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hermhater
11-06-2007, 01:33 AM
How can we fix this problem?

Do you think this is the number one issue with offensive output this season?

This is an excerpt discussing the issue of how the Defensive penalties by the Packers helped our offense.

Here's what happened on each of the five 3rd downs the Chiefs had in the first half:
3rd and 3 - Huard sacked for -5 yards
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -4 yards
3rd and 6 - False start on RT Chris Terry (bailed out on the next play by defensive holding)
3rd and 11 - First down via defensive holding
3rd and 13 - Incomplete to Tony Gonzalez
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -8 yards
3rd and 7 - Incomplete pass to Jeff Webbhttp://www.arrowheadpride.com/story/2007/11/5/93641/3031

luv
11-06-2007, 01:38 AM
Quicker release.
Better Oline coverage.
Pass to the target.
Knowing when to throw it away.
Knowing when to drag your feet on a sideline catch.

hermhater
11-06-2007, 01:47 AM
Then why aren't these things being coached?

Are we just lacking in talent, or is this VERY basic offensive scheme too complex for the coaches to teach?

We get called for illegal shifts as well.

I don't think we have been outclassed by talent this year in our opponents.

It is a coaching issue.

Thank you luv for pointing that out!

luv
11-06-2007, 01:51 AM
Then why aren't these things being coached?

Are we just lacking in talent, or is this VERY basic offensive scheme too complex for the coaches to teach?

We get called for illegal shifts as well.

I don't think we have been outclassed by talent this year in our opponents.

It is a coaching issue.

Thank you luv for pointing that out!
We suck at developing talent. If the players don't pick up on it themseles or have the seemingly natural talent. I don't think it's all coaching though. We have players that lack talent.

chief31
11-06-2007, 03:14 AM
It seems that there are two camps on this issue. On one hand, you have those that choose to believe that Huard is the problem. Rather that would be blamed on Dick Curl (QB Coach), Mike Solari (O_Coordinator), Herm Edwards, or directly on Huard himself , is where there could be variations to that.

On the other hand, there are those who feel that the offensive line is to blame. (I would obviously be in that camp.) The blame for that could be leaned toward Herm Edwards, Carl Peterson (General Manager), or the players themselves.

The things that lean me toward the offensive line being the real problem are a couple of things.

A.) The running game. Just looking at the sample that HH supplied, there were seven third-down samples. Six of them were third-and-five, or more. What is causing us to gain less than six yards on our first two plays of most of our possessions?

Seemingly, it would be the lack of a running game. I don't hoold LJ responsible, as much as most, because he is the same person who was doing so well last season. It would be hard for me to believe that he has changed so dramatically, in such a short time. Whereas the offensive linemen have changed. Damien McIntosh, John Welbourne and Chris Terry are new to the position that they are on, or the team. Not to mention the talent level of the players who they are trying to replace.

B) Again, with a new bunch of guys playing together, in a toally new arrangment, and a crystal-clear talent drop-off, if they are struggling so clearly, to execute in the running game, and there are alot of sacks being allowed, on a guy who was not getting sacked often last year, with this team, then I look at what has changed from last year. Primarily those same offensive linemen.

Where do I choose to shift the bulk of the blame for the offensive linemens struggles? Herm Edwards. He has a seven year draft record that seems to expose Herm as disintersted in, or perhaps just not sold on the importance of, offensive linemen.

Carl Peterson would get his share of that blame, but he has a pretty good track-record with regards to offensive linemen. I think he should have taken a more active role in convincing Herm that there was a very serious need amongst that group.

That's what I have on it, for now. I have to go back to work. :D Errr Somethin'.

hermhater
11-06-2007, 03:17 AM
We suck at developing talent. If the players don't pick up on it themseles or have the seemingly natural talent. I don't think it's all coaching though. We have players that lack talent.


I think our talent is great. They just lack the fundamentals.

anaeelbackwards
11-06-2007, 03:45 AM
I think our talent is great. They just lack the fundamentals.

agreed.

we have the offensive weapons (tgunz,dbo,lj,priest,etc.) just not the right tools(o-line) to back them up. you can even throw the qb in there..

hermhater
11-06-2007, 03:49 AM
agreed.

we have the offensive weapons (tgunz,dbo,lj,priest,etc.) just not the right tools(o-line) to back them up. you can even throw the qb in there..

Agreed!

Huard was great last year when we had the talent to help him out.

