Quick thoughts on the game

[Frankenchief]

1- Alex Smith answered a lot of questions today. I thought Aaron Rodgers was wearing 11 for us.

2- Apologies to Alex for Avery (and the rest of the WR group)

3- denver was almost never called for blatant holdings of Hali and T-Jax, and leg whips.

4- After Denver's last TD can somebody show me that "blow to the head" the officials called on us?

5- Cooper is a raw rookie and it showed, but I still think the kid has long term talent.

6- Time to trade Flowers this off season.

7- Not to wish injury on anyone, but Albert's injury might be a blessing in disguise for the Chiefs. Let's start Fishers development there.

8- I badly wanted us to draft Decker when he was coming up. It hurts me double that one of my favorite draft wishes skewered us so bad for the hated Donks.

[matthewschiefs]

Not even going to do one of these I'm just sick of the advantage denver gets every freaking game there O line gets away with soooooooooooooooooooo freaking many hold it does impact the game. The more this season goes the more it bugs me.

[jap1]

I agree with 1-3. I didn't see #4, but don't think it made much of a difference. I hope you are correct on #5.

Completely disagree with trading Flowers. If the GM needs the cap space, then maybe. But I think he is doing quite well. I dont undretand that people want to drop Flowers when we need 3 CBs to go against the Donkeys.

On #7, didn't they put Stephenson at LT when Albert went down? I doubt they would change that up.

[Frankenchief]

Agreed. It's very frustrating.

[Frankenchief]

9- Thank you Tamba Hali. Gimpy or not you are one of my all time favorite Chiefs.

10- Over 3 minutes left in the game, why a quick pass drive?!!!! Why?! Why?!

[brdempsey69]

1-Correct. Alex can throw down the field, in spite of what detractors were saying.

2-WR is clearly an area of need this off-season.

3-One Chiefs fan on facebook said he counted 11 blatant holds that were not called. I'm not buying into any "well, the officials can't see everything" BS. They are seeing it, but blatantly refusing to call it. Same as in '97 and '98.

5-Stupid decision to leave Cooper alone for as long as they did on Decker. Smart coaches dispatch a 2nd defender to double up on Decker and take him out of the game.

6-Agreed. Flowers has seemingly lost it, as of late. Might as well try to get something in return for him.

7-Yes. Starting with practice this week, plug Fisher in at LT and do not look back. It may take a couple of games to adjust, but so what? People were willing to give Albert years to make the adjustment from Guard to LT, whereas Fisher has played LT for years in college.

8-The Chiefs great GM, Pioli, in his infinite wisdom, decided to take a nickel CB ( Arenas ) at #50 in the 2nd round with the pick that the Chiefs got for Tony G. and add to that a nickel CB that many had rated no better than a 4th rounder. Some had Decker rated a mid to late 2nd rounder. To me, that 2010 draft sucked, outside of getting an okay pick in round 5 in Kendrick Lewis.

[azchiefsfan]

I agree with pretty much everything listed. I wrote in our first loss that our defensive collapse in the fourth quarter was troubling. And again, I told my wife last week that our D was in free-fall and I thought we might end up 9-7. I think we MIGHT win Oakland at home and go 10-6. But my gut says we have already won the last game we will win for the season. Let the hate flow, but our D has lost whatever spark they had earlier. We were the #1 defense in the league through the first 9 games. They showed a graphic in-game that showed after our 2 losses, we were down to #15. After this loss, we'll probably drop to #20 or #22. I am glad we had the run we had, but I think from here out we get rolled. Not hating, just being realistic. We can't pressure any QB and we can't cover anybody. Add those 2 things and our chance of winning drops to, maybe, 10%.

[Chiefster]

Officials are going to protect Manning at all costs so the holding will continue for as long as the man plays the game. No ands, ifs, or buts about it.

[matthewschiefs]

Officials are going to protect Manning at all costs so the holding will continue for as long as the man plays the game. No ands, ifs, or buts about it.

Yep

Anther thing that set me off was the drive before the hall when Alex was called for grounding even the Tv annoncers said he was out of the pocket and no ref threw the flag until WELL after the play that was a BS call to help Denver. Denver's going to get help the rest of the year it's just how it is. Just tics me off. I would rather lose then have to get help to win

[Chiefster]

Yep

Anther thing that set me off was the drive before the hall when Alex was called for grounding even the Tv annoncers said he was out of the pocket and no ref threw the flag until WELL after the play that was a BS call to help Denver. Denver's going to get help the rest of the year it's just how it is. Just tics me off. I would rather lose then have to get help to win

You and me both buddy!

[brdempsey69]

Yep

Anther thing that set me off was the drive before the hall when Alex was called for grounding even the Tv annoncers said he was out of the pocket and no ref threw the flag until WELL after the play that was a BS call to help Denver. Denver's going to get help the rest of the year it's just how it is. Just tics me off. I would rather lose then have to get help to win

Same here. I want the Chiefs to win outright on a level playing field. I fully expect the Donkeys to get the officials help in the post-season as well. It's been an established fact for decades that the Donkeys can't win a SB outright on a level playing field, so Pat Bowlen and Turd Elway have once again pulled the same strings with the league office that they did in '97 and '98 to have the playing field tilted in the Donkeys favor. I never want to to see such a thing happen with the Chiefs. At least the Chiefs one SB win is real and not fake like the Donkeys.

[Justin5772002]

1-Correct. Alex can throw down the field, in spite of what detractors were saying.

2-WR is clearly an area of need this off-season.

3-One Chiefs fan on facebook said he counted 11 blatant holds that were not called. I'm not buying into any "well, the officials can't see everything" BS. They are seeing it, but blatantly refusing to call it. Same as in '97 and '98.

5-Stupid decision to leave Cooper alone for as long as they did on Decker. Smart coaches dispatch a 2nd defender to double up on Decker and take him out of the game.

6-Agreed. Flowers has seemingly lost it, as of late. Might as well try to get something in return for him.

7-Yes. Starting with practice this week, plug Fisher in at LT and do not look back. It may take a couple of games to adjust, but so what? People were willing to give Albert years to make the adjustment from Guard to LT, whereas Fisher has played LT for years in college.

8-The Chiefs great GM, Pioli, in his infinite wisdom, decided to take a nickel CB ( Arenas ) at #50 in the 2nd round with the pick that the Chiefs got for Tony G. and add to that a nickel CB that many had rated no better than a 4th rounder. Some had Decker rated a mid to late 2nd rounder. To me, that 2010 draft sucked, outside of getting an okay pick in round 5 in Kendrick Lewis.

Even though I said the officials can't see everything I agree that there were blatant non-calls. But in just don't agree with over exaggerating it saying our team sucks and our season is over. Gotta admit the officials gave us 1 when Avery fumbled though. I think Reid not throwing runs in there with that last drive hurt us bad, even if we scored Manning had plenty of time to get into field goal position. This is the second game where Reid's clock management skills are lacking

[ctchiefsfan]

Hey brdempsey....I can't seem to access rewind now...... "Due to broadcast restrictions, the NFL Game Rewind service is currently unavailable. Please check back later." I know you use rewind.....could you give me a minute counter of blatant non-calls? I'd like to see them, tape them, and send the facts along with a snail-mail letter to the NFL. They need to know that their BS is ruining the reputation of the NFL.

[rodu]

I think I've seen enough of Donnie Avery, both Jenkins and Hemmingway outplayed him. And judging the way Fasano looked like he thought he was in another state, we may be short on TE depth again

[nigeriannightmare]

I think I've seen enough of Donnie Avery, both Jenkins and Hemmingway outplayed him. And judging the way Fasano looked like he thought he was in another state, we may be short on TE depth again

Aj Jenkins had a couple tough grabs, and yac. Hemingway was all over the field we are getting our crap together. We are improving each week offensively. The d needs to get healthy. We were getting pressure today. We are getting close boys. For all those that thought we would go from 2 and 14 to Super Bowl contender in a year need to get a clue. We are gonna end up 11 and 5 and end up Indy or cincy.

But this team is on the right track. Can't wait to see our offseason moves.

[Justin5772002]

Does everyone agree that Alex Smith could be our franchise QB now? He's gone downfield plenty the last few games and would look exponentially better if not for all the drops. I think putting in anyone different barring injury would be a mistake. I too am perfectly fine with Avery losing the starting role. He hurts more then he helps. I'm almost positive we lost this game because Jamaal Charles didn't get any touches on that final drive. He's our #1 involve him!!!

[brdempsey69]

Hey brdempsey....I can't seem to access rewind now...... "Due to broadcast restrictions, the NFL Game Rewind service is currently unavailable. Please check back later." I know you use rewind.....could you give me a minute counter of blatant non-calls? I'd like to see them, tape them, and send the facts along with a snail-mail letter to the NFL. They need to know that their BS is ruining the reputation of the NFL.

I haven't watched it, yet. I'm probably not going to. It's hard for me stomach watching the Chiefs shoot themselves in the foot in what was a game that they could have won, just like 2 weeks ago. For me, watching it once was enough, two weeks ago.

The game will be uploaded, after the Sunday night game.

One thing that looks promising is there were no sacks given up by the Chiefs O-Line today. Even a less than 100% Eric Fisher was able to handle Von Miller when he got thrust into action. The Chiefs have, at least going forward after this year, two very athletic and young bookend Tackles ( we may have seen the last of Albert, today ).

rodu is right about Donnie Avery. He drops too many passes. Let the youngsters Jenkins and Hemingway have their chance.

Maybe next week the Chiefs can get a win against the Redskins and I'm looking forward to that game.

[Eydugstr]

Some random thoughts about this game....

