switching to the 3-4 defense

[jason1981]

NFL.com Blogs Adam Schefter « (http://blogs.nfl.com/category/adam-schefter/)

Adam Schefter (http://blogs.nfl.com/category/adam-schefter/)
What will move to 3-4 mean to Chiefs’ Dorsey? (http://blogs.nfl.com/2009/02/18/what-will-move-to-3-4-mean-to-chiefs-dorsey/)

Posted: February 18th, 2009 | Adam Schefter | Tags: Glenn Dorsey (http://blogs.nfl.com/tag/glenn-dorsey/), Kansas City Chiefs (http://blogs.nfl.com/tag/kansas-city-chiefs/)
Kansas City announced its coaching staff this week. What it didn’t announce is that the Chiefs are planning to switch to a 3-4 defense.
Under the guidance of new defensive coaches Clancy Pendergast and Gary Gibbs, the Chiefs are turning to the defense that has done so well for Pittsburgh and is back in vogue in the NFL. The Chiefs are going 3-4.
Now Kansas City is going to have to tailor its personnel accordingly. But what is most intriguing and mysterious about it is where last year’s first-round pick, defensive tackle Glenn Dorsey, fits in. Dorsey might not be stout enough to play nose tackle in a 3-4, and he might not be big enough to play end in that style of defense.
One year after becoming Kansas City’s top pick, there now are questions about Dorsey’s role.
But the changes now are coming fast and furious in Kansas City, mainly on defense.

[yashi]

Beat me to it!

Indeed it'll be interesting to see what happens with Dorsey. I think there's no question that he'll be used as a DE next season, but I really hope that he's able to play the position effectively. Who knows, maybe it'll be just the change he needs.

Also now I've completely decided that our 1st round pick should be B.J. Raji, Boston College.

[jason1981]

I hope he can fit in somewhere or it would mean he was a wasted pick last season. I dont know what his trade value would be and also the cap hit we would take if we did trade him.

[fairladyZ]

what about Boone clogging up the middle?
and i still want curry with #1 pick

[yashi]

This really changes a LOT of things.

- Vilma is no longer a good option, as he was terrible in the 3-4 when Mangini changed up the defense in New York.

- Haynesworth is a 4-3 DT, so he's probably out as well.

- DE Chris Canty jumps way up on the list of who we should target because he's been an effective 3-4 DE.

- If Suggs is for some reason not franchised, we need to give whatever it takes to get him. I had question marks about him at DE in a 4-3, but as a 3-4 OLB he's excellent.

[Chiefster]

Change is good! :D

[jmlamerson]

I hope he can fit in somewhere or it would mean he was a wasted pick last season. I dont know what his trade value would be and also the cap hit we would take if we did trade him.

Cap hit is $20M this year if we cut/trade him before June 1.

Cap hit is $10M in 2009 and $10M in 2010 if we cut/trade him after June 1.

He's not going anywhere.

We're going to try him at DE, I think.

And if Raji isn't our 1st round pick, I'd be shocked.

[jmlamerson]

This really changes a LOT of things.

- Vilma is no longer a good option, as he was terrible in the 3-4 when Mangini changed up the defense in New York.

- Haynesworth is a 4-3 DT, so he's probably out as well.

- DE Chris Canty jumps way up on the list of who we should target because he's been an effective 3-4 DE.

- If Suggs is for some reason not franchised, we need to give whatever it takes to get him. I had question marks about him at DE in a 4-3, but as a 3-4 OLB he's excellent.

Canty should now be our #1 priority in FA.

Hali should be moved to LB next season, Dorsey to DE. Tank will be our reserve NT and Boone a reserve DE, I figure.

McBride and Ron Edwards are gone.

I could see us trading DJ, as he's probably not a 3-4 LB.

Pollard will have a career year.

Page is gone.

We need (probably) two new LBs, a new FS, and a new NT.

[jason1981]

is hali fast or quick enough to be a LB

[jmlamerson]

is hali fast or quick enough to be a LB

I think he's quick enough to be a good ILB next season. We'll see anyway, because he's not going to make it as a 3-4 DE.

[fairladyZ]

i don't want DJ gone!

[balto]

Dorsey will be FINE at DE in a 3-4!!!!

I would then look at Chris canty like you said to be the other DE.

I honestly think Tyler could be a OK NT in a 3-4. If you can remember when he was drafted he put up record numbers at the Combine in strength. Tank is VERY strong and I think he could put on a few pounds if told of his new role in the off season.

