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View Full Version : If Haley is our coach...



Nel Toille
02-03-2009, 02:02 PM
... then we will target Crabtree with our #3 pick. This doesn't mean that we will draft him but we will definitely be showing him a lot of love at the combine. I can easily see Pioli using the fact that we have a wideout coach leading the helm as a way to get teams who really want him to trade up with us. Right now, Seattle and Oakland have their sights on him and if we trade, we can still have a really good first round pick plus more. If that doesn't happen then I'd be happy with taking Crabman (which will be his new nickname for all you Earl fans out there). He's one of the few talents that will most likely earn the money he'd be getting.

chiefnut
02-03-2009, 02:36 PM
if we pick any WR w/our first pick then our new coach had better work some magic w/our offensive line. any qb is going to be to busy running for his life to throw to the new guy. if our new regime goes after crabtree w/o shoring up both of the lines then i doubt if we'll much more success than w/herm

dbolan
02-03-2009, 02:53 PM
We can get a couple of FA's for the line. The WR (Crabtree) will help stretch the field, thus less defense in the box.

Or, If we trade the pic all is well in that scenario as well.

Don't think the O-Line doesn't realize they are being "reviewed" and I would anticipate better production in the coming year from anyone and everyone.

jap1
02-03-2009, 06:45 PM
We can get a couple of FA's for the line. The WR (Crabtree) will help stretch the field, thus less defense in the box.

Or, If we trade the pic all is well in that scenario as well.

Don't think the O-Line doesn't realize they are being "reviewed" and I would anticipate better production in the coming year from anyone and everyone.

They havent been getting "reviewed" for the past couple of years?

Sure we pick up three FA o-linemen, then we will not have enough money for both a big name DE and LB. It either has to be o-line or defense (which I dont like because the only people who can make an impact in the next 3 years are Maualuga and Curry, and 3 is too high for a LB). Those are the only positions that will make a difference within the next three years, and they are also areas that we have a SERIOUS need. We dont have a need at WR, we have a want. We have NEEDS (absolutely necessary upgrades to do any better next season) at OL, DL, LB. We have WANTS (i.e. it would be nice to get better) at QB, RB?, WR, and DB. TE and RB are our strongest positions at this point (depending on the futures of LJ and TG obviously) and WR is close behind them. It would be crazy to spend a 3rd pick on what is arguably our 3rd strongest position on this team.

Chieffaninfl
02-03-2009, 08:37 PM
Dont let Oakland get him. We should never trade with Oakland, especially for Crabtree. We dont need to have to try to cover him for the next 10 years.

Coach
02-03-2009, 09:51 PM
Ok, so what if we take Crabttree with the #3. Then take Alex Mack with our 2nd round pick, then Phil Loadholt at #3.

That would make our line Albert, Waters, Mack, Niswanger, and Loadholt. Thigpen throwing to Bowe and Crabtree, with LJ and Charles in the backfield.

That offense will move the ball.

They would need to sign Vilma and Peppers and then this team would have made major strides.

jap1
02-04-2009, 12:06 AM
Ok, so what if we take Crabttree with the #3. Then take Alex Mack with our 2nd round pick, then Phil Loadholt at #3.

That would make our line Albert, Waters, Mack, Niswanger, and Loadholt. Thigpen throwing to Bowe and Crabtree, with LJ and Charles in the backfield.

That offense will move the ball.

They would need to sign Vilma and Peppers and then this team would have made major strides.

That would be a great draft if both those guys are available at 2 and 3. I personally think Mack will probably be gone by the end of the 1st, and Loadholt will be gone by the mid 2nd round.

dbolan
02-04-2009, 09:49 AM
They havent been getting "reviewed" for the past couple of years?

Sure we pick up three FA o-linemen, then we will not have enough money for both a big name DE and LB. It either has to be o-line or defense (which I dont like because the only people who can make an impact in the next 3 years are Maualuga and Curry, and 3 is too high for a LB). Those are the only positions that will make a difference within the next three years, and they are also areas that we have a SERIOUS need. We dont have a need at WR, we have a want. We have NEEDS (absolutely necessary upgrades to do any better next season) at OL, DL, LB. We have WANTS (i.e. it would be nice to get better) at QB, RB?, WR, and DB. TE and RB are our strongest positions at this point (depending on the futures of LJ and TG obviously) and WR is close behind them. It would be crazy to spend a 3rd pick on what is arguably our 3rd strongest position on this team.

Yes they have been getting reviewed but on a lower level.

I swear...Most of you guys think that drafting 1rst round O-lineman every year is the answer as well. It isn't. Lineman are busts as well as QB's, RB's, DB's, etc etc.

