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slc chief
12-23-2008, 09:13 AM
i hope baltimore can not resign him. and we can pick him up he would make a huge differance in our defense. he is a outstanding lb and is young to. if he is available i think he is a must have for kc

balto
12-23-2008, 09:45 AM
Wouldn't we get him to play DE?

I also like Suggs. How great would it be to bring both him and Ray Lewis to KC?

Lewis has a good 4-5 years left in the tank and could be that Leadership guy our D really really needs ATM. Plus he would probably cost us less then Vilma would I'm thinking.

Sn@keIze
12-23-2008, 12:48 PM
Wouldn't we get him to play DE?

I also like Suggs. How great would it be to bring both him and Ray Lewis to KC?

Lewis has a good 4-5 years left in the tank and could be that Leadership guy our D really really needs ATM. Plus he would probably cost us less then Vilma would I'm thinking.
Suggs would be Awesome....

Ray is decent but past him prime( Although better than our LB core now). Next year would be his 14th year(I think), to old for a rebuilding team.

Besides, I think Ravens just signed him an extension.

jap1
12-23-2008, 02:37 PM
Wouldn't we get him to play DE?

I also like Suggs. How great would it be to bring both him and Ray Lewis to KC?

Lewis has a good 4-5 years left in the tank and could be that Leadership guy our D really really needs ATM. Plus he would probably cost us less then Vilma would I'm thinking.

How about a DL of (right to left):
Suggs; Dorsey; Haynesworth; Hali/Babin :yahoo:

That would take us from one of the worst front fours to one of the best. It would also give Dorsey someone to be mentored by. Also, I think a Hali/Babin combo would be good enough with all the attention the other three would command. I mean you cannot double team both Suggs and Haynesworth. Hopefully Dorsey will get into better shape next year, and as it is he gets a lot of double teams. Hali is good all around. Babin gets a good jump on passing downs (he overpursues way too much against runs).

With our cap space this is may be feasible, and allow us to use our 1st rounder on either a Tackle or trade down and get a LB and Guard. Our defense becomes respectable instantly.

Probably a pipe dream, but cant a brother dream!!!

balto
12-23-2008, 05:41 PM
MAN that would be a dream D-line.

you make me think about this.

I have always said we need to get Suggs/peppers and Vilma/another good MLB in FA, BUT

your right a Suggs and Haynesworth FA signing would allow us to trade down (even like 5 spots) to around 7th and draft Rey Maualuga then we would also have an extra pick (3rd overall is 2200 draft points, 7th overall would be 1500 points plus the teams 2nd rounder which is 510 points that woudl equal 2010 draft points)

Yes we would be giving up 200 points, but that might have to be what we give up to move down. If we woudl draft Rey Maualuga with 3rd overall why not move down and gain a 2nd?

So we have the best front line in the NFL and now we have a stud MLB for years to come.

texaschief
12-23-2008, 06:40 PM
Suggs, Vilma and Asomugha would be the best return on their investment. They're all going to be under 28 next season and worth building the foundation with. Lewis and Peppers will be over 30 next season. Haynesworth will demand an enormous contract next season and he'd undoubtedly offer an upgrade at DT. I just think Tank and Dorsey are on track to be good DTs without having to spend money on a huge contract.

Suggs takes care of the DE spot. Vilma takes care of the MLB spot. Aso could be considered a luxury, but having him opposite Flowers would just be sick. Then, you can emphatically say the Chiefs are 4 deep at the CB spot with Carr and Leggett.

Then the Chiefs could take Curry with their first pick and an OL with their second and third picks to shore up that O-line. Signing just 2 or 3 FAs could solve most of this teams problems (in the starting rotation) if the Chiefs draft for need in the first couple rounds. I still don't think the Chiefs will have enough depth to make a deep playoff run. If they sign a few key free agents and get another solid draft class, this team is a playoff competitor.

jmlamerson
12-23-2008, 06:56 PM
Suggs, Vilma and Asomugha would be the best return on their investment. They're all going to be under 28 next season and worth building the foundation with. Lewis and Peppers will be over 30 next season. Haynesworth will demand an enormous contract next season and he'd undoubtedly offer an upgrade at DT. I just think Tank and Dorsey are on track to be good DTs without having to spend money on a huge contract.