The crucial play was done on the first drive. The interception. Alex Smith should've ran that ball in the end zone himself. Dwayne Bowe had just thrown a broncos defender into the turf, just run the stinking ball behind Bowe and take a shot. But noooooooo....let's try a risky throw in the end zone...Outside of that, Alex played a great game.

My favorite moment of the game was when Dontari Poe got through the line of scrimmage and charged straight for Manning. Manning's entire career flashed before his eyes, freaked out and promptly put that ball up for grabs. It'll take at least forty dollars' worth of bleach to make Peyton's trousers white again.

The crowd was awesome. Manning couldn't do all his audibles, and wound up turning Wes Welker into a messenger boy throughout the game.

It's time to bench Avery, and replace him with Jenkins or Hemmingway. Too many drops.

The Broncos D was pretty much persona non grata. It was the Chiefs that shot themselves in the foot. Von Miller was held in check throughout the game, and looked hobbled towards the end. Sean Philips didn't accomplish much, either. Towards the end they had to resort to a lot of holding, which didn't get called.

Our D needed to come up with some stops in the third quarter. They didn't. Marcus Cooper simply got overwhelmed by Thomas, and when Peyton sees a mismatch he will burn you every time. Although it wasn't horrible, secondaries can NOT fall asleep against Peyton Manning.

The refs were AWFUL this game. The intentional grounding call was absolute DONKEY-doo. Way too many non-calls. Reid should've thrown the challenge flag on that first down early in the game. Towards the end of the game, the refs started playing the "make up" call game, especially after turning down Jack Del Rio's challenges. Coaches said nothing, few players pointed out the non-calls.

[nigeriannightmare]

When we were at midfield towards the end of the third. We pinned them with a punt and of course Peyton went 90 yards for a score. I felt we should have gone for it. I believe that was the intentional grounding call/ may have been a holding on Albert that put us in 2 and 20. Anyone else think we should have gone for it? It was 4th and 2 from like the 45 or whatever.

[matthewschiefs]

The refs were AWFUL this game. The intentional grounding call was absolute DONKEY-doo. Way too many non-calls. Reid should've thrown the challenge flag on that first down early in the game. Towards the end of the game, the refs started playing the "make up" call game, especially after turning down Jack Del Rio's challenges. Coaches said nothing, few players pointed out the non-calls.

THIS

I'm not one that 95% of the time puts games on the refs but the refs aided them big time yesterday. The grouding call was what finally set me off on top of the CLEAR holds. The Chiefs were up 7 and driving going into the half had a great chance to get the momentum going into the half. The play happened NO FLAG was thrown. Then all of a sudden they call grounding. It was nothing more then them trying to kill the Chiefs momentum set the Chiefs back. And it worked. So Denver went into the half with the momentum and got the ball first. They impacted the game BIG TIME and gave Denver a CLEAR advantage. Beating Denver is hard. Beating Denver and the refs is damn near impossible.

[Ryfo18]

7- not to wish injury on anyone, but albert's injury might be a blessing in disguise for the chiefs. Let's start fishers development there.

lolololol

[ctchiefsfan]

Aj Jenkins had a couple tough grabs, and yac. Hemingway was all over the field we are getting our crap together. We are improving each week offensively. The d needs to get healthy. We were getting pressure today. We are getting close boys. For all those that thought we would go from 2 and 14 to Super Bowl contender in a year need to get a clue. We are gonna end up 11 and 5 and end up Indy or cincy.

But this team is on the right track. Can't wait to see our offseason moves.

I pretty much agree with everything you said EXCEPT what I bolded above. After our performances the last 3 weeks (despite losing all 3 games) I don't see any of our remaining 4 games as unwinable. We could go 11-5, but we could also easily go 12-4 or even 13-3.

As to the Super Bowl. Wait....not yet....first let's remember that the real goal at this point is to get a playoff win. In a way, that may be harder than getting to the Super Bowl. This Chiefs team doesn't have much experience in the playoffs and of course there is all the bad karma of going 1 and out so many years. So getting that 1st playoff win in forever will be almost as difficult as getting to and winning the Super Bowl.

And now back to the Superbowl.....IF we can win that first wildcard matchup then the Super Bowl is certainly a very realistic possibility. As brdempsey has predicted might happen, we could well find ourselves playing Denver with the winner going to the Super Bowl. And after these two games against Denver I like our chances if that matchup happens. These damned donkeys haven't beaten us yet this year. We've beaten ourselves and the damned zebras have given us a helping hand in beating ourselves. But if we get a 3rd shot at the donkeys, I say we will win it.

No...the Super Bowl is not out of the question by a long shot. There is certainly no team in the AFC that we can't beat. And I am not talking the "any given Sunday" thing....I mean there is absolutely no team in the AFC that is so much better than us that they can beat us time and time again. If we can win that first playoff game then we have a very good chance of going to the Super Bowl.

[ctchiefsfan]

Does everyone agree that Alex Smith could be our franchise QB now?

He certainly could be. I'm not quite ready to say he is, but he has been very impressive the last 3 weeks (even though we lost all 3 games). Meanwhile I am still trying to wrap my brain around what our offense has done the last 3 games. We've gone from having an Offense that to be polite was anemic and all of a sudden we get in shootouts the last 3 weeks and are very much in the game to the end. Whatever the coaching staff has been adding to the Offense's gatoraide needs to be put in the Defense's gatoraide as well.

[brdempsey69]

Some random thoughts about this game....

The crucial play was done on the first drive. The interception. Alex Smith should've ran that ball in the end zone himself. Dwayne Bowe had just thrown a broncos defender into the turf, just run the stinking ball behind Bowe and take a shot. But noooooooo....let's try a risky throw in the end zone...Outside of that, Alex played a great game.

My favorite moment of the game was when Dontari Poe got through the line of scrimmage and charged straight for Manning. Manning's entire career flashed before his eyes, freaked out and promptly put that ball up for grabs. It'll take at least forty dollars' worth of bleach to make Peyton's trousers white again.

The crowd was awesome. Manning couldn't do all his audibles, and wound up turning Wes Welker into a messenger boy throughout the game.

It's time to bench Avery, and replace him with Jenkins or Hemmingway. Too many drops.

The Broncos D was pretty much persona non grata. It was the Chiefs that shot themselves in the foot. Von Miller was held in check throughout the game, and looked hobbled towards the end. Sean Philips didn't accomplish much, either. Towards the end they had to resort to a lot of holding, which didn't get called.

Our D needed to come up with some stops in the third quarter. They didn't. Marcus Cooper simply got overwhelmed by Thomas, and when Peyton sees a mismatch he will burn you every time. Although it wasn't horrible, secondaries can NOT fall asleep against Peyton Manning.

The refs were AWFUL this game. The intentional grounding call was absolute DONKEY-doo. Way too many non-calls. Reid should've thrown the challenge flag on that first down early in the game. Towards the end of the game, the refs started playing the "make up" call game, especially after turning down Jack Del Rio's challenges. Coaches said nothing, few players pointed out the non-calls.

What really frosted me was after the Chiefs went up 21-7, we saw a 35 minute stretch that carried well into the 4th QTR, where the Chiefs did not execute, did not hit, did not play football, and the Donkeys scored 28 points in that stretch. That, along with the two squandered chances in the red zone, is what cost them the game -- especially the dropped passes. It seemed to start with McCluster unwisely fielding that punt inside his own 5-yard line.

Defensively, the biggest problem was giving up big plays when they had the Donkeys pinned back in 2nd and long and 3rd an long and it must have happened at least a half-dozen times. Do the Chiefs have any zone pass defensive schemes in their playbook?

As for the Donkeys defense, they've made a living off of opposing Offenses shooting themselves in the foot & like you said, holding other teams receivers and getting away with it -- nothing more. They are not championship caliber by any stretch of the imagination.

Let's not forget the Donkeys O-Line only got called for holding once in each of the 2 games against the Chiefs, but I've seen the visual evidence that there should have been many more & if it were the Chiefs O-Line, they would have got called. This isn't football, this is politics.

On the Chiefs last Offensive series, they had to pick up that 1st down and didn't. Something else has to happen on that 4th down play other than throwing to Bowe in the end zone. Total botch job.

We know that Manning and his receivers are good, but on a level playing field, are the Donkeys really anything more than an average team, even with Manning? I don't think so. He would have been KO'd already, if his O-Line wasn't allowed to hold and get away with it. Admittedly, Manning seems to have the Chiefs number, but Tom Brady and the Pats have Mannings number. And it just so happens, the Pats are leading their division & will probably get the #2 seed in the post-season.

Not sure how the Chiefs season will end up, but my biggest hope is that the Donkeys get knocked out of playoffs by someone and don't reach the SB. Besides the Chiefs have already showed vast improvement over last season, so whatever happens, the 2013 season was not a total loss for the Chiefs by any means.

[Eydugstr]

Does everyone agree that Alex Smith could be our franchise QB now? He's gone downfield plenty the last few games and would look exponentially better if not for all the drops. I think putting in anyone different barring injury would be a mistake. I too am perfectly fine with Avery losing the starting role. He hurts more then he helps. I'm almost positive we lost this game because Jamaal Charles didn't get any touches on that final drive. He's our #1 involve him!!!

Agreed. On all counts. Alex usually is around 200-250 yards a game; If they didn't have half the stinkin' drops, no telling how many extra yards and first downs the guy would have to top over 300 yards. And change the outcome of BOTH of the Broncos games we've lost.

Have no idea why Reid doesn't make a more balanced use of JC.