There are some "good" lineman available in later rounds and in FA.

Bike
02-04-2009, 11:24 AM
Yes they have been getting reviewed but on a lower level.

I swear...Most of you guys think that drafting 1rst round O-lineman every year is the answer as well. It isn't. Lineman are busts as well as QB's, RB's, DB's, etc etc.

There are some "good" lineman available in later rounds and in FA.
Well, you could say that about every position. But a 1st round OL has a much higher probability of coming in and contributing immediately with a much lower risk factor of being a 'bust'. Later round OL tend to be slower and can't hold on to their blocks as long as higher round OL.
So you really do get what you pay for here.
It stands to reason that for the most part, the best players are gonna be in the 1st couple rounds.
And since we need to build our OL, why not grab the best available?
That being said, I think Pioli is the best evaluater of talent out there and I'll stand behind whoever he decides...

dbolan
02-04-2009, 11:44 AM
Well, you could say that about every position. But a 1st round OL has a much higher probability of coming in and contributing immediately with a much lower risk factor of being a 'bust'. Later round OL tend to be slower and can't hold on to their blocks as long as higher round OL.
So you really do get what you pay for here.
It stands to reason that for the most part, the best players are gonna be in the 1st couple rounds.
And since we need to build our OL, why not grab the best available?
That being said, I think Pioli is the best evaluater of talent out there and I'll stand behind whoever he decides...

Look at our first round lineman picks over the past 25 years and tell me which ones amounted to anything? Will Shields was a 3rd rounder and a good example of good folks left in the later rounds.

John Tait...LOL!

Look at the UFA and FA market for lineman right now. We can get a couple there for sure and if not, someone is riding the pine for another team that could be a starter OR there is a lineman in the later rounds. You have to remember...Our talent scouting has been POOR for many years. This will change.

Bike
02-04-2009, 11:52 AM
Look at our first round lineman picks over the past 25 years and tell me which ones amounted to anything? Will Shields was a 3rd rounder and a good example of good folks left in the later rounds.

John Tait...LOL!

Look at the UFA and FA market for lineman right now. We can get a couple there for sure and if not, someone is riding the pine for another team that could be a starter OR there is a lineman in the later rounds. You have to remember...Our talent scouting has been POOR for many years. This will change.
Oh ok. I must be wrong.
It would be a terrible mistake to take Eugene Monroe with our 1st pick.
Instead, lets grab Crabtree and and watch our cap disappear, hand him a 50 mil dollar contract, and hope for the best while Thig is back there running for his life.
Genius.

dbolan
02-04-2009, 12:24 PM
Oh ok. I must be wrong.
It would be a terrible mistake to take Eugene Monroe with our 1st pick.
Instead, lets grab Crabtree and and watch our cap disappear, hand him a 50 mil dollar contract, and hope for the best while Thig is back there running for his life.
Genius.

I never said Crabtree was the answer either. Of course, all of us could make arguments for any position of need right now.

What makes you think the lineman is not gonna want a huge contract? Look at how much Long got from the Dolphins..And the TUNA vouched for it.

In all honesty, I would be more inclined to trade the pic for more second round picks, or trade for a proven player and a 2 round pick. But, what do I know? LOL!

hometeam
02-04-2009, 12:31 PM
I would say lineman are easier to evaluate how they will translate to pro than any other position, becuase how they perform has less to do with speed. In college, anyone who is fast can make opposing teams look bad, but in the NFL, everyone is that fast~

Now thats not the only thing that you can judge aplayer on, I am just throwing out there, that becuase lineman do almost exactly the same thing in college as they do NFL, and they are not embarrasing other players with speed and flashiness, they can easier be evaluated for the transition~

Also, we dont need a 1st round wideout, there are more competent WR's than any other position in the NFL. We can get them in FA, and in lower rounds if we have to have them.

dbolan
02-04-2009, 12:39 PM
I would say lineman are easier to evaluate how they will translate to pro than any other position, becuase how they perform has less to do with speed. In college, anyone who is fast can make opposing teams look bad, but in the NFL, everyone is that fast~

Now thats not the only thing that you can judge aplayer on, I am just throwing out there, that becuase lineman do almost exactly the same thing in college as they do NFL, and they are not embarrasing other players with speed and flashiness, they can easier be evaluated for the transition~

Also, we dont need a 1st round wideout, there are more competent WR's than any other position in the NFL. We can get them in FA, and in lower rounds if we have to have them.

I could go along with that but we do need another VERY good WR that possesses speed. I had rather not spend the 1st pick on Crabtree or any WR as long as we address the need in some manner.