Then we trade down with the Jags at 8 (gain an extra 2nd and more if they will give it to us) and take Rey Maualuga MLB (By far the best MLB for a 3-4 in this draft)

I would try and have Hali get back down to what he weight a couple years ago to be a OLB for us. (he is fast for his size already)

FA:
Chris Canty-DE
OL- RT, C, G (get one of them)
OLB: Scott would be good

Draft:
1) Maualuga MLB
2)a Best RT,C,G on board, the spot we don't get in FA
2)b Best RT,C,G
3) Best LB/NT on board
4) Best NT/LB on board
5) BPA
6) BPA
7) Chase Patton QB

The Oline is now fixed.

Our D would still need some work next year, but we can't get any worse then last year hehe.

Canty----Tyler/Draft-----Dorsey

Hali------D. Johnson-----------Maualuga------Scott

[jmlamerson]

i don't want DJ gone!

He may do better than I think he will in a 3-4. But he's a perfect 4-3 OLB. It might be worth it to trade him while he has value.

[jason1981]

i think DJ might have a break out year depending how they use him. I want to see him rushing the QB more. I think our 1st pick will definitely be on defense either DL or LB.

[jmlamerson]

Dorsey will be FINE at DE in a 3-4!!!!

I would then look at Chris canty like you said to be the other DE.

I honestly think Tyler could be a OK NT in a 3-4. If you can remember when he was drafted he put up record numbers at the Combine in strength. Tank is VERY strong and I think he could put on a few pounds if told of his new role in the off season.

Then we trade down with the Jags at 8 (gain an extra 2nd and more if they will give it to us) and take Rey Maualuga MLB (By far the best MLB for a 3-4 in this draft)

I would try and have Hali get back down to what he weight a couple years ago to be a OLB for us. (he is fast for his size already)

FA:
Chris Canty-DE
OL- RT, C, G (get one of them)
OLB: Scott would be good

Draft:
1) Maualuga MLB
2)a Best RT,C,G on board, the spot we don't get in FA
2)b Best RT,C,G
3) Best LB/NT on board
4) Best NT/LB on board
5) BPA
6) BPA
7) Chase Patton QB

The Oline is now fixed.

Our D would still need some work next year, but we can't get any worse then last year hehe.

Canty----Tyler/Draft-----Dorsey

Hali------D. Johnson-----------Maualuga------Scott

I know you want to trade down. You're not alone. Everyone wants to trade down. Pioli wants to trade down. But we're not trading down because no one will trade up with us.

I love Maualuga. Really, I do. I think he's the best defensive prospect in this draft. But we pick him at #3, trade back into the 1st round, or we're not getting him. And I'd bet quite a bit right now that we're taking Raji.

Don't say Dorsey will be fine at DE until you actually see him play the position.

I think Hali will be able to move to OLB pretty well.

Canty and Scott would be perfect FA pickups.

[fairladyZ]

what about peppers now that he wants to be with a 3-4 and now that we know its a good possibility we are switching.

[jmlamerson]

what about peppers now that he wants to be with a 3-4 and now that we know its a good possibility we are switching.

Yeah, but we're not going to pay him $10M a year to be a LB. Some other team will overpay him for that spot.

[fairladyZ]

what would we be paying say bart scott to come here? Or Canty?

So what if we did a LB corp like this

Hali---DJ---Scott---Curry?

[yashi]

I think he's quick enough to be a good ILB next season. We'll see anyway, because he's not going to make it as a 3-4 DE.
I think he'll be experimented with at OLB mostly.. his main asset throughout college and up until last season has always been his passing rushing ability, which would be best utilized at OLB.

[jmlamerson]

what would we be paying say bart scott to come here? Or Canty?

So what if we did a LB corp like this

Hali---DJ---Scott---Curry?

No way DJ can play inside like that. It would have to be:

Hali---Draft Pick---Scott---DJ

if we keep DJ and Hali as starters.

[honda522]

i don't want DJ gone!
Word.

I dont really understand why Dorsey wouldn't work. He is still a lineman.

[fairladyZ]

why do people not think DJ can play inside?

[Codac]

Cap hit is $20M this year if we cut/trade him before June 1.

Cap hit is $10M in 2009 and $10M in 2010 if we cut/trade him after June 1.

He's not going anywhere.

We're going to try him at DE, I think.

And if Raji isn't our 1st round pick, I'd be shocked.

If we get Raji we better trade down. He isn't worth the 3rd pick. That probably rules Curry out. He is too small, and isn't good enough in Coverage to be a LB in the 3-4.

[yashi]

If we get Raji we better trade down. He isn't worth the 3rd pick. That probably rules Curry out. He is too small, and isn't good enough in Coverage to be a LB in the 3-4.
Why isn't he worth the 3rd pick?

