarterback position is our biggest weakness and I feel like we're wasting away some of the best years on a mediocre quarterback nobody will remember.


Subversion, you pretty much summed up my thoughts.

I would rather have Cassel over Thigpen or Huard. But that isn't saying much.

I fear that Cassel will have a decent year by riding on the backs of the team around him, then Pioli will feel Cassel is the man for longer term.

I sincerely hope Cassel proves me wrong by transforming into a great QB, but I don't see it happening.

AussieChiefsFan
04-11-2012, 08:16 AM
I am not a Cassel supporter.
With that being said here is why:

Who was the last quarterback to win a Superbowl that wasn't in the future hall of fame talk or a perennial pro bolwer? Trent Dilfer? He won because of having one of the best defenses ever created on the opposite side.

Cassel is a serviceable quarterback, but I don't think he will ever be able to take us to the promised land (Super Bowl) no matter what the Chiefs put around him. Cassel will give give us winning seasons and a few playoff appearances and at best...actually win a playoff game. Sadly, that is the ceiling for the Chiefs with the Cassel at the helm.

Until the Chiefs actually invest in a franchise quarterback I will always be rooting for my team to "upset" someone instead of knowing they will win. I feel bad for all the players at all the skill positions we have now, I think with our improving defense and home run hitters on offense this team could compare to any team in the league. The quarterback position is our biggest weakness and I feel like we're wasting away some of the best years on a mediocre quarterback nobody will remember.

I've always liked Cassel a lot but I still can't get my mind off of what you're saying here. If Cassel doesn't improve we could, indeed, be wasting our other star player's good years away.

None-the-less I am still rooting for Cassel this upcoming season.

Three7s
04-11-2012, 10:13 PM
I've always liked Cassel a lot but I still can't get my mind off of what you're saying here. If Cassel doesn't improve we could, indeed, be wasting our other star player's good years away.

None-the-less I am still rooting for Cassel this upcoming season.
This is what worries me the most. Hali, DJ, Charles, and several others are in their prime or very close to it. As long as Cassel is here, I think it will be a waste.

2010chiefs
04-11-2012, 11:22 PM
This is what worries me the most. Hali, DJ, Charles, and several others are in their prime or very close to it. As long as Cassel is here, I think it will be a waste.


True and I just hope Crennel and Pioli see it too. Wee need a back up plan and Quinn isn't it.

nigeriannightmare
04-11-2012, 11:45 PM
True and I just hope Crennel and Pioli see it too. Wee need a back up plan and Quinn isn't it.

So u have seen quinn throw, cleveland sucked no qb would have survived there with.the team he was on, never got a shot in denver....how do u know....and why is everyone so quick to dismis ricki stanzi....my ssuggestion is find a hawkeye fan they will tell u what u need to know.

TopekaRoy
04-19-2012, 03:37 AM
Just stop ok. Stop. Reason why he said that is because Quinn didnt prove himself in cle or denver. He wasn't even the second string behind orton in denver

Um, actually he was second string when the season started. Your man Orton wasn't getting the job done there and Elway knew the Broncos weren't going anywhere. The only reason he started Tebow is because their meatheaded fans were screaming for him (and putting up billboards). Elway gave the fans what they wanted; you sell more tickets that way.

I believe Elway wanted to show the fans how bad Tebow was for two or three games, then after they shut up he would have gone to Quinn. Except his plan backfired. The Donks got some of their best defensive players back and the defense started keeping them in the games. Despite being a horrible passer, Tebow was able to make just enough plays with his feet to squeak out a couple of wins, because teams didn't know how to defend a quarterback option offense in the NFL and Elway was stuck with him.

The same thing will happen in New York this year if the Jets get off to a slow start. But this time teams will be ready for him (like the Chiefs were last year) and he will be exposed for what he is.

nigeriannightmare
04-19-2012, 10:34 PM
Just stop ok. Stop. Reason why he said that is because Quinn didnt prove himself in cle or denver. He wasn't even the second string behind orton in denver

Stop what...Brady Quinn has hardly gotten a fair shake evem you have to admit that. Anybody playing behind tebow isnt gonna get a fair shake and since clevelands return to cleveland they have been pretty much the laughing stock of the nfl. So what am i supposed to stop.....being judgemental as you are. Nope i wont stop i dont judge anyone....you are the exception of course.

pojote
04-20-2012, 01:41 PM
Getting back to Cassel.

4 years as starter:

2008 and 2010 good, actually very good (not elite, but very good)
2009 and 2011 poor, below average.

