Postgame @Seattle new L same mistakes BOB SUTTON IS STILL A JOKE

[matthewschiefs]

You would think at some point they would get tired of this crap and CHANGE SOMETHING

Yes our DBs are not the best but when you constantly gameplan to give the QB all freaking day to throw that's just dumb. But Bob Sutton continues to do it because god forbid we make an adjustment. Dude is a joke. Needs to be fired NOW. At this point what can it hurt we have the worst d in the league. GET HIM OFF THE SIDELINE good freaking lord.

Offense slow start didn't help matters at all. Mahomes missed Kelce who was wide open for a TD. That hurt to. So they have to take some blame on this as well.

You can pretty much just assume another 1 and done. Our head coach seems delighted to keep a DC who is clearly clueless.

On to the Faiders. SCREW YOU BOB SUTTON YOU FREAKING JOKE

[Seek]

I didn't think our secondary played as bad as normal other than Nelson. rookie mistakes were made. but in the end, the big plays were when Wilson ran for first downs.

[Chiefster]

We saw tonight why we will not advance in the playoffs. Doesn't matter what our seeding or whether or not we get a first round bye. If your defense is as hapless as this at this point in the season then it will be yet another early playoff exit.

[brdempsey69]

Until proven wrong, I have suspected that this team is a year away, because that Defense needs a new DC, plus we need to load up on DB's this off-season. Having Berry back is just not enough to make a difference. In the 2nd half, they just got lit up. Same thing will happen in the post-season. Sutton MUST GO !!

I still believe the loss of Kareem Hunt has really hurt this Offense -- something is just not right. The lost fumbles certainly hurt them tonight, as well.

[matthewschiefs]

Until proven wrong, I have suspected that this team is a year away, because that Defense needs a new DC, plus we need to load up on DB's this off-season. Having Berry back is just not enough to make a difference. In the 2nd half, they just got lit up. Same thing will happen in the post-season.

The only question will Reid make the change or will he once again stubbornly bring Sutton back. The change should have been made a year ago

[brdempsey69]

The only question will Reid make the change or will he once again stubbornly bring Sutton back. The change should have been made a year ago

If Reid's stupid enough to bring back Sutton, then it tells me that Reid has no interest in winning a SB.

[TopekaRoy]

Offense still put up 31 points against a pretty good defense, although some of that was in Prevent/garbage time. I don't think losing Hunt hurts us that much, but when you add Ware and Watkins to the list, that hurts a lot. West and Williams have done a good job of picking up the slack.

Defensively, I'm not sure how much Sutton can do. When you blitz the LBs, you get gashed up the middle with a long rush. When the DBs play zone, they don't know where to be and opposing QBs hit wide open receivers in the gaps and seems. When they play man they can't cover without getting called for PI. Almost nobody seems to know how to tackle, and blockers don't just push them out of the way; they knock them down.

Yes, I agree Sutton has to go but if we upgrade the Defense in the draft and FA, is management going to say, "Now Bob has the guys he needs. Let's give him another year to show what he can do with REAL talent."? I really hope not. But next year we will be starting the season with a new DC and and a bunch of rookies and Free Agents all having to learn a completely new scheme. Certainly they should be able to pick it up and gel after 4 or 5 games, but even with all the changes we know have to be made, next year's defense might not look much better than this year's early on.

[matthewschiefs]

Offense still put up 31 points against a pretty good defense, although some of that was in Prevent/garbage time. I don't think losing Hunt hurts us that much, but when you add Ware and Watkins to the list, that hurts a lot. West and Williams have done a good job of picking up the slack.

Defensively, I'm not sure how much Sutton can do. When you blitz the LBs, you get gashed up the middle with a long rush. When the DBs play zone, they don't know where to be and opposing QBs hit wide open receivers in the gaps and seems. When they play man they can't cover without getting called for PI. Almost nobody seems to know how to tackle, and blockers don't just push them out of the way; they knock them down.

Yes, I agree Sutton has to go but if we upgrade the Defense in the draft and FA, is management going to say, "Now Bob has the guys he needs. Let's give him another year to show what he can do with REAL talent."? I really hope not. But next year we will be starting the season with a new DC and and a bunch of rookies and Free Agents all having to learn a completely new scheme. Certainly they should be able to pick it up and gel after 4 or 5 games, but even with all the changes we know have to be made, next year's defense might not look much better than this year's early on.