We never should have pulled him after Green got back. There was no reason for that because he was in the thick of the season and had momentum with the offense.

Boob Sanders helped the Colts to the Super Bowl, but he really helped the Colts D stop LJ last year.

Don't worry though! This WILL NOT be a typical Chiefs year!

We will win the Division, the Conference, and the SUPER BOWL!

:yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo:

anaeelbackwards
11-06-2007, 03:53 AM
Agreed!

Huard was great last year when we had the talent to help him out.

We never should have pulled him after Green got back. There was no reason for that because he was in the thick of the season and had momentum with the offense.

Boob Sanders helped the Colts to the Super Bowl, but he really helped the Colts D stop LJ last year.

Don't worry though! This WILL NOT be a typical Chiefs year!

We will win the Division, the Conference, and the SUPER BOWL!

:yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo:

oooo HH you got that much faith in our offense-less team eh? i wish for that so much... while loving my team, i want to be realistic as well and try not to get my heart broken. haha.. u willing to beat some of that hard earned casino cash of yours eh? lol

hermhater
11-06-2007, 03:58 AM
Agreed!

Huard was great last year when we had the talent to help him out.

We never should have pulled him after Green got back. There was no reason for that because he was in the thick of the season and had momentum with the offense.

Boob Sanders helped the Colts to the Super Bowl, but he really helped the Colts D stop LJ last year.

Don't worry though! This WILL NOT be a typical Chiefs year!

We will win the Division, the Conference, and the SUPER BOWL!

:yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo: :yahoo::yahoo:


oooo HH you got that much faith in our offense-less team eh? i wish for that so much... while loving my team, i want to be realistic as well and try not to get my heart broken. haha.. u willing to beat some of that hard earned casino cash of yours eh? lol


Yep!

If, and when, I get my 299,999 back the Sports Book I will bet it all on the Chiefs winning the Super Bowl!

I will always say the Chiefs are gonna win!

They have the best players in the NFL!

Just can't wait for HERM to unleash them!

GO CHIEFS!!!

luv
11-06-2007, 04:13 AM
Yep!

If, and when, I get my 299,999 back the Sports Book I will bet it all on the Chiefs winning the Super Bowl!

I will always say the Chiefs are gonna win!

They have the best players in the NFL!

Just can't wait for HERM to unleash them!

GO CHIEFS!!!
Alright. How many have you had?

hermhater
11-06-2007, 04:21 AM
Alright. How many have you had?

I began lamenting the Chiefs loss early this evening and now I am finished drinking.

I only have 2 beers left and the stores are closed.

I guess I am not finished drinking but I will not be able to drink anymore than I have now.

:lol:

anaeelbackwards
11-06-2007, 04:30 AM
I began lamenting the Chiefs loss early this evening and now I am finished drinking.

I only have 2 beers left and the stores are closed.

I guess I am not finished drinking but I will not be able to drink anymore than I have now.

:lol:

hahaha :drunkhb: duhhhhhh.i still have a fresh 12 in my fridge, but their my dads... i think i might sneak one or two before i go to bed.

hermhater
11-06-2007, 04:40 AM
Alright. How many have you had?

14

Just enough to realize the Chiefs will be Super Bowl Champions this season.

For all you haters that think it ain't gonna happen then we should have an Event that pays 1,000,000 to 1 that THE CHIEFS WIN the SUPERBOWL this season?

I will bet a couple of dollars on it.

m0ef0e
11-06-2007, 03:51 PM
How can we fix this problem?

Do you think this is the number one issue with offensive output this season?

This is an excerpt discussing the issue of how the Defensive penalties by the Packers helped our offense.

Here's what happened on each of the five 3rd downs the Chiefs had in the first half:

3rd and 3 - Huard sacked for -5 yards
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -4 yards
3rd and 6 - False start on RT Chris Terry (bailed out on the next play by defensive holding)
3rd and 11 - First down via defensive holding
3rd and 13 - Incomplete to Tony Gonzalez
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -8 yards
3rd and 7 - Incomplete pass to Jeff Webbhttp://www.arrowheadpride.com/story/2007/11/5/93641/3031

First of all, third-down playcalling needs to get better. Second, the offense needs to learn how to handle the pressure and exectute the called play properly-- no matter how retarded it may seem.

McLovin
11-06-2007, 04:27 PM
How can we fix this problem?

Do you think this is the number one issue with offensive output this season?

