I have not been impressed with Cassel

**figcrostic** · 11-16-2009, 12:57 PM

I don't think he sucks, and I know we our offense is still in the gelling process, but I honest don't think he is elite or ever will be elite. I don't think he has great accuracy, I don't think he has a great arm, and I don't think he has great vision either. I would say he will be a good quaterback, but never be great. Heres the thing we don't need great, we need good we need a guy that doesn't throw a lot of of interceptions, which he doesn't, but we also need accuracy and right now he doesn't have it, right now he is not a good QB. Trent Green was a good QB behind phenomenal line he had great accuracy and an average arm. Cassel doesn't have the luxury of a good line, and has bad accuracy he overthrows balls or underthrows so when a receiver catches the ball he has to slow down to catch it because of his slow release. I don't think he is worth what we are paying him, because I think he is a 3rd pick at best and we are paying him like a 1st rounder which he isn't. I think we need to work on our O-line and possible pick up a QB with that second round pick we got for Tony, im not saying we should get rid of Cassel but he does need competition which Brody is not going to give him not because Brodie isn't good but Brodie gets hurt too easy so he will pretty much always be a career back up.

**chief31** · 11-19-2009, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by pbatrucker

Both sides to this argument have good points. We all agree the OL stinks.
Cassell was sacked twice as much in 2008 than Brady in 2007, but then again I believe Brady is being sacked more this year than in 2007.
I agree Cassell holds the ball too long. But if he could trust the WR to run the correct routes and be were they should be, maybe he would have the confidence to relaease the ball earlier.
All I'm saying is it's a combined effort, OL, QB, WR and coaching.

Just to clarify...
The New England Patriots rank third in fewest sacks allowed, so far, this season.

NFL Stats: by Team Category

They ranked 5th in 2007. (With Tom Brady)

NFL Stats: by Team Category

And they ranked 28th in 2008 (with mostly Matt Casell)

NFL Stats: by Team Category

**Bike** · 11-19-2009, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by figcrostic

And it's mostly his fault he needs to quit having stage fright and release the damn ball, that's why last year and this year he has been the most sacked QB. Tom Brady was sacked 21 times in 2007 Matt Cassel with the same line and one game less was sacked 47 times thats more then double the amount with the same line, so it's not just our crappy line Matt needs to release the ball sooner not just to avoid a sack, but he needs to hit his receivers sooner so they don't have to slow down to make the catch.

I agree with all that but it would certainly help if Cassel did have a better offensive line. It would also help if he had a qb coach and an offensive coordinator. And it would help if his recievers could run some decent routes. Can't really compare now to Cassels time in New England. Cassel aint Tom Brady. Not many people are. Cassel DID win games there. But that probably had to do with a superior support system he had there that he can only dream about here.

**SIC J** · 11-19-2009, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by Bike

I agree with all that but it would certainly help if Cassel did have a better offensive line. It would also help if he had a qb coach and an offensive coordinator. And it would help if his recievers could run some decent routes. Can't really compare now to Cassels time in New England. Cassel aint Tom Brady. Not many people are. Cassel DID win games there. But that probably had to do with a superior support system he had there that he can only dream about here.

I agree with this.

Thats why I am yet to have a real opinion on Cassel. Going from a "great" team to a terrible one, you can't really say how good or not he really is. BUT at the same time, Cassel still has to play the game, make the throws, etc and won 10 games last year as a "back-up" QB.

Let's be honest, how many "back-up" QBs have won 10 games in a season?

**figcrostic** · 11-19-2009, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by chief31

Just to clarify...
The New England Patriots rank third in fewest sacks allowed, so far, this season.

NFL Stats: by Team Category

They ranked 5th in 2007. (With Tom Brady)

NFL Stats: by Team Category

And they ranked 28th in 2008 (with mostly Matt Casell)

NFL Stats: by Team Category

And once again the O-line is magically great again Brady only sacked 12 times in 9 games if you stretch that over 16 games that's 21 sacks. The patriots didn't get way better Tom Brady just releases the ball quicker. Same line one year 21 sacks next year 47 it's the QB.

**figcrostic** · 11-19-2009, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by SIC J

I agree with this.

