Alex Smith (from Niners fan)

[DMH]

I have not looked, but I can only imagine that there has been some furious debates on here regarding Alex since last February. As a devoted life-long niner fan, I might be able to give you a little insight on his play and development. I have seen every snap Alex Smith has taken in a niner uni and most of his final season at Utah. When he first came into league he was lost and team was atrocious. The current Oakland Raiders probably have better overall talent than the niners did then. He had no weapons. No real offensive line. He turned the ball over constantly. IMO he had worse rookie showing that Blaine Gabbert. Under Norv Turner he began to look like competent Qb. Took huge step back when Turner left. Went through injuries and benching under Mike Nolan and was benched again under Mike Singletary. The Smith I saw after Harbaugh took over is a different player. For what its worth, this what KC probably gets with Smith: - Smart QB, used to have horrible turnover issues which seem to have been corrected over time
- Very efficient passer, does not throw many incompletions when he gets into rhythm
- Not strongest arm in world, but not bad.Actually throws pretty nice deep ball, just doesn’t throw it often
- Risk averse, will take sack rather than throw ball up for risky pass.
- No gunslinger mentality whatsoever. Helps avoid turnovers, but rarely comes back from large deficits
- Much better athlete than given credit for, can be fairly mobile
- Has not proven he can win without elite coaching staff, defense or running game
- Tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes
- Very good at learning new systems, had to learn about 7 of them with niners inept OC turnover
- Loves to check down to RB or TE, receivers numbers will probably drop
- Model team mate and will do whatever is asked of him
- Does not have small hands, for what its worth(that was odd rumor that floated for years)

[matthewschiefs]

Thanks for the Input

I'm hoping you might be able to answer this I've asked those bashing Smith over and over again only to have the questioned Ignored but did anyone really play well under Nolan/Singletary at QB? Or would you say the horrid coaching had a big role in the struggles? Just want to get a niners fans view one that actually watched the game.

[DMH]

Thanks for the Input

I'm hoping you might be able to answer this I've asked those bashing Smith over and over again only to have the questioned Ignored but did anyone really play well under Nolan/Singletary at QB? Or would you say the horrid coaching had a big role in the struggles? Just want to get a niners fans view one that actually watched the game.

Sure. The best answer to that is no one played well. The Niners qbs in Nolan/Singletary years were collection of washed up vets, misfits and damaged young players (ie Smith). The best Qbing in that era was Smith with Turner at OC and Shaun Hill (who was actually benched in favor of Smith during beat down in Houston). Worst of both worlds, bad coaching and poor qb play.

[MyManHali]

I have not looked, but I can only imagine that there has been some furious debates on here regarding Alex since last February. As a devoted life-long niner fan, I might be able to give you a little insight on his play and development. I have seen every snap Alex Smith has taken in a niner uni and most of his final season at Utah. When he first came into league he was lost and team was atrocious. The current Oakland Raiders probably have better overall talent than the niners did then. He had no weapons. No real offensive line. He turned the ball over constantly. IMO he had worse rookie showing that Blaine Gabbert. Under Norv Turner he began to look like competent Qb. Took huge step back when Turner left. Went through injuries and benching under Mike Nolan and was benched again under Mike Singletary. The Smith I saw after Harbaugh took over is a different player. For what its worth, this what KC probably gets with Smith: - Smart QB, used to have horrible turnover issues which seem to have been corrected over time
- Very efficient passer, does not throw many incompletions when he gets into rhythm
- Not strongest arm in world, but not bad.Actually throws pretty nice deep ball, just doesn’t throw it often
- Risk averse, will take sack rather than throw ball up for risky pass.
- No gunslinger mentality whatsoever. Helps avoid turnovers, but rarely comes back from large deficits
- Much better athlete than given credit for, can be fairly mobile
- Has not proven he can win without elite coaching staff, defense or running game
- Tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes
- Very good at learning new systems, had to learn about 7 of them with niners inept OC turnover
- Loves to check down to RB or TE, receivers numbers will probably drop
- Model team mate and will do whatever is asked of him
- Does not have small hands, for what its worth(that was odd rumor that floated for years)



Please don't ever leave.

