QB challenge 2012 edition

**figcrostic** · 01-02-2012, 12:05 PM

Career stats
Cassel 59% 11,699 yards 76td's 45int 169.6 ypg 82.5 rate passes 20+ yards 139 40+ yards 23
Orton 58.3% 14,532 yards 80td's 50int 204.7pg 79.4 rate passes 20+ yards 174 40+ yards 31

Last 3 games
Cassel 52.4 607 yards 2td's 2int 202 ypg rate 69.4 sks 12
Orton 60.8% 779 yards 1td 2int 260 ypg 81.1 rate sks 1

Against the same opponents as a Chief 2011/12 season
(Denver and Raiders)
Cassel 48.2% 254 yards 1td 2int 52.4 rate 2sks 1 win
Orton 55% 480 yards 1td 2int 71 rate 1sks 1 win

This is a lot of work so if anyone wants to help out I'm all for it, I'm going to next look at how they both performed against top 5 pass defenses but I have some things to do today, so It might take awhile.

**figcrostic** · 01-03-2012, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by nigeriannightmare

thats crap dude. U start a new job u generally have something to prove, no one is entitled to anything.....unless of course u r barrack obama. My father is a master chef, i am pretty good but when im in a kitchen there is always something to prove. Its called being competitive

The difference is you can be a chef until your in your 60's Kyle Orton is 28 he maybe has 5 or 6 good years left why would he want to spend them sitting on the bench he paid he dues just like everyone else has and wants to be a starter. On top of that when you meaning you nigeriannightmare start a job the person hiring you only has your word to go by and your refrences he doesn't know if you can cook a damn egg, on top of that if you aren't the best in the kitchen your still a chef your not sitting there watching the other chefs. We have years of film on Kyle Orton not to mention he just played 3 games for us, meaning he did prove himself already. Both guys are rich, it's not about the money they want to be a starter and they have a finite amount of time to do that.

**chief31** · 01-03-2012, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by TopekaRoy

This bugs the heck out of me. Not the comment, which I agree with, but the perception that Orton doesn't want to compete. If that really is his attitude then I say, "Good riddance." I don't want a QB who thinks he should just be handed the starting job and isn't willing to show he deserves it. I want a guy that is willing to sign with Green Bay or New England and says, "Yeah. That guy's good, but I can do better!"

On the other hand, I do understand when he says, "this is Cassel's team." While I do think that is, to a large extent, just hem showing respect as the newcomer, and being humble and politically correct, I can see that he may recognize that it will be difficult for the Chiefs to keep them both.

I can completely understand him wanting to be the starter and possibly taking a job where that is more likely. The thing is, he might not be in a position to make that happen.

The reality of the situation is that Orton lost his starting job to Grossman, was traded for Cutler and then lost it again to Tebow. Now if the Chiefs keep Cassel over him, that will be the 4th QB he has lost out to. He may have to earn the starting job regardless of where he signs. I think teams that desperately need a QB are more likely to go after a good rookie in the draft than overpay Orton who has shown ability, but hasn't shown that he can keep the starting job.

I think some here are over valuing Orton because he came in here and beat the packers right away. Given the way he has played the last 3 games, I think very highly of him as well, but I'm not sure other teams will feel the same way.

I also think that if Orton has to compete for the starting spot, his best chance of winning that competition is right here in KC. I think he has the talent to beat out Cassel, and the self confidence to believe he can do it.

If the Chiefs don't resign Kyle, I will be very disappointed, but I will understand and Matt will have my full support. But I really want to see Kyle iin a Cheifs uniform next summer.

Originally Posted by nigeriannightmare

thats crap dude. U start a new job u generally have something to prove, no one is entitled to anything.....unless of course u r barrack obama. My father is a master chef, i am pretty good but when im in a kitchen there is always something to prove. Its called being competitive

It is perfectly logical to want to avoid another QB competition, because the better QB is not always the winner.