This is an excerpt discussing the issue of how the Defensive penalties by the Packers helped our offense.

Here's what happened on each of the five 3rd downs the Chiefs had in the first half:
3rd and 3 - Huard sacked for -5 yards
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -4 yards
3rd and 6 - False start on RT Chris Terry (bailed out on the next play by defensive holding)
3rd and 11 - First down via defensive holding
3rd and 13 - Incomplete to Tony Gonzalez
3rd and 5 - Huard sacked for -8 yards
3rd and 7 - Incomplete pass to Jeff Webbhttp://www.arrowheadpride.com/story/2007/11/5/93641/3031

Ok first to fix this problem I would say make the backup a backup, I am sorry I know I am going to hear it over this, and part of it is the O-Line, Huard would not get sacked if the O-Line didn't fail but he also didn't get out of those sacks.

I am wondering what will happen with playcalling when a game manager is not in. Could herm let go and let a true starter make some play changes audibles if you will, I seem to remember but may be wrong but wasn't play calling different with Green as the starter, again please correct me if I am wrong.
The only good play call on this I see is the throw to Gonzo, I guess the one to Webb wasn't all bad. The thing is, is Huard being handicapped because he is Huard. Also with the sacks would another QB possibly seen someone open and got the ball away, or at worst would a QB with a little mobility have gotten away and picked up the 3rd and 3 and maybe the 3rd and 5 instead of falling before the defender got to him like Huard seemed to do on most of those plays, please big defender dont hurt me.
Although with this O-Line I can kinda see Huards point. I would myself be tired of being hit.

m0ef0e
11-06-2007, 04:34 PM
Ok first to fix this problem I would say make the backup a backup, I am sorry I know I am going to hear it over this, and part of it is the O-Line, Huard would not get sacked if the O-Line didn't fail but he also didn't get out of those sacks.

I am wondering what will happen with playcalling when a game manager is not in. Could herm let go and let a true starter make some play changes audibles if you will, I seem to remember but may be wrong but wasn't play calling different with Green as the starter, again please correct me if I am wrong.
The only good play call on this I see is the throw to Gonzo, I guess the one to Webb wasn't all bad. The thing is, is Huard being handicapped because he is Huard. Also with the sacks would another QB possibly seen someone open and got the ball away, or at worst would a QB with a little mobility have gotten away and picked up the 3rd and 3 and maybe the 3rd and 5 instead of falling before the defender got to him like Huard seemed to do on most of those plays, please big defender dont hurt me.
Although with this O-Line I can kinda see Huards point. I would myself be tired of being hit.

As long as the offense keeps sputtering along the way it has been, I am no longer going to disagree with sitting Huard. I still like the guy but our offensive line is really pissing me off and they need to step it up. If Brodie can be more mobile and avoid more pressure than Huard, we need him in simply so we can have a chance to convert on third downs-- which is when our pass protection ALWAYS breaks down... and at the worst possible time, at that. Sometimes, making a change at a key position, like the QB, prompts other players to improve.

chief31
11-07-2007, 12:05 PM
Ok. so we need a quarterback who is "elusive", or "mobile", right? Can we agree that Michael Vick was about as mobile and elusive as any quarterback who has ever played proffesional football? If not then at least a very mobile and elusive quarterback, right?

Casting Vicks passing statistics aside, as I am sure that we all expect more than that from our starting quarterback, let's look at Michael Vicks number of sacks, throughout his career, shall we?

'06 - 45 times, sixth most in the NFL.

'05 - 33 times, tied for fourth most.

'04 - 46 times, tied for second most.

'03 - (Only played in nine games.) 9. Atalntas other quarterbacks were sacked 29 times. A total of 38 times for Falcons' quarterbacks.

'02 - 33 times, tenth most.

Mobility most certainly does not transalte into a quarterback being sacked less often.



sacked 79 times

DrunkHillbilly
11-07-2007, 12:16 PM
Ok. so we need a quarterback who is "elusive", or "mobile", right? Can we agree that Michael Vick was about as mobile and elusive as any quarterback who has ever played proffesional football? If not then at least a very mobile and elusive quarterback, right?

Casting Vicks passing statistics aside, as I am sure that we all expect more than that from our starting quarterback, let's look at Michael Vicks number of sacks, throughout his career, shall we?

'06 - 45 times, sixth most in the NFL.

'05 - 33 times, tied for fourth most.