One thing that looks promising is there were no sacks given up by the Chiefs O-Line today. Even a less than 100% Eric Fisher was able to handle Von Miller when he got thrust into action. The Chiefs have, at least going forward after this year, two very athletic and young bookend Tackles ( we may have seen the last of Albert, today ).

rodu is right about Donnie Avery. He drops too many passes. Let the youngsters Jenkins and Hemingway have their chance.

Maybe next week the Chiefs can get a win against the Redskins and I'm looking forward to that game.

Agreed. Outside of their QB & recievers, saw nothing spectacular about the Broncos. KC still must beat teams consistently within it's division. We get another crack at the Raiders and Chargers. We need to go into Washingtion, Oakland and SD with an attitude.

[N TX Dave]

We know that Manning and his receivers are good, but on a level playing field, are the Donkeys really anything more than an average team, even with Manning? I don't think so. He would have been KO'd already, if his O-Line wasn't allowed to hold and get away with it. Admittedly, Manning seems to have the Chiefs number, but Tom Brady and the Pats have Mannings number. And it just so happens, the Pats are leading their division & will probably get the #2 seed in the post-season.


He does not only have the Chiefs number he has the AFC west number he is now 10-0 against the division. I knew I did not like him signing with Denver the day he did it.

[brdempsey69]

He does not only have the Chiefs number he has the AFC west number he is now 10-0 against the division. I knew I did not like him signing with Denver the day he did it.

Then I may be right. It may very well have to be some team outside the division that knocks off the Donkeys in the post-season, although I'd love nothing more than for the Chiefs to do it somehow.

[ctchiefsfan]

Then I may be right. It may very well have to be some team outside the division that knocks off the Donkeys in the post-season, although I'd love nothing more than for the Chiefs to do it somehow.

If we get a third shot at them we will beat them. This team will not allow a team to beat them 3 times in 1 season.....and neither will Andy Reid.

[Frankenchief]

What really frosted me was after the Chiefs went up 21-7, we saw a 35 minute stretch that carried well into the 4th QTR, where the Chiefs did not execute, did not hit, did not play football, and the Donkeys scored 28 points in that stretch. That, along with the two squandered chances in the red zone, is what cost them the game -- especially the dropped passes. It seemed to start with McCluster unwisely fielding that punt inside his own 5-yard line.That MCCluster screw up was the most painful part of the game for me. That's when the creepy thought that we might give it away rushed and stayed in my head for the rest of the game. I think, having watched Davis' run back, he wanted to do one of his own. "JUST LET THE DAMN BALL GO INTO THE ENDZONE!" - Football 101


Let's not forget the Donkeys O-Line only got called for holding once in each of the 2 games against the Chiefs, but I've seen the visual evidence that there should have been many more & if it were the Chiefs O-Line, they would have got called. This isn't football, this is politics.

I was backing up the DVR and screaming at every holding that should have been called. My wife had to calm me down after a few of those incidents. But she, a relative novice at football, also could see the non-call travesty go down. They were that obvious.

[brdempsey69]

If we get a third shot at them we will beat them. This team will not allow a team to beat them 3 times in 1 season.....and neither will Andy Reid.

We do know that the last two times the Chiefs have played in Denver in January, the Chiefs have beat the Donkeys. They showed that they are capable of beating the Donkeys, but they didn't because the Chiefs shot themselves in the foot too many times in both games.




I was backing up the DVR and screaming at every holding that should have been called. My wife had to calm me down after a few of those incidents. But she, a relative novice at football, also could see the non-call travesty go down. They were that obvious.

As I said before, one person on facebook said he counted 10 blatant holds that weren't called. I saw a pic that I wish I could have posted here, that showed in the 1st game at Denver, Hali was clearly being necktied by the Donkeys LT, and yet, there was no flag thrown.

Any team that gets away with this sort of thing CANNOT be considered a true champion, as was the case with the '97 and '98 Donkeys.

[ctchiefsfan]

Exactly. The won't shoot themselves in the foot if we get a third shot at them. The tough part will be getting that first playoff win. If we can do that then we'll crush the donkeys if we meet them a third time.

[Frankenchief]

Methinks my friend ctchiefsfan is getting a bit emotional. If we get healthy and play them again in their stadium we have a reasonable chance at beating them. But while my heart is on the Chiefs, my money is on the Donks to win that game too. I will be the happiest loser in the world if we do actually beat them there.

[brdempsey69]

Exactly. The won't shoot themselves in the foot if we get a third shot at them. The tough part will be getting that first playoff win. If we can do that then we'll crush the donkeys if we meet them a third time.

If the Chiefs do somehow manage to win in the opening round of the playoffs, and they come out of the opening round as the only wild-card team still standing, then there will be a 3rd meeting with the Donkeys. It's a very possible scenario, but the Chiefs need to win at least 2 these next 4 games. They really need to pull themselves together somehow and win at least 2 of these next 4 games. 11-5 would get the Chiefs the #5 seed for certain.


Methinks my friend ctchiefsfan is getting a bit emotional. If we get healthy and play them again in their stadium we have a reasonable chance at beating them. But while my heart is on the Chiefs, my money is on the Donks to win that game too. I will be the happiest loser in the world if we do actually beat them there.

Keep in mind that the last two times the Chiefs played in Denver in January, they beat the Donkeys both times & both of those games were meaningful games for the Donkeys that did have playoff implications. So, who knows, a victory in Denver in January is very possible because it's already happened.

[Pro_Angler]

The holding call on bowe last play pist me off!!!!!!! 3yd line..15yds past line!!!!!! How can you miss it???? Watch it over!! Absolute bs! As long as peyton is in the league we have no chance! Parting gifts just like to elway!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Pro_Angler]

No way did we or will we have a honest chance at beatingthem as long as peyton is playing!!!!!!!!! The nfl wont allow it!!!! Parting gift just like for elway!!!
The no holding callon Bowe last play of game at 3yd line..how can they miss it??? 15yds past line ofscrimmage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Was it thewrong throw..yes..was he held..hell yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Every flag thrown atus was at times that really hurt us and every flag at them had really no severeconsequence!!!!
And the 3 droppedpasses that were dead on at over 30yd?? WTH???????

[brdempsey69]

The holding call on bowe last play pist me off!!!!!!! 3yd line..15yds past line!!!!!! How can you miss it???? Watch it over!! Absolute bs! As long as peyton is in the league we have no chance! Parting gifts just like to elway!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's my biggest concern, right there. Opposing teams won't be allowed to play the Donkeys on a level playing the rest of this year & it will be tilted in the Donkeys favor just like '97 and '98.

Too bad nobody has the balls to counter this by sending their defenders with the explicit purpose to KO Manning. Under normal circumstances, I don't condone deliberately trying to maim an opposing player, but as we've seen, these aren't normal circumstances or even fair ones at that -- same as '97 and 98.

Joe Montana never benefited from his O-Line getting away with blatant holding & certainly not in his 2 seasons that he played in KC. Montana was a true champion, whereas Elway was a fake one, and now another fake one is being fabricated, it appears.

[Ryfo18]

7- Not to wish injury on anyone, but Albert's injury might be a blessing in disguise for the Chiefs. Let's start Fishers development there.

I won't even get to the part where you called an injury a blessing in disguise, but why on earth would they put Fisher on the left side of the line? He just got benched for Stephenson. Stephenson, for the 3rd time in his career, played outstanding vs. Von Miller. If there's a LT of the future on the team based solely on performance, and not draft position, it's Stephenson, not Fisher. Fisher can still develop, but he has no business playing LT in the midst of a playoff run.

Fortunately, Albert avoided any serious injury though. The O-line is shaping up nicely w/ Scwhartz and Stephenson on the right side. Alex had clean pockets to throw from all night.

[doobs_05]

Same here. I want the Chiefs to win outright on a level playing field. I fully expect the Donkeys to get the officials help in the post-season as well. It's been an established fact for decades that the Donkeys can't win a SB outright on a level playing field, so Pat Bowlen and Turd Elway have once again pulled the same strings with the league office that they did in '97 and '98 to have the playing field tilted in the Donkeys favor. I never want to to see such a thing happen with the Chiefs. At least the Chiefs one SB win is real and not fake like the Donkeys.


I mean it's not just the NFL wanting to get the best ratings possible, nope just denver calling them up and saying "hey, help us".

Seriously, why watch the game if you think denver or other teams are getting help? Stop complaining and deal with it. Losing sucks but it happens, the NFL is a business now, your team has a high ratings puller, the NFL is going to protect that person so they can get the ratings. Where was the calls last year for manning to get to the super bowl? You talk about manning/denver getting the calls and going to the super bowl but they haven't been there since 98! I'm sure if KC won that game denver would complain about the refs as well, you win - refs did a good job, you lose - refs ****ing suck, it very rarely happens that both teams fans agree the refs sucked or were good.

[brdempsey69]

I won't even get to the part where you called an injury a blessing in disguise, but why on earth would they put Fisher on the left side of the line? He just got benched for Stephenson. Stephenson, for the 3rd time in his career, played outstanding vs. Von Miller. If there's a LT of the future on the team, it's him, not Fisher.

That's pure bullsh!t !! Stephenson replaced Fisher because Fisher was hurt and was listed as questionable going into the Denver game. Fisher also did well against Von Miller. Stephenson has had reps at LT this year, whereas Fisher hasn't, but that could change at any time & it wouldn't surprise me if Fisher is the LT right from the get-go in 2014. Get your facts straight.

[AudioFunk]

Chiefs will give Alex some receivers this offseason.

[Ryfo18]

That's pure bullsh!t !! Stephenson replaced Fisher because Fisher was hurt and was listed as questionable going into the Denver game. Fisher also did well against Von Miller. Stephenson has had reps at LT this year, whereas Fisher hasn't, but that could change at any time & it wouldn't surprise me if Fisher is the LT right from the get-go in 2014. Get your facts straight.

