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slc chief
11-14-2008, 09:41 PM
Chiefs’ offensive line becomes a force to reckon with

By KENT BABB

The Kansas City Star


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Herm and Thigpen talk about the offense http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2008/07/15.jpgVIDEO (http://pointers.audiovideoweb.com/stcasx/il80win10138/111308_chiefs2_sports_gls.wmv/play.asx)
Adam Teicher's vlog | A Chiefs win? http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2008/07/15.jpgVIDEO (http://videos.kansascity.com/vmix_hosted_apps/p/media?id=2388173)
Chiefs notebook: McBride removed from injury list (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/story/889833.html)
Brian Waters looks at it this way: All that trouble the Chiefs endured at the start of the season, all the changes on offense, all the experiments that didn’t work — well, that helped this team.
Even the nightmare games, at Atlanta and Carolina, thickened the Chiefs’ skin and helped the offensive line learn from a rash of mistakes and sacks and a general feeling of chaos. The Chiefs became a passing team out of necessity, and that wasn’t a good look for this offensive line.
“We were just lacking all the way across the board,” Waters said this week. “We didn’t practice doing 40 or 50 pass plays. We just weren’t built that way. Those games have benefited us now because we can be who we are. We’re a better pass-protecting team now because we had to be. We had to adjust to that. Now it’s starting to show a little bit.”
The line still has work to do, but quarterback Tyler Thigpen doesn’t have to run for his life the same as Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard. The Chiefs allowed 22 sacks in their first seven games. In the last two, they’ve allowed two, both of them on Thigpen scrambles that ended close to the line of scrimmage.
Part of the line’s improved stat line is because, yes, Thigpen can run — and not just to avoid sacks. More than Croyle and Huard, anyway. And, yes, Thigpen is the product of an offense that relies on the passer’s quick release, meaning the line no longer has to block for four and five seconds while the Chiefs quarterback looks downfield.
Instead, linemen said the progress on offense has helped no group more than a unit seen as a weakness much of the last two seasons.
“We have confidence in our quarterback. It just gives you piece of mind,” right tackle Damion McIntosh said. “I get to do my job, and I know we’ll be able to move it downfield. You’ve got to put your trust in other guys to make plays.”
Which had been part of the problem. Running backs and receivers hadn’t been holding up their end of the blocking bargain, and that made the line look bad. And linemen had their own problems, from position changes to inexperience. Left tackle Branden Albert is a rookie, moved from guard, a position he played at the University of Virginia.
Center Rudy Niswanger is a first-year starter, and right guard Adrian Jones used to be a tackle. McIntosh had played left tackle the previous nine seasons. It took time for all that movement to settle and for the Chiefs linemen to get comfortable with themselves and as a group.
“We got a little bit out of whack,” Waters said.
McIntosh’s switch was a frustrating one. He made the move for the greater good, Albert’s potential and coaches’ belief he could anchor the line for years. McIntosh accepted the shift, but it took weeks for him to begin to feel comfortable.
The group came along and grew together, the same five men who had endured the bad times and grown calluses. The Chiefs had plenty of problems, but consistency on the offensive line wasn’t among them.
Other than one game, when Albert sat out because of a dislocated right elbow, Kansas City has started the same five linemen in each game.
But now that’s changing. Jones injured his ankle in last Sunday’s loss at San Diego, and he’s unlikely to play this week against New Orleans. That will shuffle Wade Smith into the starting lineup, and the 1-8 Chiefs aren’t at a point where change is anything but frightening.
The team is telling itself Smith and the line will make it through Sunday. The Chiefs are saying there won’t be a regression. That there won’t be more than a sack or two, with chemistry to blame.
Regardless, the Chiefs are moving forward. They think the line learned too much during all those bad times to turn back now. They think the system and Thigpen have come too far to suffer a setback.
It’s turned into a feeling the Chiefs didn’t possess even as recently as four weeks ago.
“We’re more confident,” McIntosh said. “It’s not one of those times where you’re frustrated all the time. That’s the thing: We’re not frustrated. We’ve got the guys who can make the plays, and they are making plays now.”

slc chief
11-14-2008, 09:45 PM
i still say we need to draft and pick some up in free agency i hope herm does not turn a blind eye to the fact that we need some more talent in this departmant

jap1
11-15-2008, 12:57 AM
i still say we need to draft and pick some up in free agency i hope herm does not turn a blind eye to the fact that we need some more talent in this departmant

At the very least, we need to draft a new G to replace Waters (he has a max of 1-2 more years left if he decides to stick through the rebuild). And they front office would be foolish to think that McIntosh will hold up for more than one more year (this is the first season he hasnt been on the injury report for most of the season).