'04 - 46 times, tied for second most.

'03 - (Only played in nine games.) 9. Atalntas other quarterbacks were sacked 29 times. A total of 38 times for Falcons' quarterbacks.

'02 - 33 times, tenth most.

Mobility most certainly does not transalte into a quarterback being sacked less often.



sacked 79 times
Definetly does not but in the way these people are talking about being sacked it definetely does!!

chief31
11-07-2007, 12:35 PM
Definetly does not but in the way these people are talking about being sacked it definetely does!!

Oh yeah, I forgot about the staue coments. Take a look again...


'06 - 45 times, sixth most in the NFL.

'05 - 33 times, tied for fourth most.

'04 - 46 times, tied for second most.

'03 - (Only played in nine games.) 9. Atalntas other quarterbacks were sacked 29 times. A total of 38 times for Falcons' quarterbacks.

'02 - 33 times, tenth most.

Do you see the '03 stats? Those were statues getting sacked nearly as frequently as Vick did, the following season.

Fact - Give a quarterback some time to operate, and he will do well.

Furthermore, if you put him in fewer 'third and long' situations, then he might do better yet.

Include some form of a running game, and wow! the possibilities are endless.

Just for s***s and giggles, how many times have Tom Brady and Peyton Manning (two guys who are constantly revered as incredibly mobile guys. Lol.) have been sacked this season, shall we?

'07 - Brady, 10. (Less than half as many times as Huard.) Manning, 8. (One-third as many times as Huard.)

So, with a good offensive line, like the Patriots and Colts have, even statues can succeed. And with a poor offensive line, like Vick had, and Huard now has, even the most mobile quarterback who has ever played tends to get sacked alot.

I'll go so far as to point out that Huard has been making some very big plays after escaping tremendous pressure.

DrunkHillbilly
11-07-2007, 12:56 PM
My point was that I don't beleive these guys think Huard is very mobile therefor that's why they think he is being sacked so much.

Chiefster
11-07-2007, 01:13 PM
"O" line.

chief31
11-07-2007, 01:26 PM
My point was that I don't beleive these guys think Huard is very mobile therefor that's why they think he is being sacked so much.

Hence the point about the most mobile quarterback of all-time being one of the most sacked quarterbacks of his time. Mobility doesn't exclude someone from being sacked.

Chiefster
11-07-2007, 01:30 PM
Hence the point about the most mobile quarterback of all-time being one of the most sacked quarterbacks of his time. Mobility does exclude someone from being sacked.

Agreed, although being mobile does help; fear for ones life can be a great motivator. :D

hermhater
11-07-2007, 03:54 PM
Well I originally just wondered what the deal was with out inability to convert on 3rd downs.

I guess some blame could be put on Huard, but that wasn't the intention of the post.

I think it is bad game management by the coaching staff.

Why are we in these 3rd and long situations so often???

chief31
11-07-2007, 04:14 PM
staff.

Why are we in these 3rd and long situations so often???


Lack of a running game, and perhaps a need for a better offensive designer/coordinator.

hermhater
11-07-2007, 04:16 PM
Lack of a running game, and perhaps a need for a better offensive designer/coordinator.

Have we utilized the pitch this year with LJ?

Wouldn't that help get him outside before the D line was in the back field?

chief31
11-07-2007, 04:20 PM
Have we utilized the pitch this year with LJ?

Wouldn't that help get him outside before the D line was in the back field?

He has been so stubborn about running up the middle in the past, that I doubt he really has gained a knack for running to the outside. I remember him complaining about being asked to run outside last year.

hermhater
11-07-2007, 04:22 PM
He has been so stubborn about running up the middle in the past, that I doubt he really has gained a knack for running to the outside. I remember him complaining about being asked to run outside last year.

I am an LJ fan, but I am also pretty strict about the players performance.

Are you saying if the coach calls the play he won't even try to run outside?

Is LJ really that stubborn?

chief31
11-07-2007, 04:28 PM
I am an LJ fan, but I am also pretty strict about the players performance.

Are you saying if the coach calls the play he won't even try to run outside?

Is LJ really that stubborn?

I watched him do it a few times, last season. He would start to the outside, only to throw his arms to his sides and stomp out of bounds, without any contact at all.

I don't hate him as much as it might sound like at times. I just hate how his attitude seems to dictate his actions sometimes.

hermhater
11-07-2007, 04:31 PM
The guys attitude is understandable in my opinion.