Thats why I am yet to have a real opinion on Cassel. Going from a "great" team to a terrible one, you can't really say how good or not he really is. BUT at the same time, Cassel still has to play the game, make the throws, etc and won 10 games last year as a "back-up" QB.

Let's be honest, how many "back-up" QBs have won 10 games in a season?

**** Tyler Thigpen and Brodie Croyle would have won 10 games with a team that won 19 straight games the year before.

**SIC J** · 11-19-2009, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by figcrostic

**** Tyler Thigpen and Brodie Croyle would have won 10 games with a team that won 19 straight games the year before.

I highly doubt that...........

**yashi** · 11-19-2009, 03:13 PM

Sacks are always just as much about the QB as they are about the offensive line, if not more so. Cassel is always going to be sacked a lot no matter how good our line is, because similar to Roethlisberger and Rodgers, he holds the ball too long.

**figcrostic** · 11-19-2009, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by yashi

Sacks are always just as much about the QB as they are about the offensive line, if not more so. Cassel is always going to be sacked a lot no matter how good our line is, because similar to Roethlisberger and Rodgers, he holds the ball too long.

Yeah but Cassel doesn't have the weapons big Ben has or his arm strength, that's why he gets away with it.

**yashi** · 11-19-2009, 07:01 PM

Originally Posted by figcrostic

Yeah but Cassel doesn't have the weapons big Ben has or his arm strength, that's why he gets away with it.

Cassel is not as good as Ben or Rodgers. I was just comparing the fact that all three QBs have a tendency to hold onto the ball too long.

**tornadospotter** · 11-19-2009, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by texaschief

Truth

Truth.

I was giving him the benefit of the doubt with the New England line. After they "let" Brady get hurt, I just figured their time as a good O-line was over and all of Cassels sacks last year would've been sacks even if Brady had been healthy. The New England line made one change from last year and rank first in the league in fewest sacks allowed this season. Even more evidence that the sack issue has just as much to do with Cassel as it does the O-line. But, by evidence of how horrible the O-line is at run-blocking, it's not ENTIRELY Cassel's fault either.

This has frustrated me ALL SEASON. Why doesn't the QB coach tell him something like "get rid of the ball?" My guess is he's probably too busy feuding with too many of his other players to even think about coaching up his QB.

This is a coaching issue... not a talent issue. MIGHT have something to do with switching the entire offense the week before the season started...

The deal for Cassel/Vrabel was a great deal for the Chiefs. I have my doubts about Cassel as a franchise QB, but quite honestly, you can't really name more than 10 entrenched "franchise QB's" in the NFL right now that you'd feel comfortable building your team around.

Brady-Patriots
Manning-Colts
McNabb-Eagles
Brees-Saints
Rivers-Chargers
Manning-Giants
Ryan-Falcons
Roethlisberger-Steelers
Palmer?-Bengals
Flacco?-Ravens
Cutler?-Bears
Stafford?-Lions
Sanchez?-Jets
Shaub?-Texans

If you look at the list, the first 9 or 10 teams are on the elite level of the NFL which would go against the "you don't NEED an elite QB to win" theory... (which i agree with lol)

At the end of the day, you gotta go with someone. I thought Brodie and/or Thigpen could've handled the duties until we got our O-line in order, but that didn't happen. Hopefully, this season for Cassel will be one like Aikmen had to endure in Dallas.

I just don't see how Pioli could think Haley has done even an average job of coaching these players. He's got his head so far up his own

with appointing himself pretty much the ONLY offensive coach on the team. In order for your players to perform at the level you think they should be performing, they need coaching. One man can't do it all and the players can't coach themselves.

The head coach shouldn't be:
teaching WRs where to lineup,
while teaching his QB where his reads and progressions should go on any given coverage per play,
while developing a game plan for the next opponent,
while developing an offensive game plan for the next opponent
while developing a defensive game plan for the next opponent
while watching game film,
while PROPERLY evaluating the talent on the team, while feuding with disgruntled players
while trying to find more "players off the street"
while holding press conferences
while blowing smoke up his own ***

THIS COACHING SITUATION MAKES ABSOLUTELY ZERO SENSE.

I AGREE!!!!!!!!! Where is Chan?

That's right I forgot, he did not fit the plan.