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Thread: Why NFL could close in 2011

  1. #1
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    Default Why NFL could close in 2011


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    Anyone read this article on Yahoo this morning?
    Thoughts...

    Yahoo! Sports - Sports News, Scores, Rumors, Fantasy Games, and more
    slug=ms-laborquestions090810
    **ChiefsChick**

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    The owners are 100% to blame and there's no getting around it. They won't give an inch because their pride takes a hit when the players get what they want and the owners don't when the owners feel like they OWN the players. These owners all need to figure out that it's not about them or even the players. It's about those people in the STANDS that support them, most to their graves.
    C:\Users\Master Sin\Desktop\thumb_pl_180492.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    What you say about the game being dangrous is true it is. SO WHAT. They CHOSE to play it.

    There are alot of things you leave out.

    1 FREE EDUCATION. MOST nfl players got to go to school for FREE or at least at a HIGH discount. That should provide them the abilty to set up life AFTER football. If they chose to blow through school that is there fault and no one eles. The players have a pretty nice life they just want more.

    2. What other industruy do the employess gets a higher % of the money then the ownership?. For example I work for a major chain store. Ownership for that chain makes FAR more then what I as a employee does and it's not even close. The employee who like the players provides most of the service makes very little compared to those in ownership and managment. And because they CHOSE to play a game that should be diffrant? Ijust don't buy it. I don't no the excat number I just no that the players get more the 50% of the money that the NFL brings in. You make it sound like its just the owners Rolling in Money keeping the players down. It's not. It's BOTH sides.

    The owners did opt out. But It's also the players REFUSEING to give an inch on there demands like the owners that is the players. If the players would be willing to give something back then it would be much easier. Likewise with the owners. It's going to take BOTH sides fianly giveing in and giveing something to the otherside to work things out. Not just 1.
    1. A "free" education is what players get in *college* in exchange for the colleges getting hundreds of millions of dollars. It has absolutely nothing to do with the pros.

    2. In every industry of any size the cost labor exceeds ownership profits. No individual player makes as much as the owner, but employee salaries as a whole necessarily exceed profits. The larger the organization, the more true this statement becomes.

    Players agreed to certain concessions. Now, after *ownership* opted out, they're negotaiting to get healthcare and pensions.

    And when you say players are refusing to give into demands. What demands, exactly, are you talking about? If it's longer hours for less pay, what employee will agree to that? If you want to pretend this a fair contractual agreement, what person in his right mind will agree to that? If it's not those, what is it? Because owners have been very quiet about what they're actually seeking.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bwilliams View Post
    2. In every industry of any size the cost labor exceeds ownership profits. No individual player makes as much as the owner, but employee salaries as a whole necessarily exceed profits. The larger the organization, the more true this statement becomes.
    Add to that that this is an industry where the product is the employee's own skills.

    A lockout would be entirely on the owners. And that is what is being discussed here.

    But, if that happens, then it will be the owners who feel the immediate sting of a massive loss of customers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bwilliams View Post
    1. A "free" education is what players get in *college* in exchange for the colleges getting hundreds of millions of dollars. It has absolutely nothing to do with the pros.

    2. In every industry of any size the cost labor exceeds ownership profits. No individual player makes as much as the owner, but employee salaries as a whole necessarily exceed profits. The larger the organization, the more true this statement becomes.

    Players agreed to certain concessions. Now, after *ownership* opted out, they're negotaiting to get healthcare and pensions.

    And when you say players are refusing to give into demands. What demands, exactly, are you talking about? If it's longer hours for less pay, what employee will agree to that? If you want to pretend this a fair contractual agreement, what person in his right mind will agree to that? If it's not those, what is it? Because owners have been very quiet about what they're actually seeking.
    So the players should get heatcare and pensions AND More money? What excatly would the owners be gaining? Why would they agree to that? That's the problem in the whole deal.

    Why not the onwers get there extra 2 games to take in more money and the players get there healthcare and pensions provided by the owners? Both sides gain.

    the owners there 2 games of money.

    The players there healthcare and pensionsions.