He sat and watched HERM ignore the O line through the draft this year, knowing things were going downhill fast.

No wonder he held out for more money, HERM likes to get his O players killed.

DrunkHillbilly
11-07-2007, 04:54 PM
The guys attitude is understandable in my opinion.

He sat and watched HERM ignore the O line through the draft this year, knowing things were going downhill fast.

No wonder he held out for more money, HERM likes to get his O players killed.
One thing is for sure. You cant blame a guy for wanting some help, especially when he knew he was going to be the main cog in the offense!!

chief31
11-07-2007, 11:40 PM
The guys attitude is understandable in my opinion.

He sat and watched HERM ignore the O line through the draft this year, knowing things were going downhill fast.

No wonder he held out for more money, HERM likes to get his O players killed.

I certainly do not blame LJ for trying to get the money. I blame the Chiefs for giving it to him. I also don't blame him for the lack in production. I blame Herm for not addressing the needs of the offensive line.

But I don't credit LJ with knowing that he was going to struggle like he has this season. I remember, during the preseason, while Bennett and Smith were carrying the load, LJ telling the offensive line that those guys don't understand how to follow their blocks, but that he would be there soon. Meaning that I think he honestly believed that he was what was missing from the running game.


One thing is for sure. You cant blame a guy for wanting some help, especially when he knew he was going to be the main cog in the offense!!

Never would I blame a guy for that. But if you do sponge-up all of the money, then you can expect to get a less expensive bunch of "help". Still no excuse for the organizations mistakes though.

hermhater
11-07-2007, 11:48 PM
I certainly do not blame LJ for trying to get the money. I blame the Chiefs for giving it to him. I also don't blame him for the lack in production. I blame Herm for not addressing the needs of the offensive line.

But I don't credit LJ with knowing that he was going to struggle like he has this season. I remember, during the preseason, while Bennett and Smith were carrying the load, LJ telling the offensive line that those guys don't understand how to follow their blocks, but that he would be there soon. Meaning that I think he honestly believed that he was what was missing from the running game.



Never would I blame a guy for that. But if you do sponge-up all of the money, then you can expect to get a less expensive bunch of "help". Still no excuse for the organizations mistakes though.


Just gotta go and be all logical and ruin everyones argument, eh?

I see how you are.

:D

tornadospotter
11-07-2007, 11:51 PM
Yep!

If, and when, I get my 299,999 back the Sports Book I will bet it all on the Chiefs winning the Super Bowl!

I will always say the Chiefs are gonna win!

They have the best players in the NFL!

Just can't wait for HERM to unleash them!

GO CHIEFS!!!

Unleash them Herm, take off the shackels, open this offense up and BLOW THOSE DANG dONKEYS OUT OF ARROWHEAD, I HATE THE dONKS, ON SLIGHTLY LESS THAN THE fADERS. FIRE UP CHIEFS IT IS dONKEY WEEK!!!!!!!!!!
GO CHIEFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tornadospotter
11-08-2007, 12:08 AM
I certainly do not blame LJ for trying to get the money. I blame the Chiefs for giving it to him. I also don't blame him for the lack in production. I blame Herm for not addressing the needs of the offensive line.

But I don't credit LJ with knowing that he was going to struggle like he has this season. I remember, during the preseason, while Bennett and Smith were carrying the load, LJ telling the offensive line that those guys don't understand how to follow their blocks, but that he would be there soon. Meaning that I think he honestly believed that he was what was missing from the running game.

some of us might agree that the true LJ has been missing yet.

Never would I blame a guy for that. But if you do sponge-up all of the money, then you can expect to get a less expensive bunch of "help". Still no excuse for the organizations mistakes though.


I do not blame LJ for want his money, I feel that I am underpaid for the work that I do in my employment, course a lot less numbers in my salary, but anyway cp has known, that we were going to lose o line personel due to retirement and he needed to address those needs much better than what he did. Thats cp's fault I think, more than herms.

chief31
11-10-2007, 06:29 AM
The guys attitude is understandable in my opinion.



Sure. But he is supposed to be a professional and keep that attitude off of the field, and away from the lockerroom.


I do not blame LJ for want his money, I feel that I am underpaid for the work that I do in my employment, course a lot less numbers in my salary, but anyway cp has known, that we were going to lose o line personel due to retirement and he needed to address those needs much better than what he did. Thats cp's fault I think, more than herms.