Facts? You obviously missed this...We shall see once all are healthy, but Andy acknowledged they've been better (they have): http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2013/12/2/5166882/andy-reid-kansas-city-chiefs-offensive-line-branden-albert-injury

"So was this a decision based on the injuries to Fisher and Asamoah? Or that Stephenson and Schwartz, who started last week against San Diego, were simply better?"It's a combination of both," Andy Reid said at his Monday press conference. "[Stephenson and Schwartz] did a nice job against San Diego. The other part was I didn't think the [injured] guys were able to practice as much earlier in the week as they needed to. Along with [Stephenson and Schwartz] playing well, it was a combination.""

[Eydugstr]

We know that Manning and his receivers are good, but on a level playing field, are the Donkeys really anything more than an average team, even with Manning? I don't think so. He would have been KO'd already, if his O-Line wasn't allowed to hold and get away with it. Admittedly, Manning seems to have the Chiefs number, but Tom Brady and the Pats have Mannings number. And it just so happens, the Pats are leading their division & will probably get the #2 seed in the post-season.

Not sure how the Chiefs season will end up, but my biggest hope is that the Donkeys get knocked out of playoffs by someone and don't reach the SB. Besides the Chiefs have already showed vast improvement over last season, so whatever happens, the 2013 season was not a total loss for the Chiefs by any means.

Yes, they are a team that's going to the playoffs. I've said it before I'll say it again, as long as Manning is upright life's good for the Broncos. And their recievers are good - they physically can blow by any defender in the AFC West. But we're not talking about a 25 year old Peyton Manning...We're talking a 38 year old with a history of neck surgery and ankles that are wrapped in at least an inch of tape. What's plan B for the Broncos? Sign Eli Manning, Tom Brady or Drew Brees for 140 million dollars? And how good will those recievers be if Plan B can't deliver the ball? How good will their O-line look if they have to block for longer than two seconds?

That third quarter void SUCKED. This team has a BAD habit of not producing in the third quarter.

Really what concerned me the most was that 1st drive INT. Bonehead play from a good QB. If we'd scored then & there, Moreno would've been bawling all the way through OT. Instead, we screwed up, and gave the Broncos hope.

Refs or no Refs, Manning was going to do his thing regardless. Where we screwed up, was not nailing down the coffin lid when we had the chance(s). Those chances were during the first drive, and the third quarter. When the fourth quarter rolled around, that's when the sold out refs began their sideshow of calls/no calls...

Losing this game sucked. My hope is that the Chiefs get one more chance at Manning in the postseason. We've got four games to go. Gunsights on the Redskins.

[doobs_05]

Any team that gets away with this sort of thing CANNOT be considered a true champion, as was the case with the '97 and '98 Donkeys.

My god dude, let it go, it was 15 years ago. It'll never change. They won. You are the only person on every nfl/KC chiefs board i go on that brings this up...ever

[doobs_05]

Dropped passes, D giving up BIG plays is what's killing this team. It doesn't help the QBS we lost to (so far) are the top 2 QBS in the league right now (stat wise)

[Eydugstr]

I'd take arrowhead pride with a grain of salt. Why Albert gets a hall pass from the local media I'll never understand. He struggled switching from G to LT, and the whole contract BS really was unnecessary.

Don't be surprised if the next offseason moves as fast as this one did. Neither Dorsey or Reid have time for BS like Albert's contract issues/demands to play LT. While I still think that our primary needs are WR, the O-line play hasn't been stellar, would not be surprised if Reid takes more O-line in the draft, Fisher moves to LT & Albert finds himself the door.

[Ryfo18]

I'd take arrowhead pride with a grain of salt.

So you're saying they made that Andy Reid quote up? :lol:

[brdempsey69]

Facts? You obviously missed this...We shall see once all are healthy, but Andy acknowledged they've been better (they have): http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2013/12/2/5166882/andy-reid-kansas-city-chiefs-offensive-line-branden-albert-injury

"So was this a decision based on the injuries to Fisher and Asamoah? Or that Stephenson and Schwartz, who started last week against San Diego, were simply better?"It's a combination of both," Andy Reid said at his Monday press conference. "[Stephenson and Schwartz] did a nice job against San Diego. The other part was I didn't think the [injured] guys were able to practice as much earlier in the week as they needed to. Along with [Stephenson and Schwartz] playing well, it was a combination.""



Are you blind? Did you miss the following part of that?:

"The other part was I didn't think the [injured] guys were able to practice as much earlier in the week as they needed to."

In other words, if Fisher wasn't hurt, he's still in the starting lineup.

Stephenson and Schwartz played well against SD, but the Chargers don't have anybody on that side of their Defense that comes even remotely close to some of the opposition that Fisher had to go up against in his 1st nine starts.


So you're saying they made that Andy Reid quote up? :lol:

No, Eydugstr is saying exactly what he means regarding Arrowhead Pride IN GENERAL !! Common sense ought to tell you that.


I'd take arrowhead pride with a grain of salt. Why Albert gets a hall pass from the local media I'll never understand. He struggled switching from G to LT, and the whole contract BS really was unnecessary.

Don't be surprised if the next offseason moves as fast as this one did. Neither Dorsey or Reid have time for BS like Albert's contract issues/demands to play LT. While I still think that our primary needs are WR, the O-line play hasn't been stellar, would not be surprised if Reid takes more O-line in the draft, Fisher moves to LT & Albert finds himself the door.


Ryfo has been giving a hall pass to Albert for years, now. Because Albert was the crutch for passing on Okung and taking Berry at #5 in 2010. Pretty pathetic.

[Eydugstr]

So you're saying they made that Andy Reid quote up? :lol:

No. But the quote doesn't say the full story. When I was watching the series when Albert went down, Fisher was the one that went in and relieved him right then. Later they shuffled Schwartz and Stephenson around, and rotated Fisher back to the bench (*&^%!!%%$!!'n injuries)

[ctchiefsfan]

Let's keep it friendly guys. We're all on the same side even if we don't agree on some specifics.

[brdempsey69]

No. But the quote doesn't say the full story. When I was watching the series when Albert went down, Fisher was the one that went in and relieved him right then. Later they shuffled Schwartz and Stephenson around, and rotated Fisher back to the bench (*&^%!!%%$!!'n injuries)

Fisher went back to the bench? I'm pretty sure he stayed on the field after Albert went down.


Let's keep it friendly guys. We're all on the same side even if we don't agree on some specifics.

Sorry, but I can't do that with anyone that fabricates BS. Remember MMH?

[ctchiefsfan]

Methinks my friend ctchiefsfan is getting a bit emotional. If we get healthy and play them again in their stadium we have a reasonable chance at beating them. But while my heart is on the Chiefs, my money is on the Donks to win that game too. I will be the happiest loser in the world if we do actually beat them there.

Of course I am getting a wee bit emotional! I always do if the Chiefs are in the hunt! :) But being honest, this ain't just "homer talk". I really think winning in the first round of the playoffs will be a LOT tougher than beating the donks if we get a third shot at them. I'll expand on why I think that in a thread I'm going to start in a bit.

[Frankenchief]

Of course I am getting a wee bit emotional! I always do if the Chiefs are in the hunt! :) But being honest, this ain't just "homer talk". I really think winning in the first round of the playoffs will be a LOT tougher than beating the donks if we get a third shot at them. I'll expand on why I think that in a thread I'm going to start in a bit.
I didn't think you were being a homer. I am a bit more emotional about this team than usual too. It's because this season is a cruel tease. We are so close yet so far.

As for the 2nd game of the playoffs, I also think it would be easier to play for our young team than the first. Whether that would translate into a win against the Donks remains to be answered. But there's still a lot of mountain to climb to get there.

[Eydugstr]

Fisher went back to the bench? I'm pretty sure he stayed on the field after Albert went down.

If I remember right, yeah they did, some. Stephenson has filled in for LT before, so I didn't give it too much thought. I'd have to see the clips again - my focus was on the denver db's vs. KC's recievers at that point!!

[brdempsey69]

I believe that we will all agree that the Chiefs just blew the ball game in their last 3 games that they played.....plain and simple. With that said, I'm not giving the officials a pass for their no-calls on the Donkeys O-Line as there is no legit excuse for it.

Got to get back in the Win column somehow against the Skins.

[Ryfo18]

No. But the quote doesn't say the full story. When I was watching the series when Albert went down, Fisher was the one that went in and relieved him right then. Later they shuffled Schwartz and Stephenson around, and rotated Fisher back to the bench (*&^%!!%%$!!'n injuries)

Fisher played the right side, Stephenson the left.

[Ryfo18]

Are you blind? Did you miss the following part of that?:

"The other part was I didn't think the [injured] guys were able to practice as much earlier in the week as they needed to."

In other words, if Fisher wasn't hurt, he's still in the starting lineup.

We'll see about that.


Stephenson and Schwartz played well against SD, but the Chargers don't have anybody on that side of their Defense that comes even remotely close to some of the opposition that Fisher had to go up against in his 1st nine starts.

They also played fantastic versus Denver. Fisher gave up 2 sacks against Denver in week 11 and was not good in the running game either.


Ryfo has been giving a hall pass to Albert for years, now. Because Albert was the crutch for passing on Okung and taking Berry at #5 in 2010. Pretty pathetic.

Saying a player plays the LT position well and saying they should keep him is not a hall pass. If you're still on the bash Albert agenda that's been going on since early in his career, you're not paying attention.

Meanwhile, making up excuses for why Fisher has played so poorly IS a hall pass.

