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Thread: 10-15 Pick in 2012 Draft Who Do we take?

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    Default 10-15 Pick in 2012 Draft Who Do we take?


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    Alright so what do we know as of this moment about the our Kansas City Chiefs? Look at the depth chart from top to bottom. Look at the record. Look at the stats. Look at the game tape. What do you see?

    QB - Matt Cassel's play has been inconsistent with flashes of hope. Overall highly disappointing.

    RB - Jackie has shown he can contribute. Slightly inconsistent. But promising especially if paired with a faster more reliable back, aka, Jamal Charles. LeRon has not been as effective as I had hoped but I never truely expected very much out of him.

    WR - We have one of the best trios of wideouts in the league in my opinion. We just can't get them the ball.

    TE - No help at all.

    OL - Started out strong but lately have been iffy.

    DL - Changes all around, save for Dorsey, who is still questionable.

    LB - Same as DL. Houston shows promise every now and then. Need another ILB and a solid OLB opposite Hali.

    DB - The loss of Berry was huge. Carr hasn't been as effective this year. Constantly beat. A pickup at CB to compete with Carr would be nice.

    ST - Succop started bad but has been decent so far this year. He is definitely on the hot seat though. Still lacking a solid returner.

    So with all that. Who do you take with your first draft pickK?

    While I would love to see RGIII in a Chiefs uniform I am almost positive that Pioli will not draft a QB. Cassel will be given another year to prove himself.

    I say we go defense. Many will complain that our OL needs immediate improvement. Well I disagree. I say our defense is a more pressing matter. I like these three players.

    Manti Te'o/LB/Notre Dame - I like him to be our ILB opposite Johnson. Think Ray Lewis. Not a great pass rusher. But a smart, strong tackler that can cover slower RBs and TEs. Injuries are a concern.

    Courtney Upshaw/LB/Alabama - Line him up opposite Hali. Stong and fast. Great Vision. Good motor.

    Dontari Poe/DT/Memphis - This one is a stretch for the pick we will probably have. But I think he could be a good NT. He is athletic for his size. Not a great pass rusher but can stuff the run. Raw Talent. Reason I consider him a stretch.

    Alright lets hear it.

  2. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jrudi View Post
    WOW... I just went back an looked at that 2009 draft, and I never realized how horrible it was.

    Round 1- Tyson Jackson (we all know what we think of him)
    Round 2- None (Traded to NE for Cassel and Vrabel)
    Round 3- Alex Magee (No longer with team, traded to tampa for I think a 5th rounder)
    Round 4- Donald Washinton (Didn't work out as a nickle, converted to safety and well we've witnessed how this has worked out)
    Round 5- Collin Brown (Never Made the active roster for us, was gone in 2010 and played for the Hartford Colonials, then with the Ravens and is now with the Bills)
    Round 6- Quinten Lawrence (Started as a WR, converted to DB this year to help save his career, has never really made it off our practice squad roster)
    Round 7- Jarvaris Williams (Didn't make the active roster until December, was activated due to an injury to Kolby Smith, remember him haha, spent 2010 season and 2011 pre-season with Seattle, was cut this year, and is now on the Houston texans practice squad)

    Of this ENTIRE draft class, I would not consider one of these players a Success!

    Players we could have had with our 1st 2 picks:
    Round 1- B.J. Raji, Brian Orakpo, & Andre Smith
    Round 3- Micheal Johnson (DE Cincinatti Bengals now..I remember watching this dude play at Georgie Tech, and was a beast, would have made a nice OLB oposite Hali), Mike Wallace, Laderius Webb,
    When not hurt let's go ahead and take a look at Pioli's second year picks while we're at it then...

    Round 1 - Eric Berry
    Round 2a - Dexter McCluster
    Round 2b - Javier Arenas
    Round 3a - Jon Asamoah
    Round 3b - Tony Moeaki
    Round 5a - Kendrick Lewis
    Round 5b - Cameron Sheffield

    No doubt that Pioli had a bad year in 2009 for draft picks but he'd just been hired a month or two back, didn't have all of his coaches and just had got Haley. When you figure that each draft will have two or three usable picks between 2009 and 2010 we've averaged out.

    Then there's 2011:
    Round 1 - Jon Baldwin (starter)
    Round 2 - Rodney Hudson (in development to start next year)
    Round 3a - Justin Houston (rotational/developing player)
    Round 3b - Allen Bailey (rotational player)
    Round 4 - Jalil Brown (rotational player)
    Round 5a - Ricky Stanzi (developing player)
    Round 5b - Gabe Miller (uhmmm ?)
    Round 6 - Jerrell Powe (rotational/developing player)
    Round 7 - Shane Bannon (no longer with the team)

    Based on this I'll go ahead and say that Pioli is doing his job just fine. One bad draft, meh...everyone has them. We're building this team through the draft and then adding players as we need them. Like I said I'm giving 2009 a pass since having seen the last two drafts be very successful and still have the ability to be even more successful with continued player growth.