Get a lineman, a DT or a DE or an LB with the first pick..Okay by me...Just get another WR that has quickness, speed and good hands.

Bike
02-04-2009, 12:40 PM
I never said Crabtree was the answer either. Of course, all of us could make arguments for any position of need right now.

What makes you think the lineman is not gonna want a huge contract? Look at how much Long got from the Dolphins..And the TUNA vouched for it.

In all honesty, I would be more inclined to trade the pic for more second round picks, or trade for a proven player and a 2 round pick. But, what do I know? LOL!
Championships are built from the inside out. Build the lines with the biggest, baddest, meanest linemen you can get. Thats what will get us to the Superbowl. The position players will fall into place after our lines are rebuilt. Pioli will make sure of it.

Bike
02-04-2009, 12:56 PM
Look at our first round lineman picks over the past 25 years and tell me which ones amounted to anything? Will Shields was a 3rd rounder and a good example of good folks left in the later rounds.

John Tait...LOL!

Look at the UFA and FA market for lineman right now. We can get a couple there for sure and if not, someone is riding the pine for another team that could be a starter OR there is a lineman in the later rounds. You have to remember...Our talent scouting has been POOR for many years. This will change.
Whats so funny? Tait has been a rock for the Bears OL for several years now and last year made a successful transition from the right to the left tackle spot.
It was Peterson that screwed us of of Tait - not Tait.

dbolan
02-04-2009, 01:12 PM
Championships are built from the inside out. Build the lines with the biggest, baddest, meanest linemen you can get. Thats what will get us to the Superbowl. The position players will fall into place after our lines are rebuilt. Pioli will make sure of it.

I just say "don't break the bank on any single person" at this point.

What good is a line that can pass block for 10 seconds if the WR's cannot get open? What good is a line that can run block like a beast but they always face 8 in the box because the threat of pass is not of major concern?

What good is a reciever that gets open, yet the QB is sacked?

None of it is good.

Cassel is not worth the high $$. Neither is Crabtree or any other player in this draft for the Chiefs.

We can upgrade and fill the neccessary positions with the cap money available.

Be serious for a minute here. In the past 15 years, how many 1rst round picks of the 465 have turned into players that were talked about from their first year in the NFL to their last? How many made significant impacts for 5-10 years??

It is a crap shoot! LMAO!

Bike
02-04-2009, 01:21 PM
I just say "don't break the bank on any single person" at this point.

What good is a line that can pass block for 10 seconds if the WR's cannot get open? What good is a line that can run block like a beast but they always face 8 in the box because the threat of pass is not of major concern?

What good is a reciever that gets open, yet the QB is sacked?

None of it is good.

Cassel is not worth the high $$. Neither is Crabtree or any other player in this draft for the Chiefs.

We can upgrade and fill the neccessary positions with the cap money available.

Be serious for a minute here. In the past 15 years, how many 1rst round picks of the 465 have turned into players that were talked about from their first year in the NFL to their last? How many made significant impacts for 5-10 years??

It is a crap shoot! LMAO!
i agree. A definite crapshoot. That being said, I believe Pioli is a better talent evaluater than most and should help us significantly in the coming 2-3 years and beyond.
And btw, we are stuck with the 3rd pick. I don't see anybody trading up with us. This is a pretty level draft.
And if someone is desperate enough to dish out 3rd pick dollars and trade with us to grab Crabtree (if he's still there), then all the better for us!:bananen_smilies046:

Drunker Hillbilly
02-04-2009, 02:34 PM
Yes they have been getting reviewed but on a lower level.

I swear...Most of you guys think that drafting 1rst round O-lineman every year is the answer as well. It isn't. Lineman are busts as well as QB's, RB's, DB's, etc etc.

There are some "good" lineman available in later rounds and in FA.
I have been preaching this ever since I became a member here!!!!!!

jmlamerson
02-04-2009, 04:38 PM
Yes they have been getting reviewed but on a lower level.

I swear...Most of you guys think that drafting 1rst round O-lineman every year is the answer as well. It isn't. Lineman are busts as well as QB's, RB's, DB's, etc etc.

There are some "good" lineman available in later rounds and in FA.

Offensive linemen bust out at a much, much lower percentage than any other position. Teams that draft linemen, either offensive or defensive, early year in and year out turn out to be much better teams than those who draft QBs, WRs, CBs, and RBs early every year.

The reason it hasn't worked for the Chiefs as well as it has for the Steelers, Colts, Eagles, Pats, etc. is because we have had horrible talent evaluators.