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View Full Version : Matt Cassell to the Chiefs?



tenacious
02-02-2009, 10:28 PM
Just looking on espn.com and saw that rumor running around. Thoughts anyone?

hometeam
02-02-2009, 10:42 PM
well there are 40 other threads on this, including the one that someone just made.

ill say it 50 times.

do.not.want

it would make me sick :(

Canada
02-02-2009, 10:54 PM
Depends on what we have to give up to get him.

jap1
02-02-2009, 11:14 PM
Just looking on espn.com and saw that rumor running around. Thoughts anyone?

See the other thread about this same subject posted within a few minutes of this one. It is just ESPN throwing out ideas.

There is NO real evidence in that article to suggest this would happen other than the fact that Pioli is familiar with Cassel from his time in NE.

Coach
02-02-2009, 11:15 PM
Depends on what we have to give up to get him.

Exactly. It would be hard to argue that we have anyone better.

Guru
02-03-2009, 12:42 AM
We will have to give up at least our first round pick this year. I am definitely not interested.

Chiefster
02-03-2009, 12:51 AM
Same here, but will Clark be interested.

greg3564
02-03-2009, 01:18 AM
I don't understand the Cassel hype. Yeah, he came in and did a good job filling in for Brady. The guy hadn't done squat before then. Thigpen is just as capable as Cassel. Cassel had a much better supporting cast to work with. I think it would be a huge mistake to give any draft picks to bring him here. Cassel has no real tangible benefit over Thigpen.

Vandelay
02-03-2009, 01:26 AM
http://www.chiefscrowd.com/forums/images/imported/2009/02/1.jpg Added (http://www.youtube.com/watch_queue?all)

4:09

OPLookn
02-03-2009, 01:28 AM
I don't understand the Cassel hype. Yeah, he came in and did a good job filling in for Brady. The guy hadn't done squat before then. Thigpen is just as capable as Cassel. Cassel had a much better supporting cast to work with. I think it would be a huge mistake to give any draft picks to bring him here. Cassel has no real tangible benefit over Thigpen.


Couldn't have said it better myself. If you put a decent line in front of Thigpen I'm not saying he'll be better but I'd be shocked if he wasn't as good. Now people wanna throw away the chance to get a good line by giving up a 1st round pick plus who know what else?? Boggles my mind. Use this years draft and FA to shore up both sides of the line and then use next year to draft your QotF. By then we'll have an idea of what Thigpen can or can't do and can have possibly used FA to get a new QB.

Seek
02-03-2009, 08:35 AM
I had heard that Pioli was a master of trading draft picks to always improve each draft pick. If there is any truth to the rumor, I would have to think at a minimum we swap first round picks, and acquire Cassell.

balto
02-03-2009, 10:10 AM
MAN I hope this is not true!!!!!

If this is really going to happen I would feel better about us swapping 1st and the Pats also give us BOTH of there 2nd round picks

SOOO

Chiefs get
23rd overall
47th overall
58th overall
Matt Cassel

Pats get
3rd overall

I know this sounds like a LOT, but if you REALLY REALLY look at the values you will see that we are still giving up about a late 1st or early 2nd round pick for Cassel.

Canada
02-03-2009, 04:24 PM
I don't understand the Cassel hype. Yeah, he came in and did a good job filling in for Brady. The guy hadn't done squat before then. Thigpen is just as capable as Cassel. Cassel had a much better supporting cast to work with. I think it would be a huge mistake to give any draft picks to bring him here. Cassel has no real tangible benefit over Thigpen.


Couldn't have said it better myself. If you put a decent line in front of Thigpen I'm not saying he'll be better but I'd be shocked if he wasn't as good. Now people wanna throw away the chance to get a good line by giving up a 1st round pick plus who know what else?? Boggles my mind. Use this years draft and FA to shore up both sides of the line and then use next year to draft your QotF. By then we'll have an idea of what Thigpen can or can't do and can have possibly used FA to get a new QB.

I agree with what you guys are saying as far as giving Thig his chance, but "the hype" about Cassel is that he came in week 1 after Brady went down and won 11 games and should have been in the playoffs. The fact that he "hadn't done squat until then" is because he was playing behind Brady. Brady hadn't done squat until Bledsoe fot hurt. Don't let your Patriot hating blind you to the fact that Cassel is a pretty competent QB. I am not going to compare Cassel and Thig because Cassel has had more time to learn his system however I would not be opposed (for the right price) to entertain the idea of having them both compete for the starter job so that our starting two QBs could be Thigpen/Cassel instead of Thigpen/Croyle.