    Both sides walk away with something. But see it's not the health care/pensions that is the problem. Its the greed on the players side saying give us this but we are not going to take any less.And it's the greed on the owners part that they don't want to give one dime less then they have to.

    As for the free education that does have somethign to do with it. People make it sound like theses guys can't do anything after they play. If they used there education they should be able to do something after they play. Or heres a novel idea don't buy the 100,000 cars and all that nice stuff the players like to get and live i don't no like a normal person. The players have good lifes. They make almost 3 times what the normal american gets every year and yes maybe that's only 3 years on the average but again they should do fine afterwards to. But yet they still want more. I call that greed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chief31 View Post
    Add to that that this is an industry where the product is the employee's own skills.

    A lockout would be entirely on the owners. And that is what is being discussed here.

    But, if that happens, then it will be the owners who feel the immediate sting of a massive loss of customers.
    That's the same in any industry. But Ownership gets a higher % of the money. Example
    EA sports a major game makers made over 4 Billion in profits last year. There toatal payroll is less then 1 billion. Were did the money go. Into the owerners managers pockets. The diffrance pay in the industry does not start at over 200,000$ a year. You get John doe who makes 30,000$ a year. That's the point. players don't no how good they have it. I bet you if you made the players work for 30,000 for a year they would sign the deal the owners want the very next day. The players have it good. The owners have it good. Both sides want more. Thats what I call greed.

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    I say they should make it 18 hame season, get a rookie cap in place 1pick 50% of what they went for last year and down from there.
    Then increase the tam cap 25% to get more money to vetran players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    So the players should get heatcare and pensions AND More money? What excatly would the owners be gaining? Why would they agree to that? That's the problem in the whole deal.

    Why not the onwers get there extra 2 games to take in more money and the players get there healthcare and pensions provided by the owners? Both sides gain.

    the owners there 2 games of money.

    The players there healthcare and pensionsions.

    Both sides walk away with something. But see it's not the health care/pensions that is the problem. Its the greed on the players side saying give us this but we are not going to take any less.And it's the greed on the owners part that they don't want to give one dime less then they have to.

    As for the free education that does have somethign to do with it. People make it sound like theses guys can't do anything after they play. If they used there education they should be able to do something after they play. Or heres a novel idea don't buy the 100,000 cars and all that nice stuff the players like to get and live i don't no like a normal person. The players have good lifes. They make almost 3 times what the normal american gets every year and yes maybe that's only 3 years on the average but again they should do fine afterwards to. But yet they still want more. I call that greed.
    Why are you assuming the players haven't offered concessions? How do you know?

    And again, the only reason there's even a situation is because owners opted out. How does the owners opting out mean the players are greedy?

    As for the 18 games. I don't know if you have a job. If you do, assume that your employer asked you to work 12% more hours for no pay. Oh, and you work in dangerous job, and if you get hurt you're fired. Would you do it?

    Again, how little or much NFL players got out of college is irrelevant. The NFL didn't pay for any of the players' educations. You don't need a college education or degree to be a NFL player. The players who did graduate worked for the colleges in exchange for their scholarships. The NFL has nothing to do with it.

    And as I showed you earlier, the average NFL player isn't buying $100,000 cars. They aren't making millions. Why do you think they are?

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by chief31 View Post
    Add to that that this is an industry where the product is the employee's own skills.
    That's the same in any industry. But Ownership gets a higher % of the money. Example
    EA sports a major game makers made over 4 Billion in profits last year. There toatal payroll is less then 1 billion. Were did the money go. Into the owerners managers pockets. The diffrance pay in the industry does not start at over 200,000$ a year. You get John doe who makes 30,000$ a year. That's the point.
    John Doe can easily be replaced by John Moe.

    Payton Manning cannot be replaced by John Moe.

    Noone wants to pay to see John Moe play football, nor do anything else. They pay to see Payton Manning.

    That is, most definitely, not the same in any industry.


    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    players don't no how good they have it. I bet you if you made the players work for 30,000 for a year they would sign the deal the owners want the very next day. The players have it good. The owners have it good. Both sides want more. Thats what I call greed.
    I bet if you made slaves of any people, that they would start obeying their masters.