Albert wanted a long-term contract, not a franchise tag. That would have really hurt his long-term earnings had his knee injury been more serious. These guys are playing football to make a living, so I understand why he, or anyone else would do what they can to maximize their earnings.

You brought up Berry/Okung...Berry is having a career year. Okung missed half the season...again. He can't stay healthy. He's now missed 19 games in 4 seasons.

Dempsey's always quick to dismiss PFF (b/c it never supports his arguments), but look who's once one of the best tackles in the league when it comes to Pass Blocking Efficiency (and take a peak who's at #46):

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y28/RyFo18/albert_zps65b1fdd4.jpg

[brdempsey69]

^^PFF ratings are worthless trash when it comes to O-Lineman. The overhead camera has shown me that Albert has in no way, shape, or form, been head & shoulders above Fisher or anyone else on the O-Line. Not only that, but the PFF listings doesn't account for the series of opponents that these players went up against, which to me, renders it worthless, as there's a big difference between going up against guys like JJ Watt and Mario Williams, than some backup that wouldn't be on the field if the starters were healthy ( like San Diego missing Freeney and Ingram ).

Your statement about making up excuses for "Fisher playing poorly" is just more fabricated BS. Everybody here has noted that he needs to improve, myself included. What was said was "he played better opponents in his 1st nine starts" than what SD offered, which is true, but of course, you want to take & rip that out of context. Truth is, Fisher has had more bad plays that I would like to see, but I've also seen Albert have just as many poor plays. Which one has played in the NFL longer & played at their current position longer? How poorly did Fisher play at Buffalo a few weeks ago? Fisher was poor in the run game against Denver at Invesco? Bullsh!t, they seldom ran behind him in that game & I recall Fisher driving Miller out of the play and springing Charles for a nice gain on one the few times they did run behind him.

As for Okung, yes he's missed playing time each season, but so what? He's still a better LT than Albert and there's no guarantees whatsoever that if the Chiefs had drafted Okung that he would have missed that same amount of playing time in KC, as that's a completely unknown commodity.

As for Berry, yes he's having his best year, but that isn't saying hardly squat. He's still inferior to another Tennessee Safety that the Chiefs drafted at #20 in 1992 named Dale Carter. And Berry isn't head shoulders above other Safeties that they could have drafted in later rounds of that same draft in 2010 like Cam Chancellor, Morgan Burnett, TJ Ward, Nate Allen, etc. Berry is just simply HYPED more than those others are. And let us not forget that Berry missed an entire season, so what's your point regarding Okung missing playing time?


They also played fantastic versus Denver. Fisher gave up 2 sacks against Denver in week 11 and was not good in the running game either.

But, of course, no mention of 2 of their starters, Wolfe and Vickerson being in the line up in game 1 against Denver and missing from game 2, yesterday.


We'll see about that.

You can bank on Fisher being in the lineup now with Albert hurt & I'll bet money that Fisher would have been put back in the starting lineup once he demonstrated in practice that he was 100%, regardless of what you think.


Saying a player plays the LT position well and saying they should keep him is not a hall pass. If you're still on the bash Albert agenda that's been going on since early in his career, you're not paying attention.

I have been paying attention. The untimely penalties regarding Albert are still happening, like the 1st play from scrimmage in Denver & again yesterday. He's not a top-5 LT. Fisher does have the potential to be, if given the same chance that Albert has had. Thus far, Fisher has performed better in 2013 than what Albert did in 2009 and in 2010. I know that because I watched very closely. The bashing of Albert had occurred because of him being used as a crutch by people like yourself to not take another O-lineman in round 1 and because he was allowing too many hits on the QB back in 2009 and 2010 -- something that Fisher has not allowed an abundance of compared to what Albert did in 2009 and 2010.


Albert wanted a long-term contract, not a franchise tag

Albert wanted top-5 LT money and has TWICE turned down long-term offers. You've had that pointed out to you and keep blatantly ignoring that.

Like eydugstr said, one has to wonder why people like yourself are willing to give Albert a pass, but we both already know the answer to that -- it's because you wanted Berry drafted in 2010 and Geno drafted in 2013 and Albert was the crutch in both instances.

[Frankenchief]

I believe that we will all agree that the Chiefs just blew the ball game in their last 3 games that they played.....plain and simple. With that said, I'm not giving the officials a pass for their no-calls on the Donkeys O-Line as there is no legit excuse for it.I agree. I also strongly believe that the NFL looks at Peyton Manning on his last crusade as a golden goose for TV rating and other sources of revenue. If the 37 year old Peyton goes down to injury that story book ending and therefore a good chunk of profit will be lost. So yes, Peyton does enjoy extra protection from the officials, via allowing his Oline to get away with extracurricular activities. Some of the holdings and leg-whips are borderline blatant. They have to be out in the open, in full view of the TV cameras and all in the stadium and stadium attendees to be called. Must be fun playing in Peyton's O-line and practically having card blanche to do anything you want.

[brdempsey69]

I agree. I also strongly believe that the NFL looks at Peyton Manning on his last crusade as a golden goose for TV rating and other sources of revenue. If the 37 year old Peyton goes down to injury that story book ending and therefore a good chunk of profit will be lost. So yes, Peyton does enjoy extra protection from the officials, via allowing his Oline to get away with extracurricular activities. Some of the holdings and leg-whips are borderline blatant. They have to be out in the open, in full view of the TV cameras and all in the stadium and stadium attendees to be called. Must be fun playing in Peyton's O-line and practically having card blanche to do anything you want.

Good points & it goes back to what I saying about guys like Joe Montana not having this type of luxury, but instead, they had to take their lumps & had to earn everything outright. To me, it totally unfair for these type of concessions that you described, to be made for any one particular QB, in this case Peyton Manning. But, I can't ignore that Pat Bowlen and Elway are involved in this. It's just too suspicious & if Manning had went to any other team other than the Donkeys, then I don't believe there would be any discussion about Manning's O-Line holding and getting away with it, because it simply wouldn't be happening. At least I don't recall it ever being discussed when he was with Indy.

[ctchiefsfan]

I agree. I also strongly believe that the NFL looks at Peyton Manning on his last crusade as a golden goose for TV rating and other sources of revenue. If the 37 year old Peyton goes down to injury that story book ending and therefore a good chunk of profit will be lost. So yes, Peyton does enjoy extra protection from the officials, via allowing his Oline to get away with extracurricular activities. Some of the holdings and leg-whips are borderline blatant. They have to be out in the open, in full view of the TV cameras and all in the stadium and stadium attendees to be called. Must be fun playing in Peyton's O-line and practically having card blanche to do anything you want.

SO RIGHT!!! The real money for the NFL and the team owners is in TV and we all know how how TV loves that "Cinderalla Story". So it is entirely possible that the NFL is trying to deliver the networks what they want. As much as I respect brdempsey, I'm just not quite sure I buy into the whole NFL/Bowlen/Elway conspiracy thing, but despite my skepticism, I have to admit that when I smell a certain smell, I know there is rotted fish around and some of the officiating is starting to make my nose tingle a bit.

That said, if we can get to the playoffs and the donks get eliminated our Chiefs would become the natural replacement "Cinderalla Story".

brdempsey....hope you take no offense at what I've typed. I'm not saying you are wrong. It's just that the idea that the NFL has sunk to the level of professional wrestling is a hard pill to swallow.

[matthewschiefs]

SO RIGHT!!! The real money for the NFL and the team owners is in TV and we all know how how TV loves that "Cinderalla Story". So it is entirely possible that the NFL is trying to deliver the networks what they want. As much as I respect brdempsey, I'm just not quite sure I buy into the whole NFL/Bowlen/Elway conspiracy thing, but despite my skepticism, I have to admit that when I smell a certain smell, I know there is rotted fish around and some of the officiating is starting to make my nose tingle a bit.

That said, if we can get to the playoffs and the donks get eliminated our Chiefs would become the natural replacement "Cinderalla Story".

brdempsey....hope you take no offense at what I've typed. I'm not saying you are wrong. It's just that the idea that the NFL has sunk to the level of professional wrestling is a hard pill to swallow.

I don't think the calls Denver gets has anything to do with Bowlen or Elway

It's all about Manning. He has and always will get calls. The NFL in no way wants him to go down so they allow the holding to happen. They want Manning to go far because he is a household name and as long as he's playing there will be people watching. They know that so again they allow them to get away with a bit more then any other team.

I don't think the NFL has sunk the the level of being a predetermined outcome like the WWE. But I do think they allow Manning's team to get away with things and it does make a impact in the game.

[ctchiefsfan]

I don't think the calls Denver gets has anything to do with Bowlen or Elway

It's all about Manning. He has and always will get calls. The NFL in no way wants him to go down so they allow the holding to happen. They want Manning to go far because he is a household name and as long as he's playing there will be people watching. They know that so again they allow them to get away with a bit more then any other team.

I don't think the NFL has sunk the the level of being a predetermined outcome like the WWE. But I do think they allow Manning's team to get away with things and it does make a impact in the game.

No doubt about that! The question is.......is it NFL "policy" or is it the damned zebras? If it is the NFL then that is very damned depressing.

[Ryfo18]

^^PFF ratings are worthless trash when it comes to O-Lineman. The overhead camera has shown me that Albert has in no way, shape, or form, been head & shoulders above Fisher or anyone else on the O-Line.

You do realize they watch the overhead camera when rating all these players? Good night, bub.


Fisher was poor in the run game against Denver at Invesco? Bullsh!t, they seldom ran behind him in that game & I recall Fisher driving Miller out of the play and springing Charles for a nice gain on one the few times they did run behind him.