[yashi]

why do people not think DJ can play inside?
this is one thing I disagree with jlamerson on. His argument is that DJ isn't big or strong enough to be an effective LB in the 3-4. But looking around the league, many of the best 3-4 ILBs are the same size as he is including Larry Foote, Bradie James, James Farrier, Stephen Cooper.

I'd actually prefer him to be inside because then we don't have to worry about him tangling with OTs and TEs all day when he's blitzing. Not to mention he doesn't have a lot of pass rush moves.

He also may default to ILB simply because we won't have any better tacklers on the roster...

[Codac]

Why isn't he worth the 3rd pick?

I just think that is a little high for him. He is a 10-15 pick. Not a three. When it comes to this early in the Draft you draft the best available player. I think Crabtree, Monroe, Andre Smith, Jason Smith, and even Curry would be a better pick.

In this case Raji is not the best available player.

[fairladyZ]

Ya i don't see the problem. He's good size for a LB. He tackles well and he has incredible speed. I tihnk he would do just fine if not better as ILB

[Codac]

this is one thing I disagree with jlamerson on. His argument is that DJ isn't big or strong enough to be an effective LB in the 3-4. But looking around the league, many of the best 3-4 ILBs are the same size as he is including Larry Foote, Bradie James, James Farrier, Stephen Cooper.

I'd actually prefer him to be inside because then we don't have to worry about him tangling with OTs and TEs all day when he's blitzing. Not to mention he doesn't have a lot of pass rush moves.

He also may default to ILB simply because we won't have any better tacklers on the roster...

DJ can definitely play in the 3-4, as an ILB. He is a good coverage LB. Plus he has speed. He does need to work on his hitting mechanics but he will be fine. Might have to put on a few pounds in the offseason just to be safe.

[yashi]

I just think that is a little high for him. He is a 10-15 pick. Not a three. When it comes to this early in the Draft you draft the best available player. I think Crabtree, Monroe, Andre Smith, Jason Smith, and even Curry would be a better pick.

In this case Raji is not the best available player.
I guess we'll have to disagree on this one then. He was the consensus best player regardless of position at the senior bowl, and Scouts Inc. currently has him ranked as the 3rd best player, behind Crabtree and Curry.

NT is the most important position in a 3-4 defense, and not only is he far and away the best NT in the draft, but the best DT.

[fairladyZ]

Or what about Hali on ILB?
he's 6'3 275lbs. and he's got pretty good speed?

DJ---Hali---Scott---Curry

[Codac]

I guess we'll have to disagree on this one then. He was the consensus best player regardless of position at the senior bowl, and Scouts Inc. currently has him ranked as the 3rd best player, behind Crabtree and Curry.

NT is the most important position in a 3-4 defense, and not only is he far and away the best NT in the draft, but the best DT.

I agree he probably is the best NT/DT. But I don't think he is in the top 10 players in the draft.

[fairladyZ]

Plus we got to take into account the new LB coach which ever one it is. Should be a step up for our LB's and hope DJ can flourish like everyone thought he was going to.

[jmlamerson]

Or what about Hali on ILB?
he's 6'3 275lbs. and he's got pretty good speed?

DJ---Hali---Scott---Curry

Y'all convinced me on DJ as an ILB - so long as he gets a whole lot meaner than he currently is.

I would think Hali would lose the weight that slowed him down in 2008 and would be a natural Suggs-style OLB.

[yashi]

Here's what I feel like our optimal front seven looks like next year.

DE - Dorsey
NT - Raji
DE - Canty

OLB - Hali
ILB - Johnson
ILB - Bart Scott
OLB - 3rd or 4th round pick, some kind of pass rusher, maybe like Brandon Williams from Texas Tech. 12 sacks last year, but he's undersized for DE.. sounds perfect for a 3-4 OLB. This is where the beauty of the 3-4 comes in from a GM perspective, all the undersized college DEs fit in perfectly.

[KottkeKU]

this is one thing I disagree with jlamerson on. His argument is that DJ isn't big or strong enough to be an effective LB in the 3-4. But looking around the league, many of the best 3-4 ILBs are the same size as he is including Larry Foote, Bradie James, James Farrier, Stephen Cooper.

I'd actually prefer him to be inside because then we don't have to worry about him tangling with OTs and TEs all day when he's blitzing. Not to mention he doesn't have a lot of pass rush moves.