On second thought, the front office often does act VERY foolish. Now Im depressed ...

jmlamerson
11-15-2008, 06:49 PM
Chiefs’ offensive line becomes a force to reckon with

By KENT BABB

The Kansas City Star


function PopupPic(sPicURL, sHeight, sWidth) { window.open( "http://media.kansascity.com/static/popup.html?"+sPicURL, "", "resizable=1,HEIGHT=" +sHeight+ ",WIDTH=" +sWidth); }

Herm and Thigpen talk about the offense http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2008/07/15.jpgVIDEO (http://pointers.audiovideoweb.com/stcasx/il80win10138/111308_chiefs2_sports_gls.wmv/play.asx)
Adam Teicher's vlog | A Chiefs win? http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2008/07/15.jpgVIDEO (http://videos.kansascity.com/vmix_hosted_apps/p/media?id=2388173)
Chiefs notebook: McBride removed from injury list (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/story/889833.html)Brian Waters looks at it this way: All that trouble the Chiefs endured at the start of the season, all the changes on offense, all the experiments that didn’t work — well, that helped this team.
Even the nightmare games, at Atlanta and Carolina, thickened the Chiefs’ skin and helped the offensive line learn from a rash of mistakes and sacks and a general feeling of chaos. The Chiefs became a passing team out of necessity, and that wasn’t a good look for this offensive line.
“We were just lacking all the way across the board,” Waters said this week. “We didn’t practice doing 40 or 50 pass plays. We just weren’t built that way. Those games have benefited us now because we can be who we are. We’re a better pass-protecting team now because we had to be. We had to adjust to that. Now it’s starting to show a little bit.”
The line still has work to do, but quarterback Tyler Thigpen doesn’t have to run for his life the same as Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard. The Chiefs allowed 22 sacks in their first seven games. In the last two, they’ve allowed two, both of them on Thigpen scrambles that ended close to the line of scrimmage.
Part of the line’s improved stat line is because, yes, Thigpen can run — and not just to avoid sacks. More than Croyle and Huard, anyway. And, yes, Thigpen is the product of an offense that relies on the passer’s quick release, meaning the line no longer has to block for four and five seconds while the Chiefs quarterback looks downfield.
Instead, linemen said the progress on offense has helped no group more than a unit seen as a weakness much of the last two seasons.
“We have confidence in our quarterback. It just gives you piece of mind,” right tackle Damion McIntosh said. “I get to do my job, and I know we’ll be able to move it downfield. You’ve got to put your trust in other guys to make plays.”
Which had been part of the problem. Running backs and receivers hadn’t been holding up their end of the blocking bargain, and that made the line look bad. And linemen had their own problems, from position changes to inexperience. Left tackle Branden Albert is a rookie, moved from guard, a position he played at the University of Virginia.
Center Rudy Niswanger is a first-year starter, and right guard Adrian Jones used to be a tackle. McIntosh had played left tackle the previous nine seasons. It took time for all that movement to settle and for the Chiefs linemen to get comfortable with themselves and as a group.
“We got a little bit out of whack,” Waters said.
McIntosh’s switch was a frustrating one. He made the move for the greater good, Albert’s potential and coaches’ belief he could anchor the line for years. McIntosh accepted the shift, but it took weeks for him to begin to feel comfortable.
The group came along and grew together, the same five men who had endured the bad times and grown calluses. The Chiefs had plenty of problems, but consistency on the offensive line wasn’t among them.
Other than one game, when Albert sat out because of a dislocated right elbow, Kansas City has started the same five linemen in each game.
But now that’s changing. Jones injured his ankle in last Sunday’s loss at San Diego, and he’s unlikely to play this week against New Orleans. That will shuffle Wade Smith into the starting lineup, and the 1-8 Chiefs aren’t at a point where change is anything but frightening.
The team is telling itself Smith and the line will make it through Sunday. The Chiefs are saying there won’t be a regression. That there won’t be more than a sack or two, with chemistry to blame.
Regardless, the Chiefs are moving forward. They think the line learned too much during all those bad times to turn back now. They think the system and Thigpen have come too far to suffer a setback.
It’s turned into a feeling the Chiefs didn’t possess even as recently as four weeks ago.
“We’re more confident,” McIntosh said. “It’s not one of those times where you’re frustrated all the time. That’s the thing: We’re not frustrated. We’ve got the guys who can make the plays, and they are making plays now.”

Please, we're running a spread offense specifically because this line isn't very good. Our RBs are dropping like flies trying to run behind this line. We've lost two QBs already this year to this line.

We need to draft at least three linemen (RG, RT, and LG to replace Waters when he's gone). If we pretend that players like Albai Jones or McIntosh are any good, we'll never have a top 15 offense.

chief31
11-15-2008, 06:55 PM
Please, we're running a spread offense specifically because this line isn't very good. Our RBs are dropping like flies trying to run behind this line. We've lost two QBs already this year to this line.