A GM usually gets what the head coach wants, in the draft, and tries to get what the team needs, with head coaches requests in mind, through free-agency.

We brought in a starting offensive tackle through free agency, but nothing in the draft.

So, for me, the GM did his part, and the head coach didn't. And given their respective track-records, in regards to offensive linemen, I think the finger points even more toward Herm.

tornadospotter
11-10-2007, 09:30 AM
Sure. But he is supposed to be a professional and keep that attitude off of the field, and away from the lockerroom.



A GM usually gets what the head coach wants, in the draft, and tries to get what the team needs, with head coaches requests in mind, through free-agency.

We brought in a starting offensive tackle through free agency, but nothing in the draft.

So, for me, the GM did his part, and the head coach didn't. And given their respective track-records, in regards to offensive linemen, I think the finger points even more toward Herm.
I respectable disagree, The GM should be looking farther ahead than 1 year. The head coach should be thinking year to year. The GM knew we needed to address the O line, he has finale say on who is drafted. The Head Coach always says I just coach the players that we have.

chief31
11-10-2007, 12:50 PM
I respectable disagree, The GM should be looking farther ahead than 1 year. The head coach should be thinking year to year. The GM knew we needed to address the O line, he has finale say on who is drafted. The Head Coach always says I just coach the players that we have.

On the rare occaision that a GM doesn't draft someone that the head coach wanted it's news.

Plus, coaches are very much looking to the future with their draft picks. They get brought in to town with the expectation of building a team.

I ain't tryin' to fight about it. You are going to blame whover you want to. Just trying to show how a head coach is responsible, even if you would rather place the majority of the blame elsewhere.

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 01:05 PM
On the rare occaision that a GM doesn't draft someone that the head coach wanted it's news.

Plus, coaches are very much looking to the future with their draft picks. They get brought in to town with the expectation of building a team.

I ain't tryin' to fight about it. You are going to blame whover you want to. Just trying to show how a head coach is responsible, even if you would rather place the majority of the blame elsewhere.
Well, look at Herms track record for drafting offensive lineman!!!! Was that just an oversite on CP's end? He's been there for 19 years! I think he knew we needed O lineman even if Herm didn't think we did!

chief31
11-10-2007, 01:07 PM
Well, look at Herms track record for drafting offensive lineman!!!! Was that just an oversite on CP's end? He's been there for 19 years! I think he knew we needed O lineman even if Herm didn't think we did!

Agreed. I wouldn't say that CP should be let off the hook for that one, but more that Herm is the one with a general lack of concern for offensive line needs.

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 01:08 PM
I certainly do not blame LJ for trying to get the money. I blame the Chiefs for giving it to him. I also don't blame him for the lack in production. I blame Herm for not addressing the needs of the offensive line.

But I don't credit LJ with knowing that he was going to struggle like he has this season. I remember, during the preseason, while Bennett and Smith were carrying the load, LJ telling the offensive line that those guys don't understand how to follow their blocks, but that he would be there soon. Meaning that I think he honestly believed that he was what was missing from the running game.



Never would I blame a guy for that. But if you do sponge-up all of the money, then you can expect to get a less expensive bunch of "help". Still no excuse for the organizations mistakes though.
As I've said in the past. There were FA lineman out there that we didn't even give a look at! I also believe we were still under the cap at the beginning of the year. If that's the case, there is no excuse to not atleast take a look at a few guys.

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 01:10 PM
Agreed. I wouldn't say that CP should be let off the hook for that one, but more that Herm is the one with a general lack of concern for offensive line needs.
Who's running the organization here? Herm or CP? Clearly CP's fault especially when you have a first year coach with a limited amount of knowledge on YOUR organizations needs!

chief31
11-10-2007, 01:10 PM
As I've said in the past. There were FA lineman out there that we didn't even give a look at! I also believe we were still under the cap at the beginning of the year. If that's the case, there is no excuse to not atleast take a look at a few guys.

But if your head coach says that he has what he needs, then do you go ahead and trust him?

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 01:12 PM
But if your head coach says that he has what he needs, then do you go ahead and trust him?
Not if I know that our #1 player and the main piece of our offense depends on an O line! Never! Like I said, Herms record shows what he does and more importantly doesn't do.

chief31
11-10-2007, 01:16 PM
Not if I know that our #1 player and the main piece of our offense depends on an O line! Never! Like I said, Herms record shows what he does and more importantly doesn't do.