He also may default to ILB simply because we won't have any better tacklers on the roster...


the reason i personally believe DJ is a weak MLB, and a much better OLB is because a.) he cannot shed blocks very well because he is not as strong as the linebackers you mentioned...maybe hes the same size but pund for pound DJ's strength is that he is fast.. so he must b.) use his speed and athleticism on the -outside- to get around the pocket and cover TE's and slot receivers in zone...

i dont think he would that good a fit for a 3-4, but with some work he could be an effective pass rusher in that kind of a scheme...he just needs to learn to shed blocks and use more strength..

unless you wanted to put him at safety lol (kidding)

[jmlamerson]

Here's what I feel like our optimal front seven looks like next year.

DE - Dorsey
NT - Raji
DE - Canty

OLB - Hali
ILB - Johnson
ILB - Bart Scott
OLB - 3rd or 4th round pick, some kind of pass rusher, maybe like Brandon Williams from Texas Tech. 12 sacks last year, but he's undersized for DE.. sounds perfect for a 3-4 OLB. This is where the beauty of the 3-4 comes in from a GM perspective, all the undersized college DEs fit in perfectly.

You know, if Michael Johnson drops to the 2nd round, as he's been projected to, then he'd be a perfect OLB for us next year.

We have to go FS in the 3rd or 4th I think as well, because there's no way Page will work as a FS in a 3-4.

I guess what I'm saying is that we need to get more OL in FA than I thought.

[yashi]

You know, if Michael Johnson drops to the 2nd round, as he's been projected to, then he'd be a perfect OLB for us next year.

We have to go FS in the 3rd or 4th I think as well, because there's no way Page will work as a FS in a 3-4.

I guess what I'm saying is that we need to get more OL in FA than I thought.
Johnson would be an interesting OLB. I'm scared to go defense 1st and 2nd though with an OL that has so many holes. It's also possible that Mack, Duke Robinson, or Ebon Britton drop to the 2nd round, all of which we'd be hard pressed not to draft.

[Chief Tyler]

You know, if Michael Johnson drops to the 2nd round, as he's been projected to, then he'd be a perfect OLB for us next year.

We have to go FS in the 3rd or 4th I think as well, because there's no way Page will work as a FS in a 3-4.

I guess what I'm saying is that we need to get more OL in FA than I thought.

Ian Campbell at KSU, I'm not sure about his speed, seems a bit slow watching him, but just a thought. Early in his career he was All Big 12, Honorable Mention All American, and Big 12 D Player of the year playing both DE and LB. Prince rolled around and essentially killed his career playing that 3-4 mumbo jumbo (why do it on a college team? I don't know). I wouldn't be surprised if he fell undrafted, and he's already shown great potential with the right coaching/system. It's worth consideration though, I'd hope for at least one OL pick in the first two rounds as well.

[HokieChief 09]

I agree that we keep DJ, but he's not gonna be used as an ILB in a 3-4 defense. He's always been an OLB, and we have to utilize his speed and pass rushing abilities from the outside...which we have failed to do over the last 3 years. We have misused him since the day we drafted him, I think it's about damn time he has a breakout year and everyone in the league recognizes him for the beast of a linebacker that he actually is.

Now from the standpoint of the draft, I still think we go Aaron Curry. It's evident that the defense is going to be priority this offseason. I don't see us trading down, no team is gonna trade up to the #3 spot, so I think Raji is probably out of the question at this point. I think we go either Curry/Orakpo now, and then probably Michael Johnson in the 2nd if he's still there.

Jarrad Page- gone
Alphonso Boone- gone
Tamba Hali- I don't know if he will be good at LB, but i still think we keep him
DJ- keep him at OLB, please.
Demorrio Williams- keep as a backup, maybe utilize him on the inside
Donnie Edwards- gone
Glenn Dorsey- Honestly, i dont think he can be a NT, but at the same time we definitely dont get rid of him. a move to DE is a possibility
Pat Surtain- probably gone.
Brandon Carr/Flowers will be the starters.
Bernard Pollard is gonna have a huge year.
In free agency i think we have to make a push for Canty, Peppers, Scott. I agree, Vilma is probably out of the question, as is Haynesworth.

This is bar-none, going to be the most interesting offseason this team has had in a long time. I'm so pumped to see what we do...go chiefs.

[Sn@keIze]

I know one thing, If DJ does play one of the insides, we'll find out real quick what kind of man he is. Taking on guards more and seeing downhill runners more often.

Personnally I dont see it, if hes supposed to be real fast then he should be on the outside cuttin off outside runners and pass rushing.

[Coach]

Beat me to it!

Indeed it'll be interesting to see what happens with Dorsey. I think there's no question that he'll be used as a DE next season, but I really hope that he's able to play the position effectively. Who knows, maybe it'll be just the change he needs.

Also now I've completely decided that our 1st round pick should be B.J. Raji, Boston College.

Agreed, if the Chiefs move to 3-4, I think Raji is the automatic pick.