The first 5 run plays were not to Fisher's side. The 6th run play, was to his side. Here was the result. Fisher gets a clown suit put on him for a loss of 2:

http://gifboom.com/x/ec6b32f0

The very next run play, Fisher has help on a double team, gets stood up by his guy and Charles gets tackled for a 3-yard gain.:

http://gifboom.com/x/99dc4035

They then ran 3 more plays not to his side. On the 3rd run to his side Fisher does a good job of getting his guy out of position:

http://gifboom.com/x/f35c6297


They run one more play to the left. Then on the goal line, Fisher gets blown back into Charles. No TD:

http://gifboom.com/x/b84f74b0

4 straight runs not to his side then he does a good job of getting to the linebacker.

http://gifboom.com/x/2d90fd70

One more run in the game, and that was it. They ran 13 times to the left, 5 to the right. I wonder why they seldom run behind him? The only time Fisher had success was when he didn't have to square up w/ a d-lineman and got to go downfield and block. Every other time he got destroyed at the point of attack. So yes, POOR in the run game.

I watch the games too. What's everyone else think based on rewatching these 5 times they ran behind him? Not poor?



And all of that was on top of the 2 sacks he gave up.

[Ryfo18]

And just for reference, here were the 2 sacks he gave up that game:

http://gifboom.com/x/84c854ed

http://gifboom.com/x/855c949f

Awful.

Albert played guard in college and developed into a damn fine LT. Fisher needs to show vast improvement to avoid playing LT in college and guard in the NFL.

[brdempsey69]

SO RIGHT!!! The real money for the NFL and the team owners is in TV and we all know how how TV loves that "Cinderalla Story". So it is entirely possible that the NFL is trying to deliver the networks what they want. As much as I respect brdempsey, I'm just not quite sure I buy into the whole NFL/Bowlen/Elway conspiracy thing, but despite my skepticism, I have to admit that when I smell a certain smell, I know there is rotted fish around and some of the officiating is starting to make my nose tingle a bit.

That said, if we can get to the playoffs and the donks get eliminated our Chiefs would become the natural replacement "Cinderalla Story".

brdempsey....hope you take no offense at what I've typed. I'm not saying you are wrong. It's just that the idea that the NFL has sunk to the level of professional wrestling is a hard pill to swallow.

No offense taken. But, on the other hand, I'm sure you've heard of the saying "If it looks like a skunk and smells like a skunk -- it is a skunk".

I know what I saw transpire in '97 and '98 and watched what transpired with the Donks in '99. The difference was clearly that they were made to play on a level playing field, not Elway's retirement, as many would have you think. With Terrell Davis no longer being to benefit from his O-Line getting away with massive holding, illegal chop-blocks and leg whips, in '99, Davis averaged a measly 3.1 yards per carry through the first 4 games and got KO'd in the 4th game and his career was essentially over at that point. Defenders were now getting off Denver blockers and tackling him.

For the most part the NFL has not stooped to the WWE level, but it did happen in '97 and '98, regardless if anyone wants to believe it or not and I fear it may be happening again this year, with the same two culprits who were involved back then.

[Ryfo18]

Now we have conspiracy theories! Oh boy!

[matthewschiefs]

I agree for the most part with Ryfo's breakdowns of the plays that are shown there.

The one thing I will say is that on the sack I don't think Fisher getting beat matter so much as it looked like Asamoah got beat badly on that play as well. Alex was just doomed on that one.

Fisher has gotten better over the course of the season. Still a lot of room to grow but that's what happens with rookies. He was horrible the first few games. Now he's making some plays missing some plays so he is progressing IMO. A lot of work will need to be put into the offseason though.

[matthewschiefs]

Now we have conspiracy theories! Oh boy!

Well in fairness some of what Brdempsey has said about the league is fact as Denver was fined for some of the violations that he talks about after the fact. And Mark Schlereth on NFL has a couple of times mentioned they got away with chop blocks and they had a coach who taught them how to get away with it.

[Ryfo18]

I do hope Fisher continues to develop. I just chimed in b/c this notion that he's all the sudden ready to be the Chiefs LT is silly. He's not. Especially in the middle of a playoff run.

[matthewschiefs]

I do hope Fisher continues to develop. I just chimed in b/c this notion that he's all the sudden ready to be the Chiefs LT is silly. He's not. Especially in the middle of a playoff run.

To me I wouldn't be to upset if he got a shot there. In some ways it could help him as that's where he was in college. He would be going back to the side he's used to playing. IMO Albert is a solid LT I really don't think he's really good. He commits to many false starts and he has been beat a lot this year to. But since this team is in a playoff run It's probably best to leave the line as is.

[ctchiefsfan]

I do hope Fisher continues to develop. I just chimed in b/c this notion that he's all the sudden ready to be the Chiefs LT is silly. He's not. Especially in the middle of a playoff run.

On that I agree with you 100%. I think Fischer is going to be a GREAT LT. But I think putting him there now would be a mistake. We have gotten to where we are this way and I don't think a major reshuffle in our O-line would be a good idea right now unless they are absolutely forced on us by injuries.

For me, I say "Stay the course". We still need to lock up a playoff berth and then focus on getting our first playoff win since before I had wrinkles and gray hair.

[brdempsey69]

You do realize they watch the overhead camera when rating all these players? Good night, bub.

And apparently are just as blind as you and see only what they want to see.


The first 5 run plays were not to Fisher's side. The 6th run play, was to his side. Here was the result. Fisher gets a clown suit put on him for a loss of 2:

http://gifboom.com/x/ec6b32f0


OK, he does take a wrong angle and gets beat. But try telling me that this has never happened to Albert -- rubbish!!



The very next run play, Fisher has help on a double team, gets stood up by his guy and Charles gets tackled for a 3-yard gain.:

http://gifboom.com/x/99dc4035



But of course, no mention of MrGrath missing his block on the SILB, allowing the SILB to fill the hole & forcing Charles to go back inside of Fisher or mention of the pulling Guard Jeff Allen clearly indicating that the play was supposed to go outside of Fisher, not inside him. Fisher is pushing the defender in the direction that he's supposed to. If McGrath blocks the SILB, then the WILB has to deal with the Allen, the pulling Guard, but Charles sees the hole that he's supposed to go already filled by the SILB and cuts it back inside to get what he can instead of getting getting hit for no gain or a loss. You're clearly seeing only what you want to see and are faulting the wrong guy.



They then ran 3 more plays not to his side. On the 3rd run to his side Fisher does a good job of getting his guy out of position:

http://gifboom.com/x/f35c6297


Correct.


They run one more play to the left. Then on the goal line, Fisher gets blown back into Charles. No TD:

http://gifboom.com/x/b84f74b0



That's pure absolute bullsh!t !! I just watched that play from the sideline cam as well. First off, Fisher stood his guy up and drove him back a bit & his block was good. The WILB for Denver does not get blocked by anybody & shoots the gap and tackles Charles before he can get into the end zone. Fisher goes down because Charles, in the process of being tackled, falls into the back of Fisher's legs.The guy that Fisher was blocking doesn't "blow him back", as you are falsely suggesting, doesn't make the play on Charles & if Asamoah could have picked off that WILB, then that's a touchdown. Why the need to fabricate lies to support your arguments?


4 straight runs not to his side then he does a good job of getting to the linebacker.

http://gifboom.com/x/2d90fd70



This is the play I was referring to. They should run it more often.




One more run in the game, and that was it. They ran 13 times to the left, 5 to the right. I wonder why they seldom run behind him?


Coincidence? Or that Charles is a natural left-hander? Pass-first Offense? probably a combination of all three.

The only time Fisher had success was when he didn't have to square up w/ a d-lineman and got to go downfield and block. Every other time he got destroyed at the point of attack.


So yes, POOR in the run game.


-1. You fail. Only bad play was the 1st one. Room for impovement, yes. Poor, no.


I watch the games too. What's everyone else think based on rewatching these 5 times they ran behind him? Not poor?


See above response. It's obvious you watch Albert through rose-colored glasses & watch Fisher through scapegoat lenses, as Fisher wasn't the guy that you wanted the Chiefs to draft & you were so certain that the Chiefs wouldn't draft a Tackle after Albert was franchised, but you guessed wrong. Sour grapes.


And just for reference, here were the 2 sacks he gave up that game:

http://gifboom.com/x/84c854ed

http://gifboom.com/x/855c949f

Awful.


Do you mean just like the sack-strip that Albert allowed in the Buffalo game ( which resulted in a fumble that Fisher recovered )? Or the 9 sacks that Albert allowed in his last 5 starts in 2010 in his 3rd season? Oh wait, didn't your PFF stat sheet say that Fisher had allowed 6 sacks in his first 9 games on the field? And this, his first year in pro ball playing out of position & on the opposite side of where he played in college, whereas Albert has at least got to play on the same side of the O-Line that he played in college? And which player crybabied about where he wanted to play, whereas the other said he'd play wherever they wanted him to?




Albert played guard in college and developed into a damn fine LT.


According to whom? Certainly not the other 31 teams in the NFL when he was on trading block and there were no takers & certainly not the Chiefs, as they refuse to pay him a top-5 LT contract & have already drafted his replacement. Fisher played LT in college & can develop into a better LT than Albert, if given the chance to play LT -- which I suspect he will come 2014, unless he tells the brass he wants to stay at RT.



Fisher needs to show vast improvement to avoid playing LT in college and guard in the NFL.

What kind of a stupid statement is that? Fisher WAS a LT in college and a very good one & no, he's not a Guard in the NFL. Everybody has said he needs to improve, but by the same token, he's surpassed what we saw from Albert in 2009 & 2010.


Now we have conspiracy theories! Oh boy!