[matthewschiefs]

Please don't ever leave.

Don't know why you would want that what DMH has described is far from the noodle arm Cassel 2.0 you have gone on and on about. Like the risk averse part and the fact that he throws a nice deep ball (but not often) None of which feeds into what you have been saying with the Cassel 2.0 line

[MyManHali]

Don't know why you would want that what DMH has described is far from the noodle arm Cassel 2.0 you have gone on and on about. Like the risk averse part and the fact that he throws a nice deep ball (but not often) None of which feeds into what you have been saying with the Cassel 2.0 line



The description of those points is of a game manager.

[matthewschiefs]

The description of those points is of a game manager.

Mostly

But not Cassel 2.0 which what you have said Cassel wasn't a low risk taker Smith is. Smith can throw the deep ball just doesn't do it often or hasn't with the 49ers maybe he will more with Reid and the Chiefs maybe he won't All I'm saying and mostly all others have been objecting to your thoughts on Smith is the comparing him to Cassel. They have some things in common but that can be said of any NFL QB. Alex Smith isn't Matt Cassel is all most of us who have responded to you are trying to say

[MyManHali]

I have not looked, but I can only imagine that there has been some furious debates on here regarding Alex since last February. As a devoted life-long niner fan, I might be able to give you a little insight on his play and development. I have seen every snap Alex Smith has taken in a niner uni and most of his final season at Utah. When he first came into league he was lost and team was atrocious. The current Oakland Raiders probably have better overall talent than the niners did then. He had no weapons. No real offensive line. He turned the ball over constantly. IMO he had worse rookie showing that Blaine Gabbert. Under Norv Turner he began to look like competent Qb. Took huge step back when Turner left. Went through injuries and benching under Mike Nolan and was benched again under Mike Singletary. The Smith I saw after Harbaugh took over is a different player. For what its worth, this what KC probably gets with Smith: - Smart QB, used to have horrible turnover issues which seem to have been corrected over time
- Very efficient passer, does not throw many incompletions when he gets into rhythm (Not Cassel)- Not strongest arm in world, but not bad.Actually throws pretty nice deep ball, just doesn’t throw it often (Cassel)- Risk averse, will take sack rather than throw ball up for risky pass. (Not Cassel)
- No gunslinger mentality whatsoever. Helps avoid turnovers, but rarely comes back from large deficits (Cassel)
- Much better athlete than given credit for, can be fairly mobile (Cassel, but not a negative)- Has not proven he can win without elite coaching staff, defense or running game (Cassel x100,000,000,000,000)- Tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes (Cassel, sacked massive amount of times in 2008 with a very good Patriots team surrounding him)- Very good at learning new systems, had to learn about 7 of them with niners inept OC turnover
- Loves to check down to RB or TE, receivers numbers will probably drop (Cassel)
- Model team mate and will do whatever is asked of him ( Cassel)- Does not have small hands, for what its worth(that was odd rumor that floated for years)



A lot more similarities than differences.

[MyManHali]

Mostly

But not Cassel 2.0 which what you have said Cassel wasn't a low risk taker Smith is. Smith can throw the deep ball just doesn't do it often or hasn't with the 49ers maybe he will more with Reid and the Chiefs maybe he won't All I'm saying and mostly all others have been objecting to your thoughts on Smith is the comparing him to Cassel. They have some things in common but that can be said of any NFL QB. Alex Smith isn't Matt Cassel is all most of us who have responded to you are trying to say



There are a lot more similarities than differences, look at the post above.

[matthewschiefs]

There are a lot more similarities than differences, look at the post above.

Any difference means he's not Cassel 2.0

And the only thing I disagree with you're comparison is the deep ball. Cassel throws a nice deep ball? His deep balls were not accurate at all they were a tad high which is part of the reason so many got tiped of the wrs hands into the arms of the other team.