I also heard another rumor today from Pat Kerwin on NFL radio today. He said that the possible reason that the Chiefs haven't annoucned the defensive coaching repsonibilities yet for the people we have hired is because we are not done hiring. He specifically named Romeo Crennel as an option to be the DC. That rumor would fall right in line with the rumors that the Chiefs will move to a 3-4.

Lastly, I know several of us are nervous about a transition to a 3-4 defense and the effects that it may have on this team and our roster. But I would point out that this team finished 30th in defense last year so how much of a risk are we really taking? If we finished 5th in defense last year, I'd be screaming. I like a 3-4 defense. I'm interested to see how it all plays out.

[Sn@keIze]

Agreed, if the Chiefs move to 3-4, I think Raji is the automatic pick.

I also heard another rumor today from Pat Kerwin on NFL radio today. He said that the possible reason that the Chiefs haven't annoucned the defensive coaching repsonibilities yet for the people we have hired is because we are not done hiring. He specifically named Romeo Crennel as an option to be the DC. That rumor would fall right in line with the rumors that the Chiefs will move to a 3-4.

Lastly, I know several of us are nervous about a transition to a 3-4 defense and the effects that it may have on this team and our roster. But I would point out that this team finished 30th in defense last year so how much of a risk are we really taking? If we finished 5th in defense last year, I'd be screaming. I like a 3-4 defense. I'm interested to see how it all plays out.
I wouldnt be so sure bout Raji, Im thinkin more Rey Maualuga [or even Laurenitis]. Simply because know you need less DT and more LB. But more than that, its Piolis way, like how he drafted Jerod Mayo last year for the Pats.

Yes im excited bout 3-4 too. The 43 wasnt working. Need a change. Plus its harder for QBs to read, especially if Pollard plays near the same depth as the LBs, you just dont know whos gonna blits.

[DT14PRIEST]

I wouldnt be so sure bout Raji, Im thinkin more Rey Maualuga [or even Laurenitis]. Simply because know you need less DT and more LB. But more than that, its Piolis way, like how he drafted Jerod Mayo last year for the Pats.

If we switch to 3-4 then we better find a commanding presence up front for the NT position either through FA or the Draft or you can kiss any real success with it good bye. Maluga may be great but without any help up front he'd end up just being a waste of a draft pick. If we do switch to 3-4 and don't address the NT position through FA then you can bet your money on it that the Chiefs will look long and hard at Raiji.

Like Ray Lewis said what made him so good was Ngata up front.

[Coach]

If we switch to 3-4 then we better find a commanding presence up front for the NT position either through FA or the Draft or you can kiss any real success with it good bye. Maluga may be great but without any help up front he'd end up just being a waste of a draft pick. If we do switch to 3-4 and don't address the NT position through FA then you can bet your money on it that the Chiefs will look long and hard at Raiji.

Like Ray Lewis said what made him so good was Ngata up front.

I agree. Raji seems to be a perfect fit for this pick if he's still on the board. Detroit may take him, although doubtful they would take a NT with the #1 pick.

[HokieChief 09]

BJ Raji looks like he drank too much cool-aid. Seriously, look at his picture. But for real, just because he fits the 3-4 scheme doesn't automatically mean we are going to draft him first.

[rodu]

How would it hurt our cap if Tamba gets cut?

[pbatrucker]

I can't see switching to a 3-4 this year, we don't have the right personnel. We could just trade rosters with the steelers and that would solve all our problems, OPPS, we still wouldn"t have an O line

[Coach]

How would it hurt our cap if Tamba gets cut?

Hali has a $1,745,520 cap number for 2008.

[Coach]

I can't see switching to a 3-4 this year, we don't have the right personnel. We could just trade rosters with the steelers and that would solve all our problems, OPPS, we still wouldn"t have an O line

Yes, we wouldn't want to lose our 30th ranking in NFL defense.

[prough91]

Yes, we wouldn't want to lose our 30th ranking in NFL defense.

Hey, its hard to look that bad.

[DT14PRIEST]

Here is my thoughts if everything were to go as close to a realistic scenario in accordance to potential FA's and the #3 draft pick if the Chiefs were to switch to 3-4.

If its 3-4:

You can probably bet your money that the Chiefs will look long and hard in the FA maket to pick up a stout NT to command the physical presence in the trenches that is necessary for the system to flourish and look to pick up one if not two LBs to replace our motley crew. I took the liberty of posting my thoughts on potential FA guys.