Suggs takes care of the DE spot. Vilma takes care of the MLB spot. Aso could be considered a luxury, but having him opposite Flowers would just be sick. Then, you can emphatically say the Chiefs are 4 deep at the CB spot with Carr and Leggett.

Then the Chiefs could take Curry with their first pick and an OL with their second and third picks to shore up that O-line. Signing just 2 or 3 FAs could solve most of this teams problems (in the starting rotation) if the Chiefs draft for need in the first couple rounds. I still don't think the Chiefs will have enough depth to make a deep playoff run. If they sign a few key free agents and get another solid draft class, this team is a playoff competitor.

I'm glad I finally convinced you of Asomugha's value.:D

Vilma is OK, but he's undersized. Dansby is the best FA LB out there, and would be terrific as our ROLB next year. If we could then trade down to get Maualuga (or hell, just pick him at the 2 spot), we would have DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby as our LBs, all under 30 and all lockig down their positions for the next decade.

Haynesworth will demand a gigantic contract, but we need someone, anyone, to eat up space in the middle. Dorsey and Tank just will never be that guy. I don't know Haynesworth is it, but we probably need to get at least one new DT in FA or in the draft.

You might as well pick Maualuga as Curry that high. Andre Smith would probably best the best bet, though, if we are picking 2nd.

texaschief
12-23-2008, 07:09 PM
I'm glad I finally convinced you of Asomugha's value.:D

Vilma is OK, but he's undersized. Dansby is the best FA LB out there, and would be terrific as our ROLB next year. If we could then trade down to get Maualuga (or hell, just pick him at the 2 spot), we would have DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby as our LBs, all under 30 and all lockig down their positions for the next decade.

Haynesworth will demand a gigantic contract, but we need someone, anyone, to eat up space in the middle. Dorsey and Tank just will never be that guy. I don't know Haynesworth is it, but we probably need to get at least one new DT in FA or in the draft.

You might as well pick Maualuga as Curry that high. Andre Smith would probably best the best bet, though, if we are picking 2nd.

There's no way in HELL I agree with you on his value. There's no way I'd ever agree that he's "the best CB of his generation." But I've always agreed that he'd help the team. I just think, as i stated, that he'd be a luxury. Like I said, he'd be sick opposite Flowers for the next 5 years or so.

If we sign Vilma, there's no need for another MLB. Curry would fill the other OLB spot.

If we pick up an OT, I'd rather get Monroe considering we KNOW that Albert COULD be a Pro Bowl LT and Monroe was considered the better LT. I'd rather go with the relatively safer pick instead of a guy we can't compare to Albert side by side. But again, that's just my opinion and I'm sure there's an argument to be made for Smith and Oher, but Monroe just seems to be the safer pick at OT considering how great Albert looked this season as a rookie who missed the entire summer and preseason.

theaxeeffect4311
12-24-2008, 05:04 AM
I'm glad I finally convinced you of Asomugha's value.:D

Vilma is OK, but he's undersized. Dansby is the best FA LB out there, and would be terrific as our ROLB next year. If we could then trade down to get Maualuga (or hell, just pick him at the 2 spot), we would have DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby as our LBs, all under 30 and all lockig down their positions for the next decade.

Haynesworth will demand a gigantic contract, but we need someone, anyone, to eat up space in the middle. Dorsey and Tank just will never be that guy. I don't know Haynesworth is it, but we probably need to get at least one new DT in FA or in the draft.

You might as well pick Maualuga as Curry that high. Andre Smith would probably best the best bet, though, if we are picking 2nd.