As for the elite coaching thing I think you can say the same thing about most QBS. Peyton Manning had struggles in getting wins until Tony Dungy got there in fact the year before Dungy got there he was 6-10 And he never won a playoff game until Dungy got there either. Tom Brady has never won a game without Bill Belichick. Good Coaching helps everyone bad coaching can hurt everyone.

[DMH]

For what it's worth, I actually think Alex in KC is a good fit. KC reminds me a lot of Niners before 2011 season. There is some nice talent on KC thats suffered from poor coaching and rock bottom turnover marred qb play. Solid OLBs. Close to elite level speed RB. Smart coach coming in that can use Smith to his strengths and let defense and running game carry team. Is KC talent equal to niner 2011 level? I don't think so. Niners have top of the line OL and front seven play, but there is some really nice talent there competing in weakest division in weaker of two conferences. Did KC give up too much in trade? Honestly, probably so. However, the market dictates the price for these players. He was by far best option available. Look at what Dallas was forced to pay Romo! Done because there was really no other option. Also, keep in mind he was not run out of SF for poor play. Kap was simply superior talent that could not be ignored. Harbaugh was laughed at for wanting to keep Smith going into 2011.

[matthewschiefs]

For what it's worth, I actually think Alex in KC is a good fit. KC reminds me a lot of Niners before 2011 season. There is some nice talent on KC thats suffered from poor coaching and rock bottom turnover marred qb play. Solid OLBs. Close to elite level speed RB. Smart coach coming in that can use Smith to his strengths and let defense and running game carry team. Is KC talent equal to niner 2011 level? I don't think so. Niners have top of the line OL and front seven play, but there is some really nice talent there competing in weakest division in weaker of two conferences. Did KC give up too much in trade? Honestly, probably so. However, the market dictates the price for these players. He was by far best option available. Look at what Dallas was forced to pay Romo! Done because there was really no other option. Also, keep in mind he was not run out of SF for poor play. Kap was simply superior talent that could not be ignored. Harbaugh was laughed at for wanting to keep Smith going into 2011.

I agree it's a lot like you guys in 2011. You guys had a bum coaching that was killing your team. We had that a year ago our coach couldn't answer why one of the best rbs in the NFL only got 5 carries and was having his game plan on offense laughed at on national tv on MNF. 6 pro bowlers and 2 wins. UGGGGGHHHHH Once you guys got a good coach you have been very very good I hope the same happens in KC. The only worry I would have if I were a niners fan is that Kapernick wasn't a 1 year wonder we've seen before the backup come in get hot keep the job the following year then fade away. Kapernick should be ok but you never know until you know

[DMH]

I agree it's a lot like you guys in 2011. You guys had a bum coaching that was killing your team. We had that a year ago our coach couldn't answer why one of the best rbs in the NFL only got 5 carries and was having his game plan on offense laughed at on national tv on MNF. 6 pro bowlers and 2 wins. UGGGGGHHHHH Once you guys got a good coach you have been very very good I hope the same happens in KC. The only worry I would have if I were a niners fan is that Kapernick wasn't a 1 year wonder we've seen before the backup come in get hot keep the job the following year then fade away. Kapernick should be ok but you never know until you know


Very true. It's never a sure thing. Kap was about as impressive as he could be though. Had bad game in STL and entire team bad game in SEA. On flip side beat Brady in New England in Decemeber (I'm not even sure when last time that happened was). His performance against GB in playoffs ranks as one of the best performances I've ever seen by a qb. The physical gifts are obvious. Needs to know when to put a little better touch on intermediate passes. Thing that sucks is no matter how well he plays, may never have another shot at ring. They have talent to get there again, but in NFL there are alot of good teams. You only get so many chances.

[DMH]

Having Charles touch football 5 times in game is unforgivable. I followed Charles coming up in Texas. Here is terrifying thought. UT had Charles and Vince Young commited. They were also Adrian Peterson's 2nd choice behind OU. If he would have went to Texas, they were planning on running some shotgun looks with Peterson and Charles as two backs flanking Young. Would have been thing of beauty to behold.