Positions of Need for Success: DT, LB, DE

Kedic Golston DT, Washington

- 6'4 320lbs
- 3 Years NFL Experience
- Pros: Good size, strength, and ability.
- Cons: Conditioning Issues

Anthony Montgomery DT, Washington

- 6'6 315lbs
- 3 Years NFL Experience
- Pros: Elite Size, a double team machine with long arms
- Cons: Conditioning and Technique issues

Chris Canty DE, Dallas

- 6'6 310lbs
- 4 Years NFL Experience
- Pros: Elite Size, Speed, and ability to play 3-4, 4-3
- Cons: Durability

Channing Crowder LB, Miami

- 6'2 250lbs
- 4 Years NFL Experience
- Pros: Playmaker, great motor, sure handed tackler and good coverage ability
- Cons: Durability

Micheal Boley LB, Atlanta

- 6'3 230lbs
- 4 Years NFL Experience
- Pros: Quick feet, Great closing speed, a staple for a pass rusher, sure handed tackler with a 4 quarter motor
- Cons: Not a tremendous block shedder, tendency to over pursue on run plays

Jonathan Vilma LB, New Orleans

- 6'2 220lbs
- 5 Yeas NFL Experience
- Pros: Quick off the edge, solid tackling ability, a sideline to sideline linebacker that has a nose for the ball.
- Cons: He's small, not an elite pass rusher, hard time shedding blocks given his size, average in coverage

Anyways thats what I think, at least for the front seven. Were any of these guys to come I'd like to say we'd see an immediate increase in defensive.

[warcrychief]

Pioli and Haley havent said anything yet. so im not sold.

[Coach]

I'm starting to think Canty is our best chance at a FA DE.

[Sn@keIze]

If we switch to 3-4 then we better find a commanding presence up front for the NT position either through FA or the Draft or you can kiss any real success with it good bye. Maluga may be great but without any help up front he'd end up just being a waste of a draft pick. If we do switch to 3-4 and don't address the NT position through FA then you can bet your money on it that the Chiefs will look long and hard at Raiji.

Like Ray Lewis said what made him so good was Ngata up front.I agree with that, its no doubt the biggest obstacle to overcome by the switch.

But the question is what to do with Dorsey. Im not seeing him as DE. does he have any value to him to other team that to employ the 4-3. We commited big money to him as 1st pick, you think anybody would want to pick him up? that would make it a lot easier.

[Coach]

I agree with that, its no doubt the biggest obstacle to overcome by the switch.

But the question is what to do with Dorsey. Im not seeing him as DE. does he have any value to him to other team that to employ the 4-3. We commited big money to him as 1st pick, you think anybody would want to pick him up? that would make it a lot easier.

If we do move to a 3-4, I think I'd take an early 2nd rd'er if it was offered for Dorsey. Cap hit would be $ 2,395,000 I believe.
http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/teamdetail.aspx?team=16&year=2008&loc=interstitialskip

[balto]

CRAZY IDEA!!!!!!!!!!

Jonathan Vilma LB, New Orleans
6'2 220lbs

Bernard Pollard S (or LB????)
6'1 225lbs

We all know Pollard can lay the smack down SOOO why not convert him to a blitzing crazy LB???? He has the size of Vilma and has experience dropping back in coverage hehe.

[balto]

BTW:

I honestly see no reason why we could not trade down and give up value. You always hear about teams calling to move up, but the teams in the top 5 just wanted to much. Why can't we trade down to say 8th with the jags and only get an extra 2nd rounder? That would be WAAAY under value and then we could get Rey Maualuga and then have two 2nd round picks to take a OL/DE or both

[jmlamerson]

If we do move to a 3-4, I think I'd take an early 2nd rd'er if it was offered for Dorsey. Cap hit would be $ 2,395,000 I believe.
http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/teamdetail.aspx?team=16&year=2008&loc=interstitialskip

Actually, the cap hit would be the prorated portion of his signing bonus. Or $20M before June 1 or $10M a year for two years after June 1.

[Sn@keIze]

CRAZY IDEA!!!!!!!!!!

Jonathan Vilma LB, New Orleans
6'2 220lbs

Bernard Pollard S (or LB????)
6'1 225lbs

We all know Pollard can lay the smack down SOOO why not convert him to a blitzing crazy LB???? He has the size of Vilma and has experience dropping back in coverage hehe.Thats whats so beautiful bout the 3-4! a lot of the time Pollard will be coming up blits or even fake blits and dropping back. Much like Polumalu. The schemes will be awesome. But Pollard has great ability to play SS too.

[AussieChiefsFan]

I think experimenting with the defense is a good idea since we have been doing so badly, lately.

[DT14PRIEST]

Thought this was an interesting bit of information. Listed below is the starting NT for every team that ran the 3-4 last season. Included is Dorsey for all intents and purposes.