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    In Pioli's defense, 2009 was a horrible draft for everyone. It was already being talked about as the shallowest draft in a very VERY long time. He had only been on the job a couple months. I HATED the draft from the 1st pick thru the last and you can go back see how much I hated it. In 2010, he did a good job. He took a few players like Arenas and Moeaki that I wouldn't have taken because I thought they represented poor value where they were taken, but they're at least contributing.

    I LOVED the 2011 draft. So, maybe I'm warming up to Pioli's picks... or maybe he's just picking better.

    On a separate note... if Bowe leaves in free agency, Jeff Fuller from A&M would be a good 2nd round pick to keep an eye on. He was projected to be a first round player, but a poor 2011 could allow him to slide a bit. Fuller and Baldwin would be a great 1-2 punch for years to come, imo

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    How about we draft only quarterbacks and then have our own little competition to see which one is the best, keep the top 3.
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    Draft the best Offensive lineman available - if Barkley is gone.
    SHUT IT

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    Quote Originally Posted by OPLookn View Post
    Round 3b - Tony Moeaki
    Of course hindsight is 20/20, but we drafted Moeaki one pick before Jimmy Graham went to New Orleans.

    Don't get me wrong, I think Moeaki is a solid player, but even in college he was plagued by injuries...Imagine if we had Jimmy Graham as an offensive weapon as well!
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    I haven't been a fan of the idea to draft a QB in the 1st round next year.....I've always thought if we had a better O-line Cassel would be much better.

    BUT, recently I have began to change my mind. I believe the Palko has made our O-line look so much better than it has with Cassel. I think with his ability to avoid pressure, and move around the pocket, it has made me realize that I think Cassel is the Problem with our O-Line... I have always thought he holds onto the ball to long, but I have also realized that he is quite immobile when it comes to avoiding pressure.

    Cassel is much more accurate than Palko (which he could also be better in this area) and Palko is much more athletic and mobile than Cassel.

    Which has brought me to the idea that our biggest needs on this team is a Franchise QB (and I used to never think this way)

    Hudson stepped in for Lilja last night, and looked Great, Albert actually had a good game against a good Steelers pass rush. I think instead of Drafting a Guy like Reiff from Iowa to take over LT for Albert (which was my previous thinking) I think a guy like RGIII wouldn't be a bad idea.

    It all depends on where we land to pick, but my thoughts on drafting a possible Franchise QB has started to change since Plako took over. (We all have to admit it... even though Palko is very inaccurate, our offense has sparked a little more with Palko, we have moved the ball, we just haven't put points on the board.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jrudi View Post
    I haven't been a fan of the idea to draft a QB in the 1st round next year.....I've always thought if we had a better O-line Cassel would be much better.

    BUT, recently I have began to change my mind. I believe the Palko has made our O-line look so much better than it has with Cassel. I think with his ability to avoid pressure, and move around the pocket, it has made me realize that I think Cassel is the Problem with our O-Line... I have always thought he holds onto the ball to long, but I have also realized that he is quite immobile when it comes to avoiding pressure.

    Cassel is much more accurate than Palko (which he could also be better in this area) and Palko is much more athletic and mobile than Cassel.

    Which has brought me to the idea that our biggest needs on this team is a Franchise QB (and I used to never think this way)

    Hudson stepped in for Lilja last night, and looked Great, Albert actually had a good game against a good Steelers pass rush. I think instead of Drafting a Guy like Reiff from Iowa to take over LT for Albert (which was my previous thinking) I think a guy like RGIII wouldn't be a bad idea.

    It all depends on where we land to pick, but my thoughts on drafting a possible Franchise QB has started to change since Plako took over. (We all have to admit it... even though Palko is very inaccurate, our offense has sparked a little more with Palko, we have moved the ball, we just haven't put points on the board.)
    I agree with this big time. Not only do I think Cassel tends to hold onto the ball too long, I also think he panics at the first hint of pressure and just tucks it and runs. This makes it look as if the O-line is playing horrible, but so many times yesterday Palko, unlike Cassel, just continued to sit in the pocket and have time to throw the ball...and this coming against a Steelers team that loves to blitz and has always had success getting pressure on the quarterback.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    I agree with this big time. Not only do I think Cassel tends to hold onto the ball too long, I also think he panics at the first hint of pressure and just tucks it and runs. This makes it look as if the O-line is playing horrible, but so many times yesterday Palko, unlike Cassel, just continued to sit in the pocket and have time to throw the ball...and this coming against a Steelers team that loves to blitz and has always had success getting pressure on the quarterback.
    I agree. Cassel doesn't have good pocket awareness and certainly doesn't seem to have a good pocket presence. He doesn't slide well to avoid pressure and quickly breaks down in his read progression and really seems to rush things. I believe that is his downfall...he doesn't process what is happening quick enough and when he "feels" pressure...real or imagined, he panics and that is why he tends to go with the check-down option play after play.

    IMO, he is going to have a hard time ever improving because he is a game-manager mentality quarterback that panics too soon and completely breaks down.