I think the main reason is playbook knowledge. He's not an OC/QB as some elite QB or an offensive system on his own as others. He needs to get familiarized with the offensive system and playbook. On good years he had plenty of time to learn his offensive systems, but on bad years he didn't -OC changed before season started on 2009 and lockout on 2011.

I expect similar results this year as good years and next year draft a franchise QB -Tannehill is not one.

figcrostic
04-20-2012, 04:37 PM
Getting back to Cassel.

4 years as starter:

2008 and 2010 good, actually very good (not elite, but very good)
2009 and 2011 poor, below average.

I think the main reason is playbook knowledge. He's not an OC/QB as some elite QB or an offensive system on his own as others. He needs to get familiarized with the offensive system and playbook. On good years he had plenty of time to learn his offensive systems, but on bad years he didn't -OC changed before season started on 2009 and lockout on 2011.

I expect similar results this year as good years and next year draft a franchise QB -Tannehill is not one.

My main problem with Cassel is he's very inconsistent, hopefully it was just an OC problem. If he can play like he did in 2010 I'd be happy if we signed him to a longer contract but even at 2010 form he's not an elite QB as you stated, we can definetly be good with him but can we be good enough only time will tell. No matter what I say we draft the best QB we can next year and a 4th round or lower QB this year.

OPLookn
04-20-2012, 05:35 PM
My main problem with Cassel is he's very inconsistent, hopefully it was just an OC problem. If he can play like he did in 2010 I'd be happy if we signed him to a longer contract but even at 2010 form he's not an elite QB as you stated, we can definetly be good with him but can we be good enough only time will tell. No matter what I say we draft the best QB we can next year and a 4th round or lower QB this year.

If Cassel could play at or above a 2010 consistency I wouldn't be against signing him as our QB. But that's only if it's at something around $5 million a year which he'd never go for since he's getting 10 to 12 million a year now. After Cassel is done with his contract unless he gets zero interest from other team I expect him to leave. Pioli will let Cassel sneak out of KC quietly and I don't think to many fans around here will have a problem with this. That's just my opinion though, maybe I'm wrong.

figcrostic
04-20-2012, 05:57 PM
If Cassel could play at or above a 2010 consistency I wouldn't be against signing him as our QB. But that's only if it's at something around $5 million a year which he'd never go for since he's getting 10 to 12 million a year now. After Cassel is done with his contract unless he gets zero interest from other team I expect him to leave. Pioli will let Cassel sneak out of KC quietly and I don't think to many fans around here will have a problem with this. That's just my opinion though, maybe I'm wrong.

Actually he's only making 5,455,200 with bonus in 2012, I'd say he's worth that.

TopekaRoy
04-21-2012, 03:48 AM
If Elway saw potential in quiinn he would of yanked orton and put him in. If he wanted to please the fans he would of started tebow at the start of the season

Wrong and wrong!

If Elway had put Quinn in after Orton struggled, the fans still would have been screaming for Tebow and would have turned against the team. He's gotta sell tickets. He put Tebow in to prove the fans wrong and because he didn't think the Broncos would make the playoffs at that point.

At the start of the season Elway was still trying to win the division. You don't pull your starting QB and put your third string QB in unless the starter shows he can't get the job done.

GarH
04-21-2012, 09:30 PM
Cassel will be adequate until Nick Foles get enough experience to take over.

matthewschiefs
04-21-2012, 09:39 PM
The fans there wanted tebow from the VERY BEGINNING and Elway still put orton out there, hell if quinn came in and impressed at camp and preseason he could of been the number 1 guy. The bottom line is he has done absolutely nothing to show that he is capable of doing anything in the NFL

They put Orton out there because they felt that at that time he gave them the best chance to win they started 1-4 Elway decided to put tebow over orton or Quinn out there just because of the fans. When your losing you have to find a way to keep fans coming to games. Quinn never got a real shot to see what he could do with Denver. In cleveland name me the last Qb that really did well there?

TopekaRoy
04-22-2012, 12:41 AM
No he put tebow out there because he was the better option at that time.

Yep. He was the better option to sell tickets for a 1-4 team.

How do you know Quinn wasn't a better QB than Tebow? He only played extensively in one preseason game and he looked pretty good to me. Did you watch that game? It wan't televised in KC, but I watched it online.

Oh, what's the point? You have already made up your mind and won't be swayed by the facts.

matthewschiefs
04-22-2012, 01:03 AM
No he put tebow out there because he was the better option at that time.