Williams, SD 6-3 348
Rogers, CLE 6-4 340
Jenkins, NYJ 6-4 335
Wilfork, NE 6-2 325
Hampton, PIT 6-1 320
Franklin, SF 6-1 320
Ngata, BAL 6-4 345
Ferguson, MIA 6-3 305
Dorsey, KC 6-1 297
Ratliff, DAL 6-4 293

What does this mean? While Dorsey may not have elite height the possibility of putting on some weight and bulking up this off season shouldn't be ruled out of the question. So the possibilty of him playing NT shouldn't be completely ruled out.

Unlikely? Yes, but it wouldn't suprise me if it happened.

[chief31]

Canty should now be our #1 priority in FA.

Hali should be moved to LB next season, Dorsey to DE. Tank will be our reserve NT and Boone a reserve DE, I figure.

McBride and Ron Edwards are gone.

I could see us trading DJ, as he's probably not a 3-4 LB.

Pollard will have a career year.

Page is gone.

We need (probably) two new LBs, a new FS, and a new NT.

I don't think Hali stands a chance as a LB in any system. And, if I were forced to use him as a LB it would be at ILB. He, in no way shape or form has the agility to play as an OLB.

I say Hali hits the weights and adds pounds, to be able to play DE in a 3-4. He did play pretty well at DT in college.

And Dorsey has the ability to be either a NT or a DE in the 3-4. (I'd prefer to seehim at DE.)

DJ is perfect for a 3-4 OLB spot. Speed, agility and awareness.

I think he benefits from a switch every bit as much as Pollard would at SS.

Lastly, I think that Turk Mcbride benefits from a switch. He was always too slow to play DE and to weak to play DT. A tweener, in the worst way.

The 3-4 DE is exactly a tweener of 4-3 DT and 4-3 DE. Perfect fit for him. He played very well as a college DT too.

If Tank/Dorsey can handle the NT spot, then the rest of the defense gains from the switch. IMO.

Oh, except for the FS. I dislike Page now. And I won't like him any better in a 3-4. He plays poor football.

[jmlamerson]

I don't think Hali stands a chance as a LB in any system. And, if I were forced to use him as a LB it would be at ILB. He, in no way shape or form has the agility to play as an OLB.

I say Hali hits the weights and adds pounds, to be able to play DE in a 3-4. He did play pretty well at DT in college.

And Dorsey has the ability to be either a NT or a DE in the 3-4. (I'd prefer to seehim at DE.)

DJ is perfect for a 3-4 OLB spot. Speed, agility and awareness.

I think he benefits from a switch every bit as much as Pollard would at SS.

Lastly, I think that Turk Mcbride benefits from a switch. He was always too slow to play DE and to weak to play DT. A tweener, in the worst way.

The 3-4 DE is exactly a tweener of 4-3 DT and 4-3 DE. Perfect fit for him. He played very well as a college DT too.

If Tank/Dorsey can handle the NT spot, then the rest of the defense gains from the switch. IMO.

Oh, except for the FS. I dislike Page now. And I won't like him any better in a 3-4. He plays poor football.

We'll see, obviously.

I think Turk's gone and that there's no way Dorsey can handle being a NT, given his performance against various OL in 2008. I think he's either moved to DE or turned into a reserve.

I could be wrong about DJ and Hali, but I don't think Pioli sees either as a long term solution at their new positions.

I think Tank becomes our backup NT and we draft Raji.

[jason1981]

Chiefs’ Haley still sorting out roles for assistant coaches - Kansas City Star (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/chiefs/story/1041866.html)


Another major decision facing Haley is whether to align the Chiefs in a 3-4 or a 4-3 defense. Haley hired as assistants two former NFL defensive coordinators, Gary Gibbs and Clancy Pendergast. Gibbs has a more extensive background in the 3-4 and Pendergast in the 4-3.
Haley wouldn’t say, but it’s possible Gibbs could be the coordinator and Pendergast the linebackers coach if the Chiefs use the 3-4. Those duties might reverse if Haley decides to use the 4-3.
“We just had the first staff meeting (Tuesday),” Haley said. “What I told these guys is that I want them to go through each player and then we’ll figure out what we have. We’ll do that on each side of the ball, very detailed. I want an open mind. I’m a big believer in doing what your players can do best. When we get through that process, I’ll have a stronger feeling about which way we’re going to go.


Im not sure who is more acurate ADAM TEICHER or Adam Schefter. im begining to think no one knows yet but i really hope we switch to 3-4.

[jason1981]

“I will say that some of the players we have here defensively from what I’ve seen offer some flexibility. (Glenn) Dorsey is a good enough athlete to have some versatility. He could play either system.”

i forgot to add this quote that haley said as well.