I have to disagree that Dansby is better than Vilma. Even though Vilma may be slightly undersized, he is a solid tackler and you do not see him get ran over. Plus, the best part of Vilma is his great speed at the linebacker spot and coverage skills which KC needs to cover a tight end. I think if we stay at the third spot then draft an OT, but if we trade down, then take Curry. Think about a combo of Curry, Vilma, and Johnson.

Haynesworth would be worth taking because we have the room in the salary cap. Signing Haynesworth with Suggs will make a great addition to the team and bring intensity to the defense.

jmlamerson
12-24-2008, 01:31 PM
I have to disagree that Dansby is better than Vilma. Even though Vilma may be slightly undersized, he is a solid tackler and you do not see him get ran over. Plus, the best part of Vilma is his great speed at the linebacker spot and coverage skills which KC needs to cover a tight end. I think if we stay at the third spot then draft an OT, but if we trade down, then take Curry. Think about a combo of Curry, Vilma, and Johnson.

Haynesworth would be worth taking because we have the room in the salary cap. Signing Haynesworth with Suggs will make a great addition to the team and bring intensity to the defense.

Well, we probably can't trade down. No one trades down from the top 5 anymore because of the large rookie contracts.

I agree about Haynesworth and Suggs. We need someone who can be of use against the run and someone to rush the passer. They would be the best fit on our lines. If we do get Suggs, we need bigger MLB than Vilma, as Suggs is also undersized and can be a liability against the run.

Why would you rather have DJ, Vilma, and Curry than DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby? The latter seems, to me, the much better LB corps. Vilma isn't so hot against the run, he's undersized, an he hs injury history. Dansby is very good against the run and is fast enough to cover a TE or posession WR. And Maualuga will be the next great MLB, due to his size and speed. Don't get me wrong, Curry will be a good OLB, but I think ten years from now, Maualuga will be the star of the 2009 draft.

Or to put it another way, Curry/Vilma is fine, but I think Maualuga/Dansby would make us one of the top 3 LB corps in the league.

jmlamerson
12-24-2008, 01:32 PM
I have to disagree that Dansby is better than Vilma. Even though Vilma may be slightly undersized, he is a solid tackler and you do not see him get ran over. Plus, the best part of Vilma is his great speed at the linebacker spot and coverage skills which KC needs to cover a tight end. I think if we stay at the third spot then draft an OT, but if we trade down, then take Curry. Think about a combo of Curry, Vilma, and Johnson.

Haynesworth would be worth taking because we have the room in the salary cap. Signing Haynesworth with Suggs will make a great addition to the team and bring intensity to the defense.

Well, we probably can't trade down. No one trades down from the top 5 anymore because of the large rookie contracts.

I agree about Haynesworth and Suggs. We need someone who can be of use against the run and someone to rush the passer. They would be the best fit on our lines. If we do get Suggs, we need bigger MLB than Vilma, as Suggs is also undersized and can be a liability against the run.

Why would you rather have DJ, Vilma, and Curry than DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby? The latter seems, to me, the much better LB corps. Vilma isn't so hot against the run, he's undersized, an he hs injury history. Dansby is very good against the run and is fast enough to cover a TE or possession WR. And Maualuga will be the next great MLB, due to his size and speed. Don't get me wrong, Curry will be a good OLB, but I think ten years from now, Maualuga will be the star of the 2009 draft.

Or to put it another way, Curry/Vilma is fine, but I think Maualuga/Dansby would make us one of the top 3 LB corps in the league.

texaschief
12-24-2008, 02:20 PM
Well, we probably can't trade down. No one trades down from the top 5 anymore because of the large rookie contracts.

I agree about Haynesworth and Suggs. We need someone who can be of use against the run and someone to rush the passer. They would be the best fit on our lines. If we do get Suggs, we need bigger MLB than Vilma, as Suggs is also undersized and can be a liability against the run.