Based on what? Tebow looked worse then Quinn in the preseason last year. There were reports that Tebow was dropped to the 4th string. What are you baseing your opinion on your dislike for Quinn?

Bike
04-22-2012, 01:07 AM
More times than not - as the QB goes, the team goes. Therefore, I fully expect the Chiefs to be mediocre - or maybe slightly above - if Cassel is our starting QB. Nothing more.

TopekaRoy
04-22-2012, 06:14 AM
Based on when coaches and gm's are trying to keep their jobs they usually have the best players on the field. When has pleasing fans been apart of any GM's agenda? Its about winning games

You're right. I can't think of a single GM that wants to please the fans. Why would any GM want to please the fans? Who needs to sell tickets when you have TV revenue?

Oh, wait. When you don't sell out a home game, the game isn't televised. Then there is no TV revenue. Oops!

matthewschiefs
04-22-2012, 01:16 PM
Based on when coaches and gm's are trying to keep their jobs they usually have the best players on the field. When has pleasing fans been apart of any GM's agenda? Its about winning games


Fox and Elway were in no danger of losing there jobs any failings they had this past year would have been put on Josh Mcdaniels. It's VERY VERY rare for a gm and coach to lose there job after there first year. They had fans demanding tebow be thrown out there. They figured they were 1-4 not going anywhere they could throw tebow out there lose a couple of games with him looking horrible and say well hes not ready and they could move on. Tebow won and kept winning so they couldn't pull him. Theres a reason Elway said very little good about tebow theres a reason that the first chance Elway got he moved Tebow. He didn't like him. He tried to show fans what he thought of Tebow was true it backfired when they kept winning. Theres a reason Tebow was move to 4th string before the season started. They didn't like him.

pojote
04-23-2012, 10:38 AM
OK. So, Cassel can win in good conditions, but he cannot be our savior.
We don't know if Quinn is good enough, same to Stanzi. Anything else?

jap1
04-23-2012, 09:57 PM
OK. So, Cassel can win in good conditions, but he cannot be our savior.
We don't know if Quinn is good enough, same to Stanzi. Anything else?

One thing you forgot ...

Tyler Palko sucks ...
And Romeo likes Sammiches.

matthewschiefs
04-23-2012, 11:48 PM
This is the bottom line. If brady quinn was an *** kicking fool, if he was a future pro bowler he would be on the field. Yes? Yes!

The bottom line is he can't show if he's a *** kicking fool if he is not given a real chance. He wasn't in Denver

matthewschiefs
04-24-2012, 03:40 PM
Why didnt he get a real chance in denver? Tell me. If HE WAS GOOD THEY WOULD OF PLAYED HIM Matt!


He didn't get a real chance because of TEBOW and the fans going crazy for him.

In the preseason it was Quinn number 2 not Tebow Quinn played much better in the preseason the tebow did. There was 0 reason for them to play Tebow over Quinn football wise. Quinn didn't get a chance because the fans went crazy for Tebow. That's it. There are politics in football to Quinn didn't get a chance to show if he was good or not because of politics.

bricooper78
04-24-2012, 08:00 PM
NigerianNightmare--I am a Hawkeye fan, Ricky Stanzi is in no way, shape, or form, an NFL quarterback. He throws wobbly ducks, underthrows as often as he overthrows, and had a hell of a receiver (Marvin McNutt) to make him look good.... and that's leaving out the running backs. Yea, we won a lower tier bowl game, but for the mental shortcomings (terrible choices, throwing right at the opponent) and the wobbly arm, he will need at least another full year, getting some "clean up" work for a few games, to even have a chance.

I like the kid, but he's honestly no better than Cassel.

nigeriannightmare
04-24-2012, 08:13 PM
NigerianNightmare--I am a Hawkeye fan, Ricky Stanzi is in no way, shape, or form, an NFL quarterback. He throws wobbly ducks, underthrows as often as he overthrows, and had a hell of a receiver (Marvin McNutt) to make him look good.... and that's leaving out the running backs. Yea, we won a lower tier bowl game, but for the mental shortcomings (terrible choices, throwing right at the opponent) and the wobbly arm, he will need at least another full year, getting some "clean up" work for a few games, to even have a chance.

I like the kid, but he's honestly no better than Cassel.