    Personally, I don't think Palko is the long term solution...or even the best short term solution. But what I think he proves is.....is how dangerous our offense COULD be if we had a quarterback that has good pocket awareness and presence...with an understanding what IS and IS NOT going on around him. Palko doesn't have that last part, and his phyiscal limitations will always hold him back....but to me watching him atleast do something gives me hope that if we had the right starting quarterback we could really compete.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    I agree with this big time. Not only do I think Cassel tends to hold onto the ball too long, I also think he panics at the first hint of pressure and just tucks it and runs. This makes it look as if the O-line is playing horrible, but so many times yesterday Palko, unlike Cassel, just continued to sit in the pocket and have time to throw the ball...and this coming against a Steelers team that loves to blitz and has always had success getting pressure on the quarterback.
    Another thought that ran through my head last night. We looked very good against a stout Steelers D (Paulomalu or not) every player on that D is one of the best at their respective positions. and they aren't considered a top Defense for no reason. They are good at what they do.

    I also wanted to give Hudson Props for stepping in at LG for Lilja. He played an awesome game, and made me feel much better about when he takes over for Wiegmann next season.

    Quote Originally Posted by nicfre2011 View Post
    I agree. Cassel doesn't have good pocket awareness and certainly doesn't seem to have a good pocket presence. He doesn't slide well to avoid pressure and quickly breaks down in his read progression and really seems to rush things. I believe that is his downfall...he doesn't process what is happening quick enough and when he "feels" pressure...real or imagined, he panics and that is why he tends to go with the check-down option play after play.

    IMO, he is going to have a hard time ever improving because he is a game-manager mentality quarterback that panics too soon and completely breaks down.

    Personally, I don't think Palko is the long term solution...or even the best short term solution. But what I think he proves is.....is how dangerous our offense COULD be if we had a quarterback that has good pocket awareness and presence...with an understanding what IS and IS NOT going on around him. Palko doesn't have that last part, and his phyiscal limitations will always hold him back....but to me watching him atleast do something gives me hope that if we had the right starting quarterback we could really compete.
    I by no means think Plako is our answer at QB as well, I like you, just wanted to point out what Palko has allowed me to discover, which is that Cassel's pocket awareness and decision making is a BIG weakness of this team (which I had previously not thought). With Palko being naturally more athletic, It showed that he really had decent time and opportunity to make his decisions. (even if some were bad haha)

    I truly think that we could say if we would have had a legit QB last night leading our team, that game would have ended with a win. Our Offense can move the ball, we just need the right person to run it. (Could you imagine the possibilities of having an athletic QB like Robert Griffen back there?? Wow, if he panned out that would be awesome and we would be an offense that would be hard to stop)

    Another thought that ran through my head last night. Our Defense played awesome last night. Just imagine if we had Berry back, and had an offense that could sustain drives to keep them off the field and rested.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jrudi View Post
    Another thought that ran through my head last night. We looked very good against a stout Steelers D (Paulomalu or not) every player on that D is one of the best at their respective positions. and they aren't considered a top Defense for no reason. They are good at what they do.

    I also wanted to give Hudson Props for stepping in at LG for Lilja. He played an awesome game, and made me feel much better about when he takes over for Wiegmann next season.



    I by no means think Plako is our answer at QB as well, I like you, just wanted to point out what Palko has allowed me to discover, which is that Cassel's pocket awareness and decision making is a BIG weakness of this team (which I had previously not thought). With Palko being naturally more athletic, It showed that he really had decent time and opportunity to make his decisions. (even if some were bad haha)

    I truly think that we could say if we would have had a legit QB last night leading our team, that game would have ended with a win. Our Offense can move the ball, we just need the right person to run it. (Could you imagine the possibilities of having an athletic QB like Robert Griffen back there?? Wow, if he panned out that would be awesome and we would be an offense that would be hard to stop)

    Another thought that ran through my head last night. Our Defense played awesome last night. Just imagine if we had Berry back, and had an offense that could sustain drives to keep them off the field and rested.
    I do agree with your comment on Robert Griffin. I would also add that I think someone with Matt Barkley's skill set/abilities could also have led us to a win. From Day 1 in the NFL? Maybe not, but while they would have probably had the same jitters that Palko had, unlike Palko, both Griffin and Barkley have the physical skill set to make the necessary throws to lead a team to victory. Palko has a gun slingers mentality without the necessary arm strength to get away with taking chances. I will also add that a 2012 free agent like Matt Flynn also seems to have shown the qualities you look for in a starting quarterback. He doesn't have a canon for an arm like Griffin, but is more of a game manager with mobility, but not the extreme game manager that Cassel is.

    Honestly, if I were in charge, I would consider talking with Flynn this offseason to see if he would consider signing a contract that would allow him to compete with Ricky Stanzi for a starting role next year..then part ways with Cassel. Now that Orton is in the mix, I would let him audition for a longer term role...with the idea that he would compete with Stanzi next year. If Orton wants to leave, or really struggles during games this year, you let him walk and look at Flynn.

    I get the feeling that Barkley and Griffin could end up returning...and if one declares, I don't think they will be on board when we are selecting.

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