Why would you rather have DJ, Vilma, and Curry than DJ, Maualuga, and Dansby? The latter seems, to me, the much better LB corps. Vilma isn't so hot against the run, he's undersized, an he hs injury history. Dansby is very good against the run and is fast enough to cover a TE or possession WR. And Maualuga will be the next great MLB, due to his size and speed. Don't get me wrong, Curry will be a good OLB, but I think ten years from now, Maualuga will be the star of the 2009 draft.

Or to put it another way, Curry/Vilma is fine, but I think Maualuga/Dansby would make us one of the top 3 LB corps in the league.

Until Dansby officially hits the market, I'm not counting on him being available. LBs that good are at the very least franchised. The ONLY reason I'm counting Vilma on being there is because I doubt he's worth a first round pick and the huge contract to the Saints. The Saints are pretty much THE ONLY team who can't sign Vilma. I know I'd hate to lose him, but I'd also hate to give up my first round pick for the right to re-sign him.

I keep reading all kinds of reviews about Curry. People have him as high as 3 going to the Chiefs and as low as 22nd going to the Pats. It's hard to get a read on him, especially when you haven't seen him play. If you're the Chiefs and you KNOW that your first pick is going to be a LB, you need to do whatever you can to fill at least one of the LB holes through free agency. If they sign Vilma, they should get Curry in the draft. If they sign Dansby or another OLB, they should go ILB in the draft.

Vilma is proving he's more than capable of being a MLB in this league. The guy is 6'1, 230. He's comparable to Ray Lewis at 6'1, 240, D'Qwell Jackson at 6'0, 240, Jon Beason at 6'0 230, Barrett Ruud at 6'2 240, Jerrod Mayo at 6'1 238.

Jonathan Vilma currently ranks 9th in the league at LB in tackles with 4 of the 5 guys I mentioned above ranked ahead of him by no more than 20 tackles. At this point, if I have a chance to upgrade a linebacking spot, Vilma has to be at the top of the list, even if he is a MLB. He's a young, great MLB that could be part of this foundation. If that means I have to reach a little in the draft to grab Curry if I can't trade down, then so be it. Going into next season, I'd have THE BEST young MLB available in free agency and THE BEST OLB in the draft.

I'd take that and run!!!

theaxeeffect4311
12-24-2008, 05:53 PM
Until Dansby officially hits the market, I'm not counting on him being available. LBs that good are at the very least franchised. The ONLY reason I'm counting Vilma on being there is because I doubt he's worth a first round pick and the huge contract to the Saints. The Saints are pretty much THE ONLY team who can't sign Vilma. I know I'd hate to lose him, but I'd also hate to give up my first round pick for the right to re-sign him.

I keep reading all kinds of reviews about Curry. People have him as high as 3 going to the Chiefs and as low as 22nd going to the Pats. It's hard to get a read on him, especially when you haven't seen him play. If you're the Chiefs and you KNOW that your first pick is going to be a LB, you need to do whatever you can to fill at least one of the LB holes through free agency. If they sign Vilma, they should get Curry in the draft. If they sign Dansby or another OLB, they should go ILB in the draft.

Vilma is proving he's more than capable of being a MLB in this league. The guy is 6'1, 230. He's comparable to Ray Lewis at 6'1, 240, D'Qwell Jackson at 6'0, 240, Jon Beason at 6'0 230, Barrett Ruud at 6'2 240, Jerrod Mayo at 6'1 238.

Jonathan Vilma currently ranks 9th in the league at LB in tackles with 4 of the 5 guys I mentioned above ranked ahead of him by no more than 20 tackles. At this point, if I have a chance to upgrade a linebacking spot, Vilma has to be at the top of the list, even if he is a MLB. He's a young, great MLB that could be part of this foundation. If that means I have to reach a little in the draft to grab Curry if I can't trade down, then so be it. Going into next season, I'd have THE BEST young MLB available in free agency and THE BEST OLB in the draft.