Seek
02-05-2009, 08:29 AM
I am curious what Thigpen would have done this year if he didn't have Tony G. I like Thigpen, but I have a feeling if Tony G. wasn't on this team, there would be no discussion of Thigpen getting a chance to be the man.

yashi
02-05-2009, 10:27 AM
I am curious what Thigpen would have done this year if he didn't have Tony G. I like Thigpen, but I have a feeling if Tony G. wasn't on this team, there would be no discussion of Thigpen getting a chance to be the man.
Sad but 100% true. TG was basically a safety valve every play. If nobody was open then he threw it in Tony's direction, regardless of how many guys were on him. This is why I think we really need to bring in a backup plan. Thigpen is still very much a wildcard at this point. Will he be terrible when TG is no longer around or if we switch to a more traditional offense? Will he better way better when the OL is improved?

hometeam
02-05-2009, 10:28 AM
woulda.coulda.shoulda.

He did have TG, so he did what he did. And if we are what ifing, what if cassel didnt have Randy moss and Wes Welker nad a competent run game and o-line?

If TG isn't here this year, the passes will go to cottam or bowe, cuase they have to go somewhere~

Seek
02-05-2009, 11:33 AM
woulda.coulda.shoulda.

He did have TG, so he did what he did. And if we are what ifing, what if cassel didnt have Randy moss and Wes Welker nad a competent run game and o-line?

If TG isn't here this year, the passes will go to cottam or bowe, cuase they have to go somewhere~

Cottam and Bowe are not Tony G. Fact, Bowe drops the ball without people even near him. He won't make the plays Tony made. If Tony G is not here this year, I have a feeling Thigpen will struggle. I love Thigpen and I want him to stay, but he was throwing balls to others like he did to Tony G, and they were getting picked or dropped.

A lot of Thigpen's success was Tony. I hope he able to build off that if Tony is gone, but it does raise some concern even for his fans.

hometeam
02-05-2009, 12:32 PM
Seek I agree with you, but how does that make Cassell a better solution?

yashi
02-05-2009, 12:40 PM
Seek I agree with you, but how does that make Cassell a better solution?
Not necessarily a better solution, but having two wildcard QBs on your team versus one will always give you a better chance of having the QBOTF on your roster...

I really can't count how many times I saw Thigpen throw passes that Tony pulled down in double coverage or grabbed away from defenders this year. His completion % was already low, what would it have been if TG wasn't constantly pulling those balls in? Surely that has to scare you a little bit?

Sure Cassel had Moss and Welker, but his completion percentage was also 63% to Thigpen's 54%.

I don't think anyone is saying Cassel is some perfect QB. His accuracy is less than ideal and he moves out of the pocket too much. I just hate the idea of Thigpen being the only QB on the roster next season capable of starting when there's a lot of question marks.

jmlamerson
02-05-2009, 12:44 PM
Not necessarily a better solution, but having two wildcard QBs on your team versus one will always give you a better chance of having the QBOTF on your roster...

I really can't count how many times I saw Thigpen throw passes that Tony pulled down in double coverage or grabbed away from defenders this year. His completion % was already low, what would it have been if TG wasn't constantly pulling those balls in? Surely that has to scare you a little bit?

There's an old saying - if you have two starting QBs you have no starting QBs. If we bring Cassell in, it won't be for a half-assed QB competition. He'll be anointed the starter. And if we stick with Thigpen, we won't have a meaningless open camp between Thigpen, Quinn Gray, and Brodie Croyle. Thigpen will be our starter.

The open competition for a QB spot nonsense never works.

yashi
02-05-2009, 12:50 PM
There's an old saying - if you have two starting QBs you have no starting QBs. If we bring Cassell in, it won't be for a half-assed QB competition. He'll be anointed the starter. And if we stick with Thigpen, we won't have a meaningless open camp between Thigpen, Quinn Gray, and Brodie Croyle. Thigpen will be our starter.

