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Thread: Cassel always had better WR's then Orton

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    Default Cassel always had better WR's then Orton


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    Some people say Cassel has better numbers so he's the better QB, I think Orton has never had the talent Cassel has. Lets look at their WR's over the years

    Cassel
    2008: Wes Welker (still one of the best wr's in the league), Randy Moss(the year prior he had 1500 yards and 23 td's, Jabar Gaffney (ok wr)
    2009: Dwayne Bowe, Chris Chambers, Quinten Lawrence very comparable to Orton's cast of 2009 except Bowe is more talented then Lloyd
    2010: Dwayne Bowe, Chris Chambers (about the same as royal), Terrance Copper (better the Mckinnley). 2010 I think the slight edge goes to KC again especially considering we had Moeaki and Charles.

    Orton
    2008: Devin Hester, Brandon Lloyd (I know people think Brandon Lloyd is amazing but look at his career prior to Orton and after he was mediocore)
    2009: Eddie Royal (Royal had one good year but hasn't done anything since), Brandon Lloyd, Kenny McKinley (don't even know who this is)
    2010: Same cast as 2009 but Orton turned Brandon Lloyd into a pro-bowler with 1500 yards and 11 td's previously he had never had over 755 yards in a season.

    Listen I'm not saying Orton is the best, but I have always thought he was slightly better then Cassel even when he was a donkey. Now he may prove me wrong but from what I've seen over the last couple years I see a good qb that was put in a bad situation this could very well be Rich Gannon. Look at Rich Gannon's career he was never thought of as a good player he went from team to team until the Faiders picked him up and believed in him. Orton has never had anyone believe in him and I think depending on how the next couple games go he could and should be our starter. If he sucks I will be right along with the other haters but until then I like what I see.

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    His Chicago rec corp was...Well...Sad. LOL

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    Two different style QBs. Cassel is a game manager. Orton is a slinger. The problem I've always had with Orton is he gets trigger happy and starts making mistakes. Then once he makes a mistake, he gets frustrated and continues to make more mistakes.
    MAKE WHOOLIES!!!

    Joseph
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIC J View Post
    Two different style QBs. Cassel is a game manager. Orton is a slinger. The problem I've always had with Orton is he gets trigger happy and starts making mistakes. Then once he makes a mistake, he gets frustrated and continues to make more mistakes.
    What you said is exactly opposite to what most people know. If you have followed and watched Orton for long, most times he has played conservatively, either aksed to, or in worry of job security. He got a bit aggressive last year because there was no running game nor defense. I hope he can go back as a slinger, he can, and he has to if he wants to become a franchise QB.

    The notion that he is error prone is ridiculous and it is nothing but a very unfair label made out by some donkeys. When you have not much supporting cast and you have to throw the ball like crazy you are doomed to make mistakes. That being said, let's have a look at the career stats for the upper level QBs other than the big 3 (stats as of today from ESPN):

    #Pass #Int #Pass/Int
    M Ryan 1961 46 42.6
    J Flacco 1915 45 42.6
    P Rivers 2958 75 39.4
    M Schaub 2279 58 39.3
    M Cassel 1767 45 39.3
    K Orton 2139 55 38.9
    T Romo 2553 71 36.0
    A Smith 1903 58 32.8
    Big Ben 3273 100 32.7
    C Palmer 3476 113 30.8
    M Staford 1041 35 29.7
    J Freeman 1232 42 29.3
    J Cutler 2521 86 29.3
    M Sanchez 1323 46 28.8
    Last edited by boiler01; 12-22-2011 at 02:01 PM. Reason: format

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    If you look at the last 2 years Oront's #pass per #int is actually much better,

    2009: 541 passes, 12 ints, 45.1 pass/int
    2010: 498 passes, 9 ints, 55.3 pass/int

    I highly suspect that is among the league's bests. So no, nobody with a sane mind can say Orton is turnover prone.
    Last edited by boiler01; 12-22-2011 at 02:28 PM. Reason: typo

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    Big 4's pass int ratio in 2010:

    Brady: 492 4 123.0 (outrageous it is)
    Rogers: 475 11 43.2
    Brees: 658 22 29.9
    Manning: 571 15 38.1

    I'm not saying Orton is anywhere as good as those guys, just to prove that he is not a turnover machine as some donkey fans claimed.

    Clutch or not, 55 passes an INT should win many games on many teams.

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    Actually I had that thought about him BEFORE he went to the Broncos.
    MAKE WHOOLIES!!!

    Joseph
    The Real SIC Riders
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    Now instead of looking at his overall stats, pay attention to what I said, and look at his game logs. You will understand what I was talking about.
    MAKE WHOOLIES!!!

    Joseph
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    I followed pretty much every game of Orton. Other than his rookie year, he never turned over ball much as some people claimed. FACT is that Orton is not any more turnover prone than any good QBs out there. Period. Sure you can always pick some games to support your points, but you can do so to any QB or any player.

    You can say Orton is not clutch, journeyman, whatever, but to claim he's (more) error prone (than any other good QBs) is ridiculous and totally bogus.
    Last edited by boiler01; 12-22-2011 at 04:19 PM. Reason: edit

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    Quote Originally Posted by My Man Orton View Post
    Man it doesnt matter what you say or show them because most of the people on this forum are "pro cassel." I honestly have no idea why
    I don't think that there is a large number of pro Cassel people left. Some are just not not willing to put most of the blame on Cassel for why the offense has struggled but that doesn't mean that they are pro Cassel. Myself I am for anyone that can come in and do the job and do it well. If Cassel can fine if Orton can fine.

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