    What kind of point is that?

    Just because you can point to some corporate greed that has ownership taking all the profits doesn't, by a far cry, make that right.

    They need the employees in order to make those profits happen. They have to have the whole team working together.

    But, once the teamwork results in massive profits, the owners no longer want to be a part of the team. They want all the rewards.

    Only by unity do the employees have any voice, aside from begging the masters, on the "team".

    And the entire history of our planet has shown that, left to the masters to decide unchallenged, masters will have slavery.

    All you need to do as an NFL owner is have alot of money to buy the team, and hire a GM and/or team president.

    I am not on the bandwagon of helping the rich to get richer. And the average NFL player is not even on the "rich radar" with these owners.

    Free market? Fine. As long as you are willing to accept that unions are a part of the free market.

    But again, it is the owners who cancelled the existing agreement. And it is the owners who are threatening to disrupt regular season play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bwilliams View Post
    Why are you assuming the players haven't offered concessions? How do you know?

    And again, the only reason there's even a situation is because owners opted out. How does the owners opting out mean the players are greedy?

    As for the 18 games. I don't know if you have a job. If you do, assume that your employer asked you to work 12% more hours for no pay. Oh, and you work in dangerous job, and if you get hurt you're fired. Would you do it?

    Again, how little or much NFL players got out of college is irrelevant. The NFL didn't pay for any of the players' educations. You don't need a college education or degree to be a NFL player. The players who did graduate worked for the colleges in exchange for their scholarships. The NFL has nothing to do with it.

    And as I showed you earlier, the average NFL player isn't buying $100,000 cars. They aren't making millions. Why do you think they are?
    Quote Originally Posted by chief31 View Post
    John Doe can easily be replaced by John Moe.

    Payton Manning cannot be replaced by John Moe.

    Noone wants to pay to see John Moe play football, nor do anything else. They pay to see Payton Manning.

    That is, most definitely, not the same in any industry.




    I bet if you made slaves of any people, that they would start obeying their masters.

    What kind of point is that?

    Just because you can point to some corporate greed that has ownership taking all the profits doesn't, by a far cry, make that right.

    They need the employees in order to make those profits happen. They have to have the whole team working together.

    But, once the teamwork results in massive profits, the owners no longer want to be a part of the team. They want all the rewards.

    Only by unity do the employees have any voice, aside from begging the masters, on the "team".

    And the entire history of our planet has shown that, left to the masters to decide unchallenged, masters will have slavery.

    All you need to do as an NFL owner is have alot of money to buy the team, and hire a GM and/or team president.

    I am not on the bandwagon of helping the rich to get richer. And the average NFL player is not even on the "rich radar" with these owners.

    Free market? Fine. As long as you are willing to accept that unions are a part of the free market.

    But again, it is the owners who cancelled the existing agreement. And it is the owners who are threatening to disrupt regular season play.
    Ok one last time And I think we can agree to disagree.

    I am sure that if the players were willing to give something back we would not be were we are now. The owners are not stupid they would make something work. Likewise if the owners would budge then the players would. It's BOTH sides. Yes the owners opted out but you have to keep in mind the economy has been on the decline for years. It's simply not the same market. Can you say if you made a deal the market changed you would not opt out.


    The avarge player does not make millions i no but they make about 300,000 a year at least. I would have to work 10 years to get to that. If they only do play 3 years thats 900,000 and I am going off the 2007 salarys. I am sure they have gone up. I most likely will not see 900,000 in my lifetime. So why can't the players get there own health insuarce? Millions of other americans do it. Why are they so specal?

    Like i stated sports are the only industry where the ownership/managment does not get the higher % of the income. Gamestop the company i work for reports over 3 billion almost every year with a payroll of about 750,000. Ownership makes all the money. The players have it good. The fact that they are wanting any more is greed IMO.

    I don't care to much about the owners and belive it or not I side with the players most of the time. I have just grown tired of hearing people makeing 10 times more then I complain about there job market. They have it so good. Make them work for 30,000 a year and then offer what the owners want i bet they would take that deal in a hartbeat.

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