Here's my thing. Is he even getting the best out of the talent currently on the team? I don't think he is.

While I think that we can all agree we don't have the most talent in the world on D is the talent that we do have being put in the best position to WIN. That's is after all the job of a coach.

An example Anthony Hitchens. He was a pretty solid player in Dallas. Not so much this year. Did he suddenly forget how to play?

Many people have noticed that they have not gotten the same production out of Houston as in the past. Did he also suddenly forget how to play?

We drafted all Defense last year. If vets are not being as productive in Sutton's system how can we expect rookies to?

I posted in a thread last week the run defense rankings during Sutton's time. It's horrible. We have not progressed in any way if anything we have regressed. The simple truth is I don't know if we can say we don't have real talent on D. Maybe the talent is just not being put in a position to succeed. If that means a few games of working out some kinks then totally worth it. We have the worst D already in the league. I mean could it really get worse. IF Sutton was fired right here and now what harm could it really do? Just blows me away that the guy is still employed

[Chiefster]

Offense still put up 31 points against a pretty good defense, although some of that was in Prevent/garbage time. I don't think losing Hunt hurts us that much, but when you add Ware and Watkins to the list, that hurts a lot. West and Williams have done a good job of picking up the slack.

Defensively, I'm not sure how much Sutton can do. When you blitz the LBs, you get gashed up the middle with a long rush. When the DBs play zone, they don't know where to be and opposing QBs hit wide open receivers in the gaps and seems. When they play man they can't cover without getting called for PI. Almost nobody seems to know how to tackle, and blockers don't just push them out of the way; they knock them down.

Yes, I agree Sutton has to go but if we upgrade the Defense in the draft and FA, is management going to say, "Now Bob has the guys he needs. Let's give him another year to show what he can do with REAL talent."? I really hope not. But next year we will be starting the season with a new DC and and a bunch of rookies and Free Agents all having to learn a completely new scheme. Certainly they should be able to pick it up and gel after 4 or 5 games, but even with all the changes we know have to be made, next year's defense might not look much better than this year's early on.


Here's my thing. Is he even getting the best out of the talent currently on the team? I don't think he is.

While I think that we can all agree we don't have the most talent in the world on D is the talent that we do have being put in the best position to WIN. That's is after all the job of a coach.

An example Anthony Hitchens. He was a pretty solid player in Dallas. Not so much this year. Did he suddenly forget how to play?

Many people have noticed that they have not gotten the same production out of Houston as in the past. Did he also suddenly forget how to play?

We drafted all Defense last year. If vets are not being as productive in Sutton's system how can we expect rookies to?

I posted in a thread last week the run defense rankings during Sutton's time. It's horrible. We have not progressed in any way if anything we have regressed. The simple truth is I don't know if we can say we don't have real talent on D. Maybe the talent is just not being put in a position to succeed. If that means a few games of working out some kinks then totally worth it. We have the worst D already in the league. I mean could it really get worse. IF Sutton was fired right here and now what harm could it really do? Just blows me away that the guy is still employed

The case for firing Sutton now rather than later has merit; I'm convinced that a defensive assistant could not possibly do worse. I think Roy is also correct in that the problem isn't immediately fixable, and your assertion that it would ultimately be worth it to fix the problem is undeniably correct IMHO. In short, I have to agree that the problem is more Sutton than the players.

[Chiefs4life24]

I just hope we dont end up firing Sutton and it end up being the Players thats the problem

[matthewschiefs]

I just hope we dont end up firing Sutton and it end up being the Players thats the problem

Keep in mind we've had different players and had the same problems. Like the run D. Been near the bottom every year he's been the DC but 1. I find it hard to believe all our guys we've had over the years just couldn't play

[brdempsey69]

I just hope we dont end up firing Sutton and it end up being the Players thats the problem

If we rewind back to 1989 -- 1991 when Bill Cowher was the DC, I believe Cowher could get better results with what we have now.

[matthewschiefs]

More on the case against Sutton

Saw this on another site.

The defense under Sutton has gotten worse every year.
Points allowed
2014 - 281
2015 - 287
2016 - 311
2017 - 339
2018 - 418 (so far)

[jason1981]

The one thing that not Sutton's fault which would be a hige help is learn how to fricken TACKLE. Our defense would be much improved if they just tackle. One guy freaken just dove to his knees then 3 other guys missed on the same freacken play. I think our biggest weakness is tackling. Until you solve that it doesnt matter who the DC is.