I'd take that and run!!!

And I'm going to add to that Vilma is not injury prone. He had a knee problem through college and it finally became bad in his last season with the Jets. So he had one surgery and now he is back to his old self.

While I'm still up in the air about the draft (since the Chiefs need so much), I do think Curry will be a great player. We will know more after the Combine if he is worth taking that high. I think the Chiefs could get more for their money though if they draft an OT in the first round. Looking at it, if we can sign Vilma and Suggs (those two are very doable signings) and possibly Haynesworth (some team may pay him more), then that gives a huge boost to our defense. Then the only to shady spots are an OLB and FS. I love Page, especially out in coverage, but we need coaches who can teach the guy to tackle. So I say use the first round on an OT, then draft an OLB in the second. There is a possiblity of having Brian Cushing fall into the second round, which would be a great choice for the Chiefs.

jap1
12-24-2008, 06:11 PM
And I'm going to add to that Vilma is not injury prone. He had a knee problem through college and it finally became bad in his last season with the Jets. So he had one surgery and now he is back to his old self.

While I'm still up in the air about the draft (since the Chiefs need so much), I do think Curry will be a great player. We will know more after the Combine if he is worth taking that high. I think the Chiefs could get more for their money though if they draft an OT in the first round. Looking at it, if we can sign Vilma and Suggs (those two are very doable signings) and possibly Haynesworth (some team may pay him more), then that gives a huge boost to our defense. Then the only to shady spots are an OLB and FS. I love Page, especially out in coverage, but we need coaches who can teach the guy to tackle. So I say use the first round on an OT, then draft an OLB in the second. There is a possiblity of having Brian Cushing fall into the second round, which would be a great choice for the Chiefs.

If our new GM would be able to pull down al those deals ... then wow. I think we would definitely be in the playoff hunt next year. Our front seven of:

Suggs/Dorsey/Haynesworth/Hali

DJ/Vilma/Cushing or Curry or DJ/Maualuga/Dansby

Man, that would bring us back to the days of DT, Neil Smith, Dan Saleamua. The punishing D's of old. The scary thing is we could probably get Cushing in the 2nd and get an OT in the 1st.

Our safeties would never have to make a tackle because no one would get to the 2nd level.

I have hope.

Coach
12-24-2008, 10:13 PM
Well, we probably can't trade down. No one trades down from the top 5 anymore because of the large rookie contracts.



There is definitely some truth to that. If that is the case, the Chiefs would probably end up taking a LT or DE with the 3rd pick. That means that we might go after a big name LB in free agency. Suggs would give them the most flexibility since he could play either position(DE or LB). But he's better suited for a 3-4 scheme, so I would be surprised to see the Chiefs win the Suggs sweepstakes. So expect a big push for Vilma, ESPECIALLY if Herm is still running the show.

theaxeeffect4311
12-25-2008, 04:17 AM
There is definitely some truth to that. If that is the case, the Chiefs would probably end up taking a LT or DE with the 3rd pick. That means that we might go after a big name LB in free agency. Suggs would give them the most flexibility since he could play either position(DE or LB). But he's better suited for a 3-4 scheme, so I would be surprised to see the Chiefs win the Suggs sweepstakes. So expect a big push for Vilma, ESPECIALLY if Herm is still running the show.

However, Suggs fits the role of pass rushing DE. He has the size, speed, and strength to play DE in a 4-3 defense. Plus, he may opt for that because he would earn more money as a DE than a OLB.

Coach
12-25-2008, 03:17 PM
However, Suggs fits the role of pass rushing DE. He has the size, speed, and strength to play DE in a 4-3 defense. Plus, he may opt for that because he would earn more money as a DE than a OLB.

Excellent point. It all comes down to money.

Chiefster
12-25-2008, 04:09 PM
Excellent point. It all comes down to money.

Understandably so, however, some would argue that is the problem.