Did you even see what happened in '97 and '98 and are you dumb enough to think I'm alone in that thought? Are really dumb enough to believe that the Donkeys won those 2 SB's outright on a level playing field? If so, then you are thinking exactly what the Donkeys camp wants you to think.

The reality is, the Donkeys camp can't stomach anyone pointing out how those 2 SB's were given to them & I've already pointed out a slew of points about it in other threads, but no worries for the Donkeys camp where you are concerned, because it's obvious they've got you eating into their BS like a kid eating mashed pears on a Thomas-the-train spoon.

[brdempsey69]

The only time Fisher had success was when he didn't have to square up w/ a d-lineman and got to go downfield and block. Every other time he got destroyed at the point of attack.

My bad, I forgot to put that in quotes in my above response. But, no he wasn't destroyed at the point of attack every time like Ryfo was suggesting. He could get better push, yes, and perhaps this off-season he'll get stronger and put on a bit more wight to help him out there.

BTW, you won't ever see me using Fisher as a crutch to not take an O-Lineman in round 1 of future drafts. If Dorsey/Reid decide they want to draft another O-Lineman in Round 1 because they think he's the best player on the board and can help make the Chiefs O-Line better, than so be it.

[Justin5772002]

My bad, I forgot to put that in quotes in my above response. But, no he wasn't destroyed at the point of attack every time like Ryfo was suggesting. He could get better push, yes, and perhaps this off-season he'll get stronger and put on a bit more wight to help him out there.

BTW, you won't ever see me using Fisher as a crutch to not take an O-Lineman in round 1 of future drafts. If Dorsey/Reid decide they want to draft another O-Lineman in Round 1 because they think he's the best player on the board and can help make the Chiefs O-Line better, than so be it.
Just not this upcoming year because we have some much greater needs than oline atm

[brdempsey69]

Just not this upcoming year because we have some much greater needs than oline atm

Depends on what happens in the off-season. What if Albert, Asamoah, and Schwartz all walk after the season, as all will be unsigned after the season? Then what? And what IF when it comes their turn to pick in round 1, that it just so happens the WR or Defensive front 7 player isn't there, but an O-Lineman is? Then you take the O-Lineman if it falls that way.

[Justin5772002]

Depends on what happens in the off-season. What if Albert, Asamoah, and Schwartz all walk after the season, as all will be unsigned after the season? Then what? And what IF when it comes their turn to pick in round 1, that it just so happens the WR or Defensive front 7 player isn't there, but an O-Lineman is? Then you take the O-Lineman if it falls that way.
There's going to be many players this season that Want to stick around because even if we turn out to be pretenders this year, next year we will definatly be contenders. Who wants to walk away from a team that has this kind of potential?

[Justin5772002]

Reid/Dorsey know that the OLine needs longevity in playing together they won't let more than half our Oline leave all at once

[Eydugstr]

According to whom? Certainly not the other 31 teams in the NFL when he was on trading block and there were no takers & certainly not the Chiefs, as they refuse to pay him a top-5 LT contract & have already drafted his replacement. Fisher played LT in college & can develop into a better LT than Albert, if given the chance to play LT -- which I suspect he will come 2014, unless he tells the brass he wants to stay at RT.


THIS. If Albert was so spectacular, why weren't Dorsey & Reid flooded with offers for him? They weren't. Miami kicked the tires a little bit, then decided to sign someone else.

[Eydugstr]

Well in fairness some of what Brdempsey has said about the league is fact as Denver was fined for some of the violations that he talks about after the fact. And Mark Schlereth on NFL has a couple of times mentioned they got away with chop blocks and they had a coach who taught them how to get away with it.

Alex Gibbs.

[Ryfo18]

THIS. If Albert was so spectacular, why weren't Dorsey & Reid flooded with offers for him? They weren't. Miami kicked the tires a little bit, then decided to sign someone else.

Thy wanted a 2nd rounder and were smart not to give him up cheap. We got to see what the LT trade market was when Eugene Monroe, who started at LT ahead of BA in Virginia and has also developed into a damn fine LT in the NFL as well and was also coincidentally in the last year of his contract, was traded to the Ravens for a 4th and 5th round pick. Monroe would go on to replace Mckinnie, whom Mr. Dempsey tried to tell me was better than Alvert last year. So please don't tell me nobody was interested in Albert. The Chiefs had a price set for him and nobody offered it and they wisely kept Albert.

Meanwhile, Miami's O-line has given up the most sacks in the league! Keep spreading the misinformation to further your anti-Albert agenda!

[Eydugstr]

Thy wanted a 2nd rounder and were smart not to give him up cheap. We got to see what the LT trade market was when Eugene Monroe, who started at LT ahead of BA in Virginia and has also developed into a damn fine LT in the NFL as well and was also coincidentally in the last year of his contract, was traded to the Ravens for a 4th and 5th round pick. Monroe would go on to replace Mckinnie, whom Mr. Dempsey tried to tell me was better than Alvert last year. So please don't tell me nobody was interested in Albert. The Chiefs had a price set for him and nobody offered it and they wisely kept Albert.

Meanwhile, Miami's O-line has given up the most sacks in the league! Keep spreading the misinformation to further your anti-Albert agenda!

No sale. A second rounder for a LT (especially one worth top 5 pay) is not out of reach. If there were other teams interested, we would've heard about on ESPN, internet, etc etc. If he was demanding top 5 money, why all of a sudden would he be worth less to everyone else? If anything teams probably backed off when they started hearing about negotiation problems, not wanting the headache.

BTW I'm not anti-Albert. I don't think he's horrible, just don't think he's that great. If he was truly that great, Dorsey & Reid wouldn't have had to draft an LT in the first place! They would've just given him his money, and gone on drafting another position.

[Ryfo18]

No sale. A second rounder for a LT (especially one worth top 5 pay) is not out of reach. If there were other teams interested, we would've heard about on ESPN, internet, etc etc. If he was demanding top 5 money, why all of a sudden would he be worth less to everyone else? If anything teams probably backed off when they started hearing about negotiation problems, not wanting the headache.

BTW I'm not anti-Albert. I don't think he's horrible, just don't think he's that great. If he was truly that great, Dorsey & Reid wouldn't have had to draft an LT in the first place! They would've just given him his money, and gone on drafting another position.

Lol. Once again dancing around the fact that another fringe top 5 LT was traded for only a 4th/5th. Can you point me to any trades for a LT in recent history that involved a 2nd or higher? Hell I can't even think of a team moving up to draft one.

As far as that 2nd paragraph. You're really oversimplifying things. For one, Dorsey says he drafts best player avaialable. So he either lied or, he took the best player available in his eyes.

[brdempsey69]

Lol. Once again dancing around the fact that another fringe top 5 LT was traded for only a 4th/5th. Can you point me to any trades for a LT in recent history that involved a 2nd or higher? Hell I can't even think of a team moving up to draft one.

As far as that 2nd paragraph. You're really oversimplifying things. For one, Dorsey says he drafts best player available. So he either lied or, he took the best player available in his eyes.

Eydugstr isn't dancing around anything. He makes a legit statement when he says that if Albert were really a top-5 LT, then they would have paid him & not drafted Fisher. Instead, they franchised him as trade bait. There were no takers because he's not a top-5 LT and nobody wants to pay him big dollars because they know that they can easily draft somebody as good or better.

Jacksonville was just plain foolish to give up Monroe that cheap. They should have at least have gotten a 3rd rounder & probably would have gotten that as a compensatory pick if monroe would have walked after the season. As far as what you said about LT's not being traded recently for high picks, it's because when teams get a good LT, they keep him and let us not forget that LT's are taken in the top 10 of the draft seemingly every year.

And McKinnie did play better than Albert last year, as I had told you, he played against the better series of opponents than Albert did. So did Stephenson for that matter.McKinnie fell off this year, but the Ravens in general have fallen off this year.

Also, Dorsey said he would draft the BPA that was the best fit for the Chiefs and felt that was Fisher. Fisher's got room for improvement for sure, but he hasn't been as bad as his predecessors at the position O'Callaghan, Richardson, and Winston, especially considering this is his 1st year at the RT position and those guys had been RT's for years. An off-season program should help Fisher get ready for year 2, just like it did for Stephenson. Fisher is a hard worker & he'll get himself ready for year 2. Just needs to put on a bit more weight and get a bit stronger. Of course, we all saw what happened with Albert in his 2nd year & how well he prepared for year 2 -- showed up overweight, out of shape, and totally unprepared to play.

[Frankenchief]

As much as I respect brdempsey, I'm just not quite sure I buy into the whole NFL/Bowlen/Elway conspiracy thing.
Well I had heard that Bowlen and Paul Tagliabue were tight friends. Added that to the same accommodations for Elway that we are seeing now for Peyton it is not really hard to have the same suspicion. roger Goodell is not Paul Tagliabue, but maybe he is also a member of a tight buddy system with Bowlen. Who knows? It just does look suspicious. But I am more convinced that the business side of this matter drives it.

[Frankenchief]

No doubt about that! The question is.......is it NFL "policy" or is it the damned zebras? If it is the NFL then that is very damned depressing.
It can't be an official policy. Just an off the record admonition to the zebras. they wouldn't want this to be subject to documentation.

[doobs_05]

Now we have conspiracy theories! Oh boy!

br is full of them. They got an easy schedule those years they won the super bowl, but KC didn't pick their schedule this year like Denver did those years. I'm on his ignore list, but enjoy his conpiracies

Also Didn't KC have the same coach that taught Denver players the dirty block?


I also wonder why he doesn't harp on the Patriots about spy gate?