[TopekaRoy]

I just hope we dont end up firing Sutton and it end up being the Players that's the problem
I won't miss Sutton either way. He has shown enough incompetence no matter who is on the field. On the other hand...


The one thing that not Sutton's fault which would be a hige help is learn how to fricken TACKLE. Our defense would be much improved if they just tackle. One guy freaken just dove to his knees then 3 other guys missed on the same freacken play. I think our biggest weakness is tackling. Until you solve that it doesnt matter who the DC is.

This!

Sutton is not making/missing weak arm tackles and getting knocked over by RBs and blockers. He is not getting Pass Interference penalties because he didn't turn his head to look for the ball. When players are abandoning their assignments because they don't trust their teammates to make a solo tackle, or there is blown coverage because they aren't communicating, you can say "that's coaching" but players should know how to do the fundamentals by the time they get to this level. Scheme is on the coach, but execution is on the players. We have some great linebackers but they can't be everywhere. Teams are going to pick on the weakest links and then those players look even worse because they are getting targeted more.

[brdempsey69]

^^Personally, I believe that the shoddy tackling & pass-coverage does come down to coaching. I mentioned Bill Cowher in my previous post & his philosophy was "if you can't tackle, you can't play defense", and poor tackling was an evil he would not accept or tolerate.

[matthewschiefs]

The missed tackles is something that I would agree is mostly on the players. They have to be able to tackle.

But the fact they have been going on all year does reflect some on Sutton. It's something that is the coaches job to fix. So he does have to share in the blame seeing they have not been able to fix the issue.

[Eydugstr]

Finally got to sit and watch a replay of the game. Very disappointed. That's two games in a row when we could've sealed up the AFC West and the #1 playoff seed and didn't get it done. We're pretty fortunate that other teams screwed up just enough to give us another shot, and yes Oakland is completely screwed up, but there's still enough talent on their roster to win. We should not be in that position. We should've won both of the last two games, and let everyone else scrap for playoff spots.

Far as I'm concerned if we fire Sutton, want to see the entire secondary to get shown the door, too. Sutton is ultimately responsible, and find it very likely that he either resigns, retires or is fired. But I don't want to see a situation where the players turn around and play as cruddy as they did this season for the next coach. It might be the only way to change the culture of the defense into something better.

[Seek]

Finally got to sit and watch a replay of the game. Very disappointed. That's two games in a row when we could've sealed up the AFC West and the #1 playoff seed and didn't get it done. We're pretty fortunate that other teams screwed up just enough to give us another shot, and yes Oakland is completely screwed up, but there's still enough talent on their roster to win. We should not be in that position. We should've won both of the last two games, and let everyone else scrap for playoff spots.

Far as I'm concerned if we fire Sutton, want to see the entire secondary to get shown the door, too. Sutton is ultimately responsible, and find it very likely that he either resigns, retires or is fired. But I don't want to see a situation where the players turn around and play as cruddy as they did this season for the next coach. It might be the only way to change the culture of the defense into something better.

Radio heads here in KC kind of think Andy is stepping over Sutton. They think the reason Ward hasn't played before this week was because Sutton does not like Rookies and prefers a veteran. Andy stepped in and benched Ron Parker and Scandrick. However, he argued with the press when asked if it was a change. He said Ward was Fuller Back up so that is why he played... Usually when Andy gets that mad, is because they are fishing for him to make a comment they know is true and he is upset they are asking him to make it public. Such was the case when Houston, Ford an Berry missed OTA's last year.

Then he made comments after the game saying, us Coaches have got to put them in the place to make the play. Making it sound like he is aware Sutton wasn't doing that.

So I am hoping Sutton is on the hot seat.

[Eydugstr]

Radio heads here in KC kind of think Andy is stepping over Sutton. They think the reason Ward hasn't played before this week was because Sutton does not like Rookies and prefers a veteran. Andy stepped in and benched Ron Parker and Scandrick. However, he argued with the press when asked if it was a change. He said Ward was Fuller Back up so that is why he played... Usually when Andy gets that mad, is because they are fishing for him to make a comment they know is true and he is upset they are asking him to make it public. Such was the case when Houston, Ford an Berry missed OTA's last year.