The open competition for a QB spot nonsense never works.
Leinart effectively went into training camp this year as "the guy", and Whisenhunt quickly realized Warner was the better solution. This is what worries me. What happens when in training camp a new offensive scheme is introduced, one that doesn't exclusively involve shotgun packages, and Thigpen resembles early-season, non-spread Thigpen? Then with no other option available, he throws 25 interceptions and we win 2 games again, OR we're forced to yet again abandon the gameplan and switch back to the spread, further delaying the development of our young offensive players.

kcmostwanted
02-05-2009, 01:04 PM
Leinart effectively went into training camp this year as "the guy", and Whisenhunt quickly realized Warner was the better solution. This is what worries me. What happens when in training camp a new offensive scheme is introduced, one that doesn't exclusively involve shotgun packages, and Thigpen resembles early-season, non-spread Thigpen? Then with no other option available, he throws 25 interceptions and we win 2 games again, OR we're forced to yet again abandon the gameplan and switch back to the spread, further delaying the development of our young offensive players.

I agree w/ you... this is the most logical reply I've read in this Thread!!!

Like I've said in the past, we need to have more competition at the QB spot. Most of the people who don't support the idea of getting another QB must be blind or something... It's not that we hate Thigpen and don't want him to succeed, we're just saying it wouldn't be bad if we can add competition to the position... We've seen what happened when the Chiefs put all their eggs in the Brodie Croyle basket, and I definitely don't want to see that w/ Thigpen.

That being said, a 1st round pick would be wayyyy to much for Matt. because Thiggy or Matt could be last years Derek Anderson.

-I say if Tony Gonzalez really wants out of KC and a shot at a Ring, we send him and a lower draft pick ( as long as it's not 1st or 2nd) to NE for Cassell....

jmlamerson
02-05-2009, 01:08 PM
Leinart effectively went into training camp this year as "the guy", and Whisenhunt quickly realized Warner was the better solution. This is what worries me. What happens when in training camp a new offensive scheme is introduced, one that doesn't exclusively involve shotgun packages, and Thigpen resembles early-season, non-spread Thigpen? Then with no other option available, he throws 25 interceptions and we win 2 games again, OR we're forced to yet again abandon the gameplan and switch back to the spread, further delaying the development of our young offensive players.

True about Leinart/Warner. Or about Croyle/Huard, to use a Chiefs example.

But those were cases where the golden boy QB proved to be a dud during training camp, not an open competition between the two. Leinart and Croyle lost their jobs - Warner and Huard didn't win them in a competition.

If we sign Matt Cassel to a 6 year/$50M contract and have an open competition between him, Gray, and Thigpen, we'll be the laughingstock of the league. We want our Day 1 starter getting the 1st team reps and building a rapport with his receivers. We want confidence. You're castrating your new QB before the season even opens by having an open competition.

If Cassell turns out to be a terrible QB, then we regretfully replace him with Thigpen and curse our mistake. That's a lot different from an open competition.

yashi
02-05-2009, 01:17 PM
True about Leinart/Warner. Or about Croyle/Huard, to use a Chiefs example.

But those were cases where the golden boy QB proved to be a dud during training camp, not an open competition between the two. Leinart and Croyle lost their jobs - Warner and Huard didn't win them in a competition.

If we sign Matt Cassel to a 6 year/$50M contract and have an open competition between him, Gray, and Thigpen, we'll be the laughingstock of the league. We want our Day 1 starter getting the 1st team reps and building a rapport with his receivers. We want confidence. You're castrating your new QB before the season even opens by having an open competition.

If Cassell turns out to be a terrible QB, then we regretfully replace him with Thigpen and curse our mistake. That's a lot different from an open competition.
I'm not interested in a competition either. Competitions are for teams who have 0 good options and are trying to decide between 2 bad ones.

Cassel isn't my ideal guy, really. I'm mostly using him as a reference point because I don't know of any better options off the top of my head. If we ran a west coast offense, Garcia would fit what I'm looking for, a proven veteran who could be a fairly inexpensive short term solution if things don't pan out with Thigpen. Since that's not the case, and I also have no idea what our offense will look like next year, it's hard to name a guy. People are throwing Leftwich's name around, but I'm not a fan.