[Frankenchief]

I do hope Fisher continues to develop. I just chimed in b/c this notion that he's all the sudden ready to be the Chiefs LT is silly. He's not. Especially in the middle of a playoff run.
I - admittedly rather clumsily - brought up that notion in this thread. However if you read my post I was calling the Albert injury a blessing in disguise "long term." I do believe Fisher will pan out as a pretty good LT.

Playoff run or not, since I'm resigned to the fact that we are not a complete enough team to go far in the playoffs, I don't see Fisher's insertion into his natural position as a real detriment. Like everyone says he has shown improvement lately and has held his own reasonably well in an unnatural position. No reason to think he won't develop rather quickly at LT. Yes Stephenson has played well enough at LT, but I have hope that in short order fisher's play will surpass his at LT if given serious reps.

[Frankenchief]

Do you mean ... the 9 sacks that Albert allowed in his last 5 starts in 2010 in his 3rd season? Oh wait, didn't your PFF stat sheet say that Fisher had allowed 6 sacks in his first 9 games on the field? And this, his first year in pro ball playing out of position
This is a pretty good argument. I just can't get this "Fisher-is-a-proBowler-or-bust" attitude that some fans display.

[Frankenchief]

BTW, you won't ever see me using Fisher as a crutch to not take an O-Lineman in round 1 of future drafts. If Dorsey/Reid decide they want to draft another O-Lineman in Round 1 because they think he's the best player on the board and can help make the Chiefs O-Line better, than so be it.
I think the NFL has evolved to the point that all those supposed conventions like "you don't draft a guard in the 1st round; you don't draft a OT at the top of the draft; you don't pick a safety or TE high, etc. etc. etc." are pretty much out the window. With the exception of RBs having lost some value NFL teams can and will draft those previously odd positions high if the player is good enough.

[Frankenchief]

There's going to be many players this season that Want to stick around because even if we turn out to be pretenders this year, next year we will definatly be contenders. Who wants to walk away from a team that has this kind of potential?I would be careful making declarations like this. Injuries can do strange things to teams with high expectations. See Atlanta Falcons.

[Frankenchief]

BTW I'm not anti-Albert. I don't think he's horrible, just don't think he's that great. If he was truly that great, Dorsey & Reid wouldn't have had to draft an LT in the first place! They would've just given him his money, and gone on drafting another position.My best hope for us and him is that he would take less money and move to LG or maybe RT. He's talented enough to keep on the Oline. Just not at LT. I think Albert can handle RT better than Fisher.

[Frankenchief]

Also, Dorsey said he would draft the BPA that was the best fit for the Chiefs and felt that was Fisher. Fisher's got room for improvement for sure, but he hasn't been as bad as his predecessors at the position O'Callaghan, Richardson, and Winston, especially considering this is his 1st year at the RT position and those guys had been RT's for years. An off-season program should help Fisher get ready for year 2, just like it did for Stephenson. Fisher is a hard worker & he'll get himself ready for year 2. Just needs to put on a bit more weight and get a bit stronger. Of course, we all saw what happened with Albert in his 2nd year & how well he prepared for year 2 -- showed up overweight, out of shape, and totally unprepared to play.Almost all draft reports on Fisher was he had tremendous upside but due to playing in a less competitive division, he was going to need initial development in the pro level. So far, that assessment has been on the money.

[matthewschiefs]

br is full of them. They got an easy schedule those years they won the super bowl, but KC didn't pick their schedule this year like Denver did those years. I'm on his ignore list, but enjoy his conpiracies

Also Didn't KC have the same coach that taught Denver players the dirty block?


I also wonder why he doesn't harp on the Patriots about spy gate?


I don't think things were as bad as brdempsy does in the 90s but I do think that Denver got an advantage just like they do now.

That's nothing that's confined to the NFL it happens in all sports. The top teams get calls it just happens all the time.
In baseball the strike zone for Yankees pitchers are just a bit bigger then others. The strike zone against there hitters are just a bit smaller.
In basketball Lebron James last season went 2 weeks without being called for 1 foul. There was the whole 2002 Lakers-kings playoff series and Jordan got away with a huge pushoff on his famous last shot with the Bulls to beat the Jazz in the finals.
Denver this year gets that same type of treatment. The pats have gotten it as well at times throughout the Brady era.

It's just how sports are the leagues seem to be willing to bend the rules for the top teams a bit

[matthewschiefs]

Almost all draft reports on Fisher was he had tremendous upside but due to playing in a less competitive division, he was going to need initial development in the pro level. So far, that assessment has been on the money.

I fully expected Fisher to need development. Not only was he a rookie but he was changing sides on the line. That just doesn't add up to being able to come in and be great on day 1. Fisher was worse then I thought at the start of the season but I will say he has showed some progress. This offseason he's going to need to put in a lot of work. But I think Fisher can still be a fine player.

[doobs_05]

I don't think things were as bad as brdempsy does in the 90s but I do think that Denver got an advantage just like they do now.

That's nothing that's confined to the NFL it happens in all sports. The top teams get calls it just happens all the time.
In baseball the strike zone for Yankees pitchers are just a bit bigger then others. The strike zone against there hitters are just a bit smaller.
In basketball Lebron James last season went 2 weeks without being called for 1 foul. There was the whole 2002 Lakers-kings playoff series and Jordan got away with a huge pushoff on his famous last shot with the Bulls to beat the Jazz in the finals.
Denver this year gets that same type of treatment. The pats have gotten it as well at times throughout the Brady era.

It's just how sports are the leagues seem to be willing to bend the rules for the top teams a bit

Yeah teams/Players that pull the higher ratings and sell more merch will get more calls. NFL is a business and when you run a business you keep the audience happy and keep the high ratings/Cash cows in as long as possible. Stuff like that is always going to happen. You don't like it, better stop watching or hope your team gets a star player that sells big.

[Eydugstr]

Lol. Once again dancing around the fact that another fringe top 5 LT was traded for only a 4th/5th. Can you point me to any trades for a LT in recent history that involved a 2nd or higher? Hell I can't even think of a team moving up to draft one.

As far as that 2nd paragraph. You're really oversimplifying things. For one, Dorsey says he drafts best player avaialable. So he either lied or, he took the best player available in his eyes.

You've just answered your own quandry. Yes, Dorsey drafted a LT. Why? Because a) There were no Joe Montanas, Dan Marinos or Tom Bradys in the 2013 draft class, b) The Chiefs' current LT was in a contract dispute with negotiations not looking good at all and c) Alex Smith, who was favored by the new head coach, was available in free agency. So yeah it made it real simple that Dorsey took a LT. If I was in their shoes, would've done the same. When the Miami deal fell through, Fisher was the grown up that said he would play right tackle, avoiding more drama from the word go.

But don't worry, I'm always wrong. This offseason we should be able to fix everything by getting Geno Smith (cue clown music)

[Frankenchief]

You've just answered your own quandry. Yes, Dorsey drafted a LT. Why? Because a) There were no Joe Montanas, Dan Marinos or Tom Bradys in the 2013 draft class, b) The Chiefs' current LT was in a contract dispute with negotiations not looking good at all and c) Alex Smith, who was favored by the new head coach, was available in free agency. So yeah it made it real simple that Dorsey took a LT. If I was in their shoes, would've done the same. When the Miami deal fell through, Fisher was the grown up that said he would play right tackle, avoiding more drama from the word go.

But don't worry, I'm always wrong. This offseason we should be able to fix everything by getting Geno Smith (cue clown music)
Good post. Made better by the funny ending.

[Eydugstr]

My best hope for us and him is that he would take less money and move to LG or maybe RT. He's talented enough to keep on the Oline. Just not at LT. I think Albert can handle RT better than Fisher.

I'd be perfectly OK with that, and even to signing Albert to a longer term deal if he'd be more flexible with moving around the line. Just don't think he will, and not for less than top-10 money.

[Justin5772002]

You've just answered your own quandry. Yes, Dorsey drafted a LT. Why? Because a) There were no Joe Montanas, Dan Marinos or Tom Bradys in the 2013 draft class, b) The Chiefs' current LT was in a contract dispute with negotiations not looking good at all and c) Alex Smith, who was favored by the new head coach, was available in free agency. So yeah it made it real simple that Dorsey took a LT. If I was in their shoes, would've done the same. When the Miami deal fell through, Fisher was the grown up that said he would play right tackle, avoiding more drama from the word go.

But don't worry, I'm always wrong. This offseason we should be able to fix everything by getting Geno Smith (cue clown music)

Duh duh da da duh da duh da dah da...

[Ryfo18]

Reid confirmed at his presser today that Stephenson will start at LT for as long as Albert is out.

[Frankenchief]

So he's postponing the Fisher/LT development to the offseason. Just being cautious and conservative with playoffs in his gun sight.

[brdempsey69]

Reid confirmed at his presser today that Stephenson will start at LT for as long as Albert is out.

I don't have any problem with that. Stephenson has taken more practice reps at LT than Fisher.

By the same token, what you said to the effect of "being silly" to consider Fisher playing LT this year, isn't so silly if both Albert & Stephenson go down to injury. Who else are they going to turn to to play LT, other than Fisher, if that happens?

[Ryfo18]

I don't have any problem with that. Stephenson has taken more practice reps at LT than Fisher.

By the same token, what you said to the effect of "being silly" to consider Fisher playing LT this year, isn't so silly if both Albert & Stephenson go down to injury. Who else are they going to turn to to play LT, other than Fisher, if that happens?

Of course not. It's silly if either is healthy though.

[Eydugstr]

So he's postponing the Fisher/LT development to the offseason. Just being cautious and conservative with playoffs in his gun sight.

+1. Why upset the apple cart. Stephenson can get it done.