Then he made comments after the game saying, us Coaches have got to put them in the place to make the play. Making it sound like he is aware Sutton wasn't doing that.

So I am hoping Sutton is on the hot seat.

Well my post wasn't speculating about whatever drama was going on between Reid, Sutton or the local media...

Is this some way of defending the secondary roster? The players know better. They know they're missing the tackles, they know they're getting burnt in coverage. If Reid is micromanaging Sutton but ignoring what the players are doing, and keeps most of the secondary if or when Sutton is shown the door, don't be surprised when they turn right around and do the same stuff under the next guy, then wait for him to get fired, too.

That's why I'm saying if Sutton is going to be fired or resigns, send the secondary out the door, too, then start with an all new group under the next coach.

[Seek]

Well my post wasn't speculating about whatever drama was going on between Reid, Sutton or the local media...

Is this some way of defending the secondary roster? The players know better. They know they're missing the tackles, they know they're getting burnt in coverage. If Reid is micromanaging Sutton but ignoring what the players are doing, and keeps most of the secondary if or when Sutton is shown the door, don't be surprised when they turn right around and do the same stuff under the next guy, then wait for him to get fired, too.

That's why I'm saying if Sutton is going to be fired or resigns, send the secondary out the door, too, then start with an all new group under the next coach.

Yes, it is speculation, but all previous speculation is that Andy is loyal to his coaches and he won't fire Sutton. The sudden changes in players may be a sign that Andy is closer to an end with Sutton.

The thing that gets me the most, is our linebackers... They seem to be asked to read and hen react and rarely are seen making a play at the line of scrimmage. They are making the tackles as the runners come to them. Is that all scheme or the players just second quessing what their role is.

[brdempsey69]

Well my post wasn't speculating about whatever drama was going on between Reid, Sutton or the local media...

Is this some way of defending the secondary roster? The players know better. They know they're missing the tackles, they know they're getting burnt in coverage. If Reid is micromanaging Sutton but ignoring what the players are doing, and keeps most of the secondary if or when Sutton is shown the door, don't be surprised when they turn right around and do the same stuff under the next guy, then wait for him to get fired, too.

That's why I'm saying if Sutton is going to be fired or resigns, send the secondary out the door, too, then start with an all new group under the next coach.

To me that would depend on who the new guy is and what type of personna he has. If the new guy had the personna of a guy like Bill Cowher, then they wouldn't keep doing the same thing and getting away with it for very long. If the new guy has the same personna as Sutton does, then you're probably right.

[Eydugstr]

To me that would depend on who the new guy is and what type of personna he has. If the new guy had the personna of a guy like Bill Cowher, then they wouldn't keep doing the same thing and getting away with it for very long. If the new guy has the same personna as Sutton does, then you're probably right.

Would absolutely love for a Bill Cowher type to come in the door, run a 3-4 to that same aggressive level that he did. That defense he had in '90-'91 was a joy to watch. It's the only defense I've ever watched where every time the other team kicked a field goal, people actually asked every time "Wonder if it'll get blocked..." and actually have a shot of it happening.

Is it just me or is that whole situation with Sutton beginning to feel like '03 all over again with Greg Robinson? Granted back then we got Gunther Cunningham to run the D (Well liked coach, by players and fans alike) but the front office didn't really help out Gunther back then, either. Whoever we find to replace Sutton, we can't hand him this bunch of CB's and expect miracles.

[brdempsey69]

Would absolutely love for a Bill Cowher type to come in the door, run a 3-4 to that same aggressive level that he did. That defense he had in '90-'91 was a joy to watch. It's the only defense I've ever watched where every time the other team kicked a field goal, people actually asked every time "Wonder if it'll get blocked..." and actually have a shot of it happening.

Is it just me or is that whole situation with Sutton beginning to feel like '03 all over again with Greg Robinson? Granted back then we got Gunther Cunningham to run the D (Well liked coach, by players and fans alike) but the front office didn't really help out Gunther back then, either. Whoever we find to replace Sutton, we can't hand him this bunch of CB's and expect miracles.

No, it's not just you. People have been posting this elsewhere on the web since the start of the season about it being 2003 all over again. And I suspect they will load up on DB's this off-season via the draft & possibly a couple via FA.