How many game winning drives did he have again......here at luckys in lake ozark they all love him.

bricooper78
04-24-2012, 09:41 PM
Against college teams, which is an apples and oranges difference, we all know that...

but if you must know, I copied the opening blurb on the 2010 (Stanzi's last year) and 2011(Vandenberg's first year starting) Hawkeyes wiki page for you all

2010-->Hawkeyes finished the regular season 7–5 (4–4 Big Ten) and earned a trip to the Insight Bowl against the Mizzu Tigers The Hawkeyes won the game 27–24 and finished the season 8–5.
-------------------------------------------------
2011--->They finished the season 7–6, 4–4 in Big Ten play to finish in fourth place in the Leaders Division. They were invited to the insight bowl again, for the second consecutive year, where they were defeated by Oklahoma Sooners 14–31

Now, it wasn't the same offense, parts were missing, etc... but the coaching is good, and he wasn't the savior people think he is for the Chiefs. I'm not trying to single you out or start a fight, it's just that it makes me insane that everyone loves the kid whos not taken a snap. I'll step off my soapbox now lol

But, aside of the Insight Bowl, same record, same bowl, it wasn't Stanzi, it was the Hawkeye team as a whole.

chief31
04-25-2012, 12:00 AM
This is the bottom line. If brady quinn was an *** kicking fool, if he was a future pro bowler he would be on the field. Yes? Yes!

Where was Kurt Warner prior to Trent Green getting injured in St. Louis?

Where was Arian Foster in 2009?

Why didn't Peyton Hills start in Denver?

Why wasn't Rich Gannon the starter over Elvis?

Why did Larry Johnson start over Jamaal Charles?

Why didn't Tom Brady start over Bledsoe right away?


if he was a future pro bowler he would be on the field. Yes? Yes!

Sometimes not.

chiefsflow
04-25-2012, 05:29 PM
I think Cassel is still our guy, I think he could take us all the way. Look at Smith and the Niners... if he can take them to NFC Championship then Cassle can take us to the bowl!

chief31
04-25-2012, 06:20 PM
The situations where backup qb's come in and become super bowl champions and future hall of fame players happens once in a blue moon

It happens more often than what you were implying.

And he had four fewer losses than Orton did with The Broncos last year. :lol:

Subversion
04-26-2012, 05:12 PM
To sum up this thread. Mostly everyone agrees Cassel isn't terrible, but he's more or less "average" in the league standards.

My argument goes back to: Name 1 team since the Ravens won who had an average or below average qb?

It doesn't matter who the Chiefs draft or put around him, he's just not going to get the job done in todays quarterback driven league.

I don't post that much because I get annoyed with the people who are "Drafting 3,000 offensive lineman will fix everything" Pittsburgh Steelers, Green Bay Packers OL anyone? We need a ELITE qb and playmakers. There is no stability when we have to keep replacing all of our skill positions because built up great talent around a mediocre qb.

I got flamed for being an Eric Berry supporter but he added the dynamic playmaking component to our defense that we need. I wonder which recently successful teams had star safeties.

Matt Cassel will be a regular season hero, we will win 8-12 games because of the people around him. When his contract is up and he still hasn't taken us deep in the playoffs maybe the O'liners will get a change of heart.

Kansas City Chiefs - Stuck in Mediocrity with Cassel at the helm

TopekaRoy
04-26-2012, 05:38 PM
Subversion, nobody is against getting an elite superstar QB. We are just looking at who is available to help the team, this year. Do you think Tannehill or Weeden will lead us to a Super Bowl? The best thing that the Chiefs can do right now is improve the o-line.

You mention that the Ravens won a SB with an average QB. They also had a great defense and a great rushing attack. Jamal Lewis rushed for 1364 yds that year.

The Chiefs could potentially have a great defense and a great rushing attack, this year, just like the Ravens did in 2000. You talk about the Ravens being the exception to the rule. Well, the Chiefs fit that mold perfectly.

If Cassel can't get it done this year with all the weapons he will have, then by all means, let's do whatever it takes to get a great QB, next year. The new QB will have everything he needs to be successful.

If Cassel hadn't gotten hurt last season, or we had a decent back-up QB, (and we also had Charles, Moeoki and Berry) we probably would have won 10 or 11 games. Then who knows what would have happened in the playoffs.

But we aren't getting a superstar QB, this year. It's just not gonna happen. So we do whatever we can to make the rest of the team better.

nigeriannightmare
04-26-2012, 08:52 PM
Cassel is a back up qb. That's really what he is. As a starter hes awfully inconsistent and without a nice running game or easy schedule he cant do anything. All we need is a consistent qb that is smart and can make throws. Someone who can move the ball and not necessarily put points up on the board but can keep the defense off the field and put the opposing offense in bad field position. A qb that can step in and give us 225 Yds passing every game and be consistent.