Look, you feel free to blame CP if you want. I don't care. But Herm Edwards is supposed to be "the great talent evaluator" and Carl is the money man. I refuse to blame Herms talent evaluation on someone else.

If you expect the GM to do the head coaches job, then why not just give that title to the GM?

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 01:21 PM
Look, you feel free to blame CP if you want. I don't care. But Herm Edwards is supposed to be "the great talent evaluator" and Carl is the money man. I refuse to blame Herms talent evaluation on someone else.

If you expect the GM to do the head coaches job, then why not just give that title to the GM?
You have said many times that Herm has NEVER paid any attention to the O line. How do you as a GM,( who has been in the league for 30 years and knows a little about football and talent ) not make it crystal clear to your coach that the offense must have a line to be productive? By the way, if the Chiefs some how end up winning the division, he will be in the running for coach of the year.

spiman
11-10-2007, 01:28 PM
And the President of the U.S.A..

chief31
11-10-2007, 01:30 PM
You have said many times that Herm has NEVER paid any attention to the O line. How do you as a GM,( who has been in the league for 30 years and knows a little about football and talent ) not make it crystal clear to your coach that the offense must have a line to be productive? By the way, if the Chiefs some how end up winning the division, he will be in the running for coach of the year.


That's a big responsibility to lay on the shoulders of a guy who is supposed to be basically a money man. I think that he gets alot of blame for things that aren't his responsibility though.

Choosing the players that your team needs is really a head coaches job. But I will glady grant you that CP should have been aware of the O-line situation, and made it clear to the head coach, as well.

I, however, will lay the brundt of that blame suarely on Herms shoulders.

hermhater
11-10-2007, 03:10 PM
But if your head coach says that he has what he needs, then do you go ahead and trust him?

What you do is not hire the guy in the first place!

So it is still CPs fault ultimately!
:mob:

chief31
11-10-2007, 04:07 PM
What you do is not hire the guy in the first place!

So it is still CPs fault ultimately!
:mob:

I would be willing to suggest that Lamar Hunt had a big hand in that decision.

hermhater
11-10-2007, 04:12 PM
Why?

Where him and Hermy buddies?

chief31
11-10-2007, 04:22 PM
Why?

Where him and Hermy buddies?

Herm has a six, or seven, year history with this organization. He was here as a talent scout, and as an assistant. And as involved with the team as Lamar was, I have to imagine that yes, he was probably pretty close with Herm.

timsatt1
11-10-2007, 04:58 PM
You have said many times that Herm has NEVER paid any attention to the O line. How do you as a GM,( who has been in the league for 30 years and knows a little about football and talent ) not make it crystal clear to your coach that the offense must have a line to be productive? By the way, if the Chiefs some how end up winning the division, he will be in the running for coach of the year.


you dont get coach of the year for winning one of the worse divisions in the nfl for that year. LOL.

...and we SHOULD win our division. I think we will.

Chiefster
11-10-2007, 08:32 PM
you dont get coach of the year for winning one of the worse divisions in the nfl for that year. LOL.

...and we SHOULD win our division. I think we will.

Agreed!

DrunkHillbilly
11-10-2007, 09:01 PM
you dont get coach of the year for winning one of the worse divisions in the nfl for that year. LOL.

...and we SHOULD win our division. I think we will.
He's already been mentioned!!

timsatt1
11-10-2007, 11:26 PM
He's already been mentioned!!


i stick to my statement

rbedgood
11-11-2007, 02:19 AM
I think if the Chiefs hold strong and stay ahead of San Diego for the division, Herm should be considered for coach of the year...but to me the coach of the year should go to either the Detroit or Green Bay coach at this point...is this award NFL or is it conference?!

DrunkHillbilly
11-11-2007, 11:36 AM
I think if the Chiefs hold strong and stay ahead of San Diego for the division, Herm should be considered for coach of the year...but to me the coach of the year should go to either the Detroit or Green Bay coach at this point...is this award NFL or is it conference?!
How about Cleveland???

rbedgood
11-12-2007, 05:37 AM
How about Cleveland???

Before the Pittsburgh game I would agree with you...now I'll reserve judgement until I see a few more weeks.

wolfpack
11-12-2007, 09:08 AM
Hermmie,,,coach of the year,,:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: who ever said that should be a comedian. he would make a ton of money.