The end all, be all Cassel/orton debate thread....

[KCraised]

There are alot of little flare ups on this forums about the cassel haters and Orton haters. Both players have strengths and weaknesses. Lets hear peoples voices about a pro and con about both players. Let's see where it goes and let's respect the other and keep it civil! Bottom line, we are all Chiefs fans or we wouldn't hopefully be on this forum.....God help us.

Cassel pro: think he scrambles better than Orton
Cassel con: seems to panic under the first sign of pressure

Orton pro: Better downfield accuracy
Orton con: His inexperience with this Organization, compared to Cassel

Just getting the ball rolling. Lets see what happens and where it goes....

[Bike]

What are some of the things that set both qbs apart, in your opinion? Good and bad?

Orton can see the field better - he spreads the ball out, he looks off recievers, and is more accurate. Just a better skilled player. Cassel has a lot of heart and plays balls out - but that doesn't really improve his skillset IMO. I like Cassel for the above reasons - he is a determined player. But determination will only get you so far in the NFL.

[tornadospotter]

What are some of the things that set both qbs apart, in your opinion? Good and bad?

It is hard for me to say, I watched the GB game, but had to work and did not see the raider game. I can say that I liked how Kyle led the offense, in the GB game, for his first start as a Chief, and being new to the team, HC fired, so new HC interim in charge, he simply preformed. His passes where on target and things worked. Sunday will tell me more, I will get to watch this game. It may be just the fact of the change in the HC, I do not know. But I think we need to find out, bring them both into a open competition for the job, and draft a QB this coming draft, then all four qb's can win or loss the job.

[KCraised]

Orton can see the field better - he spreads the ball out, he looks off recievers, and is more accurate. Just a better skilled player. Cassel has a lot of heart and plays balls out - but that doesn't really improve his skillset IMO. I like Cassel for the above reasons - he is a determined player. But determination will only get you so far in the NFL.

Great follow up, Bike

[N TX Dave]

From my limited observation of Orton it seems to me that he can get 1st downs a lot more constantly than Cassel. What % of 3 and outs did Orton have compared to Cassel with basically the same team? When it is 3rd and 8 Orton throws it 9 yards where Cassell dumps it off 4 yards and hopes the receiver can pick up the other 4 yards. At least that is my opinion.

[2010chiefs]

From my limited observation of Orton it seems to me that he can get 1st downs a lot more constantly than Cassel. What % of 3 and outs did Orton have compared to Cassel with basically the same team? When it is 3rd and 8 Orton throws it 9 yards where Cassell dumps it off 4 yards and hopes the receiver can pick up the other 4 yards. At least that is my opinion.

What he said^^^ and

Cassel needs a ton of time to make a play or gets sacked.

Orton scans the field and makes quick decisions.

Cassel cannot lead you down the field when we're down.

Orton proved he can do that when he got us in field goal range on Saturday with less 1 min remaining.

[jap1]

I know this isnt supposed to be too much of an argument against each other, but I wanted to bring up a few points. Granted these are my opinions, and feel free to disagree.

First, I disagree with the comments that Cassel was playing with the same team as Orton has been. While the players have been the same, the playcalling has seemed much different the last two weeks. Also, the players have seemed more motivated as well.

I dont mean to sound like I love Cassel, but I really do think they are very equal. Either one of them is better at some things than the other. I think with good coaching, both of them could have a very high ceiling.

[KCraised]

I know this isnt supposed to be too much of an argument against each other, but I wanted to bring up a few points. Granted these are my opinions, and feel free to disagree.

First, I disagree with the comments that Cassel was playing with the same team as Orton has been. While the players have been the same, the playcalling has seemed much different the last two weeks. Also, the players have seemed more motivated as well.

I dont mean to sound like I love Cassel, but I really do think they are very equal. Either one of them is better at some things than the other. I think with good coaching, both of them could have a very high ceiling.

Its still good input, regardless. Your statements are vrery valid. There are alot of different members that have posted and every single one has alot of substance to them. A good civil thread where every opinion is as important as the other. It does seem to favor Orton at this point, but I have to admit that the Cassel situation without Haley does seem interesting. It would help put the question to rest about would he have performed better under another HC.

[Eydugstr]

I know this isnt supposed to be too much of an argument against each other, but I wanted to bring up a few points. Granted these are my opinions, and feel free to disagree.

First, I disagree with the comments that Cassel was playing with the same team as Orton has been. While the players have been the same, the playcalling has seemed much different the last two weeks. Also, the players have seemed more motivated as well.

I dont mean to sound like I love Cassel, but I really do think they are very equal. Either one of them is better at some things than the other. I think with good coaching, both of them could have a very high ceiling.

Its still good input, regardless. Your statements are vrery valid. There are alot of different members that have posted and every single one has alot of substance to them. A good civil thread where every opinion is as important as the other. It does seem to favor Orton at this point, but I have to admit that the Cassel situation without Haley does seem interesting. It would help put the question to rest about would he have performed better under another HC.

These are valid points. Would really like to see what either QB could do behind a better O-line and a stable HC (Cassel always had to contend with Haley, as did the many oc's that have come through KC). Orton is a better pure passer, Cassel's better in the red zone.

If it were up to me, if we couldn't snag a top notch qb in the first round, I'd sign both for next season just to keep some depth at QB, as well as some competition. Let Stanzi learn behind those two. And figure out a way to keep Jim Zorn as qb coach for another season.

[pojote]

Cassel: under contract

Orton: free agent

[azchiefsfan]

This is why we have camps and tryouts. I like Cassel and know he can throw very well and doesn't get the turnover-itis very often. He can help a team win and generally will do what it takes to win. He is not, however, a field general. He will follow orders and make the play happen as called. So he needs a good OC to call plays. That ain't a bad thing, it's just his style. So when the calls are good and the rest of the team is on the same page, they can roll like a well-oiled machine. When the calls are bad or the receivers aren't in sync, it goes horribly wrong. I think of Cassel like a surgeon. He can do amazing things, but it has to be by the book. Orton wants to chuck that rock as far down the field as the receivers can get. He uses the plays as a general guidline where to look, but seems to always be looking down field to make something happen and can launch the ball like a V2 rocket. Where Cassel is analytical and calculated almost to a fault, Orton is a gun-slinger. He is unafraid to launch one and let the receivers fight for it. Sometimes that means 300+ yards and 4 td's and sometimes 100 yards and 4 int's. This tendency means that you have to have crazy-skilled receivers and an OL that allows these long plays to develop because he ain't mobile. So really, the big question for our teams management is do you want to build the team around a Favre-esque airballer or do we build the team for a machine-precision short game attack. We are built for the latter, but with Bowe and Breaston, it wouldn't be hard to transition to the former.