All im gonna say is wow. If cassel gets us an afc west title, again, and gets us to the afc championship, what will u say. U might be the most pessimistic chuefs i have ever seen. I call a spade a spade but ud complain about a team that goes 14 and 2.

We get it cassel sucks find something new will you please.

nigeriannightmare
04-26-2012, 09:12 PM
If 'ifs' and 'buts' were candy and nuts, we'd all have a Merry Christmas.

Yeah going thru life expecting dissapointment is a much better way to go than hoping someone/thing succeeds.

We just.see things differently.

matthewschiefs
04-26-2012, 09:13 PM
Cassel is a back up qb. That's really what he is. As a starter hes awfully inconsistent and without a nice running game or easy schedule he cant do anything. All we need is a consistent qb that is smart and can make throws. Someone who can move the ball and not necessarily put points up on the board but can keep the defense off the field and put the opposing offense in bad field position. A qb that can step in and give us 225 Yds passing every game and be consistent.

So he's not great with a offense that can't run and is not as good against the tougher teams. I think the same can be said about most qbs.

jap1
04-27-2012, 02:50 PM
"Not as great." No, not good at all. Ratings in the 60's against those teams. Other QB's that have weak running games beg to differ


Aaron rodgers Matt stafford Eli manning Tom Brady Big Ben off of the top of my head, even though ben was hurt a lot this year and in the past phillip rivers

I think the key was the statement MOST QBs. You listed 5, last I checked, that isnt a majority of QBs in the NFL.

jap1
04-27-2012, 09:26 PM
Drew Brees, peyton manning, for much of the season.


No that isn't majority thats pretty much the top ten though.

I agree, if you have an elite QB, then yes, you are correct that you dont need an awesome running game/line. And when there is one available to us without making a Ricky Williams style draft day trade, then I will advocate for us to get him (yes Manning was available, but I truly believe he didnt want to come to us).

Until one comes available, I think Cassel is better than any other options available. I put Cassel in the same class as Matt Ryan/Joe Flacco/Alex Smith/Matt Hasselbeck.

bricooper78
04-27-2012, 10:30 PM
Until one comes available, I think Cassel is better than any other options available. I put Cassel in the same class as Matt Ryan/Joe Flacco/Alex Smith/Matt Hasselbeck.

:bananen_smilies046: Agree 100% He ain't superman, but he can get the job done with a full team in place around him!

bricooper78
04-27-2012, 11:34 PM
dug real quick for reference, this was the closest i found:





2009

On August 24, Rivers signed a 6-year,a $92 million dollar contract extension with the Chargers, with approximately $38 million guaranteed


Yea, Cassel got too much money. There are several of them that are overpaid though, hell, if you ask my grandpa, they're all overpaid whiners LOL

bricooper78
04-27-2012, 11:36 PM
But, this team had 3 build/rebuilds right on top of each other with Vermiel to Herm and to Hailey, there was no sort of structure, we're finally getting these 3 year windows the experts talk about, getting drafted guys in, acclimated, and working.

Cassel wasn't going to win by himself, and with the high turnover, that is sort of what was happening. He isn't that bad, he was a victim of circumstance to quote Curly

TopekaRoy
04-27-2012, 11:40 PM
But, this team had 3 build/rebuilds right on top of each other with Vermiel to Herm and to Hailey, there was no sort of structure, we're finally getting these 3 year windows the experts talk about, getting drafted guys in, acclimated, and working.

Cassel wasn't going to win by himself, and with the high turnover, that is sort of what was happening. He isn't that bad, he was a victim of circumstance to quote Curly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5j8Jioan1w

matthewschiefs
04-27-2012, 11:42 PM
"Not as great." No, not good at all. Ratings in the 60's against those teams. Other QB's that have weak running games beg to differ


Aaron rodgers Matt stafford Eli manning Tom Brady Big Ben off of the top of my head, even though ben was hurt a lot this year and in the past phillip rivers

The names you listed had MUCH better talent around them. Cassel played well in 2010 when the mvp of the offense Charles was healthy and he had Moeaki who was a BIG redzone talent. Take away the biggest weapons of any QB you named and there numbers would also go down.

Cassel isn't to date a great QB. But he can be a QB that is good enough to win given that he has the talent around him. He won in New England he won a year in KC. Cassel most likely won't be a QB that is going to go out and win game after game. But IMO he isn't a QB that keeps you from winning. He Can win a game for you at times just not every week . Given that he has his weapons playing.