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Thread: Pinstripe Bowl: WVU v Syracuse

  1. #1
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    Default Pinstripe Bowl: WVU v Syracuse


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    December 29th, 3:15 p.m. ET


    Last game of the season for Geno Smith, and our last chance to see him play as a Mountaineer before the Draft.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    2nd round QBs rarely, rarely ever work out. The only one I can think of is Brees, and he had question marks like Russell Wilson. Why is this? QB is the most important position on the field. If a guy has the look of a solid QB, he goes in the 1st round.

    So if there is a guy out there, we need to take him with the 1st overall pick.
    A bit weird if you ask me. I did some digging and only three qbs taken in the second round of the last 3 drafts.

    Osweiler-2012
    Kaepernick and daulton-2011
    None in 2010

    Go back three more and i think it's only four but of those four I think only chad henne still plays. Percentage wise you would be correct but the sample size is pretty small.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    2nd round QBs rarely, rarely ever work out. The only one I can think of is Brees, and he had question marks like Russell Wilson. Why is this? QB is the most important position on the field. If a guy has the look of a solid QB, he goes in the 1st round.

    So if there is a guy out there, we need to take him with the 1st overall pick.
    Is it just 2nd rounders or non 1st rounders in general?

    Here is a list of QB's with multiple Superbowl starts picked at or after the 2nd round:

    Tom Brady-6th round pick
    Joe Montana-3rd round pick
    Roger Stauhbach-10th round pick
    Kurt Warner-undrafted
    Fran Tarkenton-3rd round pick
    Bart Starr-17th round pick
    Joe Theismann-4th round pick
    Brett Favre-2nd round pick

    A list of all QB's that started and won a superbowl picked in the 2nd or later round:

    Bart Starr-17th
    Johnny U.-9th
    Roger Staubach-10th
    Ken Stabler-2nd
    Joe Montana-3rd
    Joe Theismann-4th
    Jeff Hosteler-3rd
    Mark Rypien-6th
    Brett Favre-2nd
    Kurt Warner-undrafted
    Tom Brady-6th
    Brad Johnson-9th
    Drew Brees-2nd

    List of other QB's that started and lost a superbowl(picked 2nd or later round):

    Daryle Lamonica-24th
    Joe Kapp-18th
    Fran Tarkenton-3rd
    Vince Ferragamo-4th
    Ron Jaworski-2nd
    Ken Anderson-3rd
    David Woodley-8th
    Boomer Esiason-2nd
    Stan Humphries-6th
    Neil O'Donnell-3rd
    Chris Chandler-3rd
    Rich Gannon-4th
    Jake Delhomme-undrafted
    Matt Hasselbeck-6th

    Just a list, but there are some pretty good qb's that were not a first round pick.


  4. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkChief49 View Post
    Is it just 2nd rounders or non 1st rounders in general?

    Here is a list of QB's with multiple Superbowl starts picked at or after the 2nd round:

    Tom Brady-6th round pick
    Joe Montana-3rd round pick
    Roger Stauhbach-10th round pick
    Kurt Warner-undrafted
    Fran Tarkenton-3rd round pick
    Bart Starr-17th round pick
    Joe Theismann-4th round pick
    Brett Favre-2nd round pick

    A list of all QB's that started and won a superbowl picked in the 2nd or later round:

    Bart Starr-17th
    Johnny U.-9th
    Roger Staubach-10th
    Ken Stabler-2nd
    Joe Montana-3rd
    Joe Theismann-4th
    Jeff Hosteler-3rd
    Mark Rypien-6th
    Brett Favre-2nd
    Kurt Warner-undrafted
    Tom Brady-6th
    Brad Johnson-9th
    Drew Brees-2nd

    List of other QB's that started and lost a superbowl(picked 2nd or later round):

    Daryle Lamonica-24th
    Joe Kapp-18th
    Fran Tarkenton-3rd
    Vince Ferragamo-4th
    Ron Jaworski-2nd
    Ken Anderson-3rd
    David Woodley-8th
    Boomer Esiason-2nd
    Stan Humphries-6th
    Neil O'Donnell-3rd
    Chris Chandler-3rd
    Rich Gannon-4th
    Jake Delhomme-undrafted
    Matt Hasselbeck-6th

    Just a list, but there are some pretty good qb's that were not a first round pick.
    That's fine and all, but the only active player on that list is Tom Brady who was drafted 12 years ago. Since then there has been much more emphasis placed on the QB position as the league has gotten ridiculously pass happy.

    I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that recent history would tell us that all of the good QBs are going to get scooped up in the 1st round (Russell Wilson being one of the few exceptions).
    Diehard Fan Living in Packer Territory

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  5. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    That's fine and all, but the only active player on that list is Tom Brady who was drafted 12 years ago. Since then there has been much more emphasis placed on the QB position as the league has gotten ridiculously pass happy.