It's not a very good free agent crop for QBs. Believe me, I don't want to pay Cassel 50 million any more than you do.

m0ef0e
02-05-2009, 01:24 PM
If the Eagles have lost their marbles, they may shop McNabb. I know it's not gonna happen but Philly sure doesn't seem to appreciate him the way they should. I know he hasn't won the big one but he consistently gives them a shot.

Seek
02-05-2009, 01:37 PM
Seek I agree with you, but how does that make Cassell a better solution?

I don't know if Cassell is a better option or even if I want him. He is though a better option regarding the risk of drafting a Qb, since he some what tested. The price for him would have to be right.

There has to be some sort of plan in case Thigpen is a system Qb.

The problem with Cassell will be his price tag.

Bike
02-05-2009, 07:02 PM
I don't know if Cassell is a better option or even if I want him. He is though a better option regarding the risk of drafting a Qb, since he some what tested. The price for him would have to be right.

There has to be some sort of plan in case Thigpen is a system Qb.

The problem with Cassell will be his price tag.
Yep. And NE just franchised him. Its gonna cost somebody a couple first round picks to land him, or at least 15 mil, and Pats can match any offer...

tornadospotter
02-05-2009, 07:46 PM
The off season is so filled with what ifs and how abouts, gives all us something to talk about. Just give us a Coach!

hometeam
02-05-2009, 08:30 PM
Yep. now with the franchise tag it will be very expensive to get him. I hope we dont make the blunder~

Ml Burton
02-06-2009, 01:27 AM
I agree w/ you... this is the most logical reply I've read in this Thread!!!

Like I've said in the past, we need to have more competition at the QB spot. Most of the people who don't support the idea of getting another QB must be blind or something... It's not that we hate Thigpen and don't want him to succeed, we're just saying it wouldn't be bad if we can add competition to the position... We've seen what happened when the Chiefs put all their eggs in the Brodie Croyle basket, and I definitely don't want to see that w/ Thigpen.

That being said, a 1st round pick would be wayyyy to much for Matt. because Thiggy or Matt could be last years Derek Anderson.

-I say if Tony Gonzalez really wants out of KC and a shot at a Ring, we send him and a lower draft pick ( as long as it's not 1st or 2nd) to NE for Cassell....
If we were giving away anyone I would much rather prefer LJ.

okikcfan
02-06-2009, 04:40 AM
Give em to the CowGirls, they take everyones hand me downs and rejects.:lol:

hermhater
02-06-2009, 04:43 AM
Todd Haley won't want Matt Cassell, don't forget he is a back up QB franchise tag or no. They did that to keep him there as they need him right now.


My name is Chris.

Seek
02-06-2009, 08:23 AM
Yep. And NE just franchised him. Its gonna cost somebody a couple first round picks to land him, or at least 15 mil, and Pats can match any offer...

Mike and MIke suggested this morning that the Franchise Tag on Cassell is only there so that the Jets can't claim him without some hefty price tag. Apparently Peter King told them that Brett Farve is done, so the Jets are shopping for a Qb. Plus the status of Brady is still in question. If Cassell signs the Franchise Tag they will be paying him 14 million this year, and Brady 9 million.

Something will have to happen. I don't see the Chiefs getting involved with that without fixing the O-line and defense.

jtandcrew
02-06-2009, 08:34 AM
Cassell is to big of a price now as was b4 to get into a bidding war with any other team. He is now definately too expensive for us much the same way LJ is to expensive for us to get rid of. We either need to sign a lesser free agent or draft one and let whoever is on the team compete for starting job.

KristofLaw
02-06-2009, 03:18 PM
Mike and MIke suggested this morning that the Franchise Tag on Cassell is only there so that the Jets can't claim him without some hefty price tag. Apparently Peter King told them that Brett Farve is done, so the Jets are shopping for a Qb. Plus the status of Brady is still in question. If Cassell signs the Franchise Tag they will be paying him 14 million this year, and Brady 9 million.

Something will have to happen. I don't see the Chiefs getting involved with that without fixing the O-line and defense.
I agree, I find it ironic that the final HC signing of the season coincides with our new GMs former team franchising arguably the biggest name in free-agency at the QB position. NE knows our cap position and our need for depth at the position, however their main concern is the strenght of their team and through this their division. What will happen with Cassell is in the air, but I don't think Mr. P willl be acquiring him at the current price tag unless he can structure both his contract and fit in reasonable draft picks. Very unlikely Cassell will be a Chief.