Kyle Orton playerd far better QB than Tim Tebow, but was benched in favor of the lesser player.

And he took the starting job back from Grossman, after having been labelled the loser of the competition with Grossman, but later won it back.

But, for a guy who has already been pulled for leeser QBs on multiple occaisions to want to avoid another, similar situation, is not fear of competition, but fear of a rigged competition.

He is going to find it hard to find any team willing to name him as "the man" though.

Everybody will have some other option that they hope to have beat him out.

I am not sure that he will get a better shake than what he would get here.

**figcrostic** · 01-03-2012, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by chief31

It is perfectly logical to want to avoid another QB competition, because the better QB is not always the winner.

Kyle Orton playerd far better QB than Tim Tebow, but was benched in favor of the lesser player.

And he took the starting job back from Grossman, after having been labelled the loser of the competition with Grossman, but later won it back.

But, for a guy who has already been pulled for leeser QBs on multiple occaisions to want to avoid another, similar situation, is not fear of competition, but fear of a rigged competition.

He is going to find it hard to find any team willing to name him as "the man" though.

Everybody will have some other option that they hope to have beat him out.

I am not sure that he will get a better shake than what he would get here.

My thoughts exactly Tebow is a far worse QB and he got the starting role it was extremely premature to get rid of Orton. Orton in my opinon could be the starting qb on quite a few teams but we will see he's a free agent. BTW what do we get for him if he does sign with someone else?

**nigeriannightmare** · 01-03-2012, 01:32 PM

When ur a professional at whatever it is u do and u go somewhere nnew ur gonna have to prove what makes u a professional. If orton is so jaded and thinks hes above the competition he is not the leader i would want.

**figcrostic** · 01-03-2012, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by nigeriannightmare

When ur a professional at whatever it is u do and u go somewhere nnew ur gonna have to prove what makes u a professional. If orton is so jaded and thinks hes above the competition he is not the leader i would want.

Great I'm glad your not the HC!

**Canada** · 01-03-2012, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by My Man Orton

Good stats fig, but it doesnt matter what you tell cassel supporters.

They will always find excuses . "Shortened preseason, Jamaal charles got hurt, inexperienced line." The list will go on and on even though cassel and orton have had the exact same team.

For example Chief 31 post

"The biggest difference between the two situation, as Chiefs in 2011, is the timing of their experiences.

Cassel had his time coming of the shortened preseason, with a first time OC, and an O-line shake-up. Then there was the the loss of Jamaal Charles, whom the offense was designed around."

The chiefs won 4 straight was the team chemistry absolutely horrible then? See the excuses dont even add up. Chief 31 acts like the longer the season went on the better we played as a unit, we won 4 straight then proceeded to get blown out by a 0-7 team and lose to denver

And about the timing of their experiences? How about having only 5 days to practice with your team before going out and playing the defending super bowl champions.... And then winning

Sound like anyone you know??

**Canada** · 01-03-2012, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by My Man Orton

And about the timing of their experiences? How about having only 5 days to practice with your team before going out and playing the defending super bowl champions.... And then winning

Im sorry, but are you seriously giving Orton the credit for that win?? 4 times in the red Zone and came away with 3 FGs. The defense won that game despite the QB not because of him.

Stats that matter...

Orton scored 19, 13 and 7 points in his 3 games and won 2 of them mostly due to the defense.

The only difference I can see between Cassel and Orton is that Orton keeps the offense out on the field long enough to give the defense a rest. Other than that they are both average at best!!

**figcrostic** · 01-03-2012, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Canada

Im sorry, but are you seriously giving Orton the credit for that win?? 4 times in the red Zone and came away with 3 FGs. The defense won that game despite the QB not because of him.

Stats that matter...

Orton scored 19, 13 and 7 points in his 3 games and won 2 of them mostly due to the defense.

The only difference I can see between Cassel and Orton is that Orton keeps the offense out on the field long enough to give the defense a rest. Other than that they are both average at best!!

That's a fair assessment