We need to draft at least three linemen (RG, RT, and LG to replace Waters when he's gone). If we pretend that players like Albai Jones or McIntosh are any good, we'll never have a top 15 offense.

I agree. But, I have to give credit where it is due. Alibi and McIntosh have been protecting a whole lot better than at the start of the season.

Canada
11-15-2008, 06:59 PM
Please, we're running a spread offense specifically because this line isn't very good. Our RBs are dropping like flies trying to run behind this line. We've lost two QBs already this year to this line.

We need to draft at least three linemen (RG, RT, and LG to replace Waters when he's gone). If we pretend that players like Albai Jones or McIntosh are any good, we'll never have a top 15 offense.

I am not saying we don't need to draft O line, but you seriously don't see any improvement in these guys? Give them some credit man. We are improving and you have to find a reason why we still suck. That's just sad man. Have a beer and cheer up :bananen_smilies046:

jmlamerson
11-15-2008, 07:04 PM
I agree. But, I have to give credit where it is due. Alibi and McIntosh have been protecting a whole lot better than at the start of the season.

We're running an offense that doesn't do very well in the NFL sprecifically because the right side of our line isn't very good. Are they able to hold for longer than they would in a normal offense? Sure. But they're still averaging two sacks a game over the past three games.

We've changed the scheme to fit their lack of talent. If we were running the same scheme they would still be playing as awfully as they were.

jmlamerson
11-15-2008, 07:07 PM
I am not saying we don't need to draft O line, but you seriously don't see any improvement in these guys? Give them some credit man. We are improving and you have to find a reason why we still suck. That's just sad man. Have a beer and cheer up :bananen_smilies046:
I'm not saying they they aren't playing better, but I credit Gailey's scheme switching more than I do their becoming more talented.

If they go the rest of the season only giving up 2 or less sacks a game, then I'll be very impressed.

And I drink whicksy, whether I'm sad or happy.

chief31
11-15-2008, 07:10 PM
We're running an offense that doesn't do very well in the NFL sprecifically because the right side of our line isn't very good. Are they able to hold for longer than they would in a normal offense? Sure. But they're still averaging two sacks a game over the past three games.

We've changed the scheme to fit their lack of talent. If we were running the same scheme they would still be playing as awfully as they were.

Seriously. Hate all you want. But I am seeing them hold their blocks better, with my own two eyes.

I hope hat hose two are replaced. But I see them playing better, and won't trash on them for it.

Syatem, or no system, They were getting beat often earlier, in man-on-man situations. Now they aren't.

Over the past two games, I didn't see either of them do a poor job on any play. (Pass)

As I said, I do agree that they need replaced. But when I see them playing better on the field, I will admit it.

Canada
11-15-2008, 07:10 PM
I'm not saying they they aren't playing better, but I credit Gailey's scheme switching more than I do their becoming more talented.

If they go the rest of the season only giving up 2 or less sacks a game, then I'll be very impressed.

And I drink whicksy, whether I'm sad or happy.

Just sayin' man, u always find something wrong. Scheme or no scheme the players still have to execute and they are. At least with the way they are playing right now we can enjoy 3 quarters of football instead of getting blown out right away!! :D

I am not allowed to drink whiskey....it makes me punchy!!

jmlamerson
11-15-2008, 09:05 PM
Just sayin' man, u always find something wrong. Scheme or no scheme the players still have to execute and they are. At least with the way they are playing right now we can enjoy 3 quarters of football instead of getting blown out right away!! :D

I am not allowed to drink whiskey....it makes me punchy!!

I'm not trying to be negative all the time - really. I just think that the worst thing we can do now is think that our offense is solved, so let's focus on the D. I think Gailey and Thigpen are doing spectacularly out there right now, but that our offense is being run out of desparation, not choice. Poeple who are posting things like: "Offense is looking good, we can focus this offseason on our defense" are missing the point, I think. I still don't think we have a greater priority this offseason than rebuilding our OL, despite what I'll fully admit is improved play.

Yeah, ever since Gailey and Thigpen starting running the spread, and we stopped playing Herm-ball, we've been a lot more competitive. That's because we've been matching our scheme to our personnel, and not vice versa. We've been doing the opposite on defense, incidentally.

Whisky puts me in a punchy mood too, but I'm OK with that.

Canada
11-16-2008, 10:24 AM
I agree, I started my last few posts with "I still think we need to draft O line" I just like to see these guys get a little creditfor an improved game. No matter how it happened or why, they are a little better and I am likin it with stinkin fubbalo coming to town next week!!