    I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that recent history would tell us that all of the good QBs are going to get scooped up in the 1st round (Russell Wilson being one of the few exceptions).
    People's Exhibit A:

    2011 draft -- Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, Christian Ponder.

    It's going to come down to who Andy Reid likes best when the combine and the individual workouts are said and done & whether or not he feels he needs to stay put and pull the trigger on his guy or maybe he has two guys neck & neck and he feels he can trade down a few slots and get one of those guys. Time will tell.

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    Don't forget our pick in the second round is the second pick so not that far from the first round, 34th pick.

  7. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryfo18 View Post
    That's fine and all, but the only active player on that list is Tom Brady who was drafted 12 years ago. Since then there has been much more emphasis placed on the QB position as the league has gotten ridiculously pass happy.



    I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that recent history would tell us that all of the good QBs are going to get scooped up in the 1st round (Russell Wilson being one of the few exceptions).

    I see what you are saying. But there are a lot of prolific passers on that list.




    The 1st round QB trail is littered with a lot of busts too!
    Ryan Leaf
    Jamarcus Russell
    Todd Marinovich
    Andre Ware
    Heath Shuler
    Cade McNown
    Jim Druckenmiller
    Matt Leinhart
    Joey Harrington
    Todd Blacklege

    to name a few. Value can be had . It may not be the Ferrari you wanted, but a dependable pickup will get you there.
    How's Matt Shaub doing by the way?


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    Quote Originally Posted by AkChief49 View Post
    I see what you are saying. But there are a lot of prolific passers on that list.




    The 1st round QB trail is littered with a lot of busts too!
    Ryan Leaf
    Jamarcus Russell
    Todd Marinovich
    Andre Ware
    Heath Shuler
    Cade McNown
    Jim Druckenmiller
    Matt Leinhart
    Joey Harrington
    Todd Blacklege

    to name a few. Value can be had . It may not be the Ferrari you wanted, but a dependable pickup will get you there.
    How's Matt Shaub doing by the way?
    We're all aware of the busts. I'm sorry though, that should not stop the Chiefs at all from drafting a QB if they think they have their guy.

    Here's the list of 2nd round QBs taken between Brees and Favre (bothy 2nd rounders):

    Quincy Carter (Cowboys), 2001 - 34 starts
    Marques Tuiasosopo (Raiders), 2001 - 2 starts
    Shaun King (Bucs), 1999 - 24 starts
    Charlie Batch (Lions), 1998 - 53 starts
    Jake Plummer (Cardinals) - 136 starts
    Tony Banks (Rams), 1996 - 78 starts
    Todd Collins (Bills), 1995 - 21 starts
    Kordell Stewart (Steelers), 1995 - 87 starts, career 77:84 TD-to-INT ratio
    Matt Blundin (Chiefs), 1992 - 0 starts
    Tony Sacca (Cardinals), 1992 - 0 starts

    Here's the list taken after Brees:

    Andy Dalton (Bengals), 2011
    Colin Kaepernick (49ers), 2011
    Jimmy Clausen (Panthers), 2010
    Pat White (Dolphins), 2009
    Brian Brohm (Packers), 2008
    Chad Henne (Dolphins), 2008
    Kevin Kolb (Eagles), 2007
    John Beck (Dolphins), 2007
    Drew Stanton (Lions), 2007
    Kellen Clemens (Jets), 2006
    Tarvaris Jackson (Vikings), 2006

    Source: http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nf...b-success-rate

    Now just count the names on those two lists versus the list you provided...

    Any way you try to swing it, you have a much much much much better chance of getting a Good QB in the 1st round. The 2nd rounders have about a 10% success rate.
    Diehard Fan Living in Packer Territory

    Co-Founder: 2 Mugs Fantasy Football -- a site about and football!

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    At this point I'd almost rather use our picks for other areas of need, and draft our qbotf next year when hopefully the qb class is better. Pick up a veteran (maybe Hasselbeck) and a second stringer to get through 2013. At this point I'm not sold on any of the qbs coming out. But then again I'm no expert, or scout.
    Doing my best to keep my sons memory alive!!!

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    At this point I'd almost rather use our picks for other areas of need, and draft our qbotf next year when hopefully the qb class is better. Pick up a veteran (maybe Hasselbeck) and a second stringer to get through 2013. At this point I'm not sold on any of the qbs coming out. But then again I'm no expert, or scout.
    And ouch, did you HAVE to bring up Blackledge??
    Doing my best to keep my sons memory alive!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissingTBone View Post
    At this point I'd almost rather use our picks for other areas of need, and draft our qbotf next year when hopefully the qb class is better. Pick up a veteran (maybe Hasselbeck) and a second stringer to get through 2013. At this point I'm not sold on any of the qbs coming out. But then again I'm no expert, or scout.
    It's not going to be better next year.
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