[jap1]

“I will say that some of the players we have here defensively from what I’ve seen offer some flexibility. (Glenn) Dorsey is a good enough athlete to have some versatility. He could play either system.”

i forgot to add this quote that haley said as well.

I was just about to post that article myself.

With all the cloak and dagger secrecy at arrowhead now, I dont think anyone knows other than Piloli and Haley.

[theaxeeffect4311]

Switching to a 3-4 defense is a bad choice right now for the Chiefs. With the overhaul that would be needed on defense, it would be better to run a 4-3 while drafting players that can play in both. Bad move on the Chiefs.

[jtandcrew]

I, for one thinks that switching to the 3-4 would be a good idea. I think we have more LB's that can play than we do DL's. Even though I woulda liked to see Gunther run his own defense im still interested to see how this turns out. Nothing else? This will be a interesting season! lets just sit back and enjoy!:bananen_smilies046:

[marloweopatchiefs]

well i was gonna post about this but someone beat me to it. anyways i'm glad they are switching. It's to bad that we can't get peppers though.

[prough91]

Switching to a 3-4 defense is a bad choice right now for the Chiefs. With the overhaul that would be needed on defense, it would be better to run a 4-3 while drafting players that can play in both. Bad move on the Chiefs.

How many players and how many years do you think it would take to switch to 3-4?


I, for one thinks that switching to the 3-4 would be a good idea. I think we have more LB's that can play than we do DL's. Even though I woulda liked to see Gunther run his own defense im still interested to see how this turns out. Nothing else? This will be a interesting season! lets just sit back and enjoy!:bananen_smilies046:

Um...Gunther's gone.

[jmlamerson]

How many players and how many years do you think it would take to switch to 3-4?

It doesn't take any time to switch. It just takes takes time for the players to be effective in the scheme. Usually two to three years.

Drawing this thing out only hurts us in the long run. Even the wildest optimist can't think we have more than seven long-term starters on the defense right now. Pull the band-aid while the defense is being built up.

[prough91]

It doesn't take any time to switch. It just takes takes time for the players to be effective in the scheme. Usually two to three years.

Drawing this thing out only hurts us in the long run. Even the wildest optimist can't think we have more than seven long-term starters on the defense right now. Pull the band-aid while the defense is being built up.

Granted. But will there not be any drafts or free agent acquisitions the next few years?

[jmlamerson]

Granted. But will there not be any drafts or free agent acquisitions the next few years?

That's my point. No use picking up new guys in FA or the draft and playing them in a 4-3 this year. If you want to switch, switch now when we don't have much talent.

[texaschief]

This isn't a done deal.

As soon as they disclose who the DC is going to be, we'll know. As of right now, Haley doesn't know what scheme they'll be running. But, he did say that he'll run the scheme that best fits his players. If he holds true to that, we'll be running a 4-3.

[AussieChiefsFan]

That's my point. No use picking up new guys in FA or the draft and playing them in a 4-3 this year. If you want to switch, switch now when we don't have much talent.exactly what i think (though, we need DT's & DE's) (but, i DO think we could experiment with a 3-4 defense):fatlock:

[Bike]

That's my point. No use picking up new guys in FA or the draft and playing them in a 4-3 this year. If you want to switch, switch now when we don't have much talent.
Exactly. Whats the worse that could happen? We drop from 30 to 32?:bananen_smilies046:

[AussieChiefsFan]

Exactly. Whats the worse that could happen? We drop from 30 to 32?:bananen_smilies046:yeah, pretty much we can only get better from here! (I hope we do)

[warcrychief]

This isn't a done deal.

As soon as they disclose who the DC is going to be, we'll know. As of right now, Haley doesn't know what scheme they'll be running. But, he did say that he'll run the scheme that best fits his players. If he holds true to that, we'll be running a 4-3.

Chiefs | Crennel weighing offer to become coordinator
Sun, 01 Mar 2009 16:48:53 -0800
Tony Grossi, of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, reports former Cleveland Browns (http://www.kffl.com/team/13/nfl) head coach Romeo Crennel (http://www.kffl.com/player/8303/nfl) is weighing an offer to become the defensive coordinator of the Kansas City Chiefs (http://www.kffl.com/team/21/nfl).
www.kffl.com (http://www.kffl.com)

Im not sure it this would be a good move or not? well can we get any worse? sign Crennel!

[warcrychief]

If we do go 3-4, i hope we make a offer to Rey Lewis. He got snubbed by the ravens, cowboys, jets. i bet he would just love to show those ppl that they were wrong for doing that.

[AussieChiefsFan]

good idea:sign0098: