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Thread: Smith=Cassel Logic

  1. #1
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    Can some one explain this to me:

    "Because there exists a QB who became a worse player after his best season, therefor anyone who had a season comparable to that player's best season must be a bad player."

    That's what I'm hearing over and over. Matt Cassel had a good season and then he sucked. We all know that. Why does that have to do with anything else? Does every personnel guy who studies game film have to go, "Wait. This guy had a season who's numbers are comparable to this Matt Cassel guy's numbers from his best season. Hold on. That must mean that this guy is going to become a bad player." Huh? What? Why would Dorsey or Reid care one bit about what happened to one specific guy who has nothing to do with their 2013 KC Chiefs? So this particular guy we're talking about happens to have been a Chief. How does that mean he has some magical ability to rub off his lack of mojo onto some one else any more than anyone else? Why not cherry pick some QB who then went on to be a better player? Who cares about Matt Cassel!

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    Well at least you can finally admit to the Mccluster thing

    YOu have been right about alot of things. I was more talking about your outlook on players. There are players you like that you won't say one bad word about even when it's deserved like Bowe for example. He got outplayed against one of the worst passing defenses in the NFL this past season by the backup TE and not a word is spoken and when i do i was just "making excuses for Cassel" Then there are players who you don't like who you will never give credit where credit is due. Like Cassel and now it seems Smith. Smith was pretty bad his first few years. No one can deny that. You can't ignore that. But you also can't ignore how much his play improved when he got a good head coach. So is it just that he suddenly got better or maybe coaching had something to do with it. It's fair to question that. Wouldn't you say. I mean to go from being the starting qb on a team that got blown out by that horrible matt Cassel in 2010 to being a muffed punt away from the superbowl doesn't just happen by itself. Andy Reid is better then the 2 coaches Smith played most his time under with the 49ers he is known for his work with QBs. So maybe just Maybe this move works out. There's no clear sign one way or the other when it comes to Smith. He's had good and bad. We are going to find out which he is. But he is not Matt Cassel. He might have put up some numbers like Cassel throughout his time but he has also done things Cassel hasn't theres things that go both ways on him.


    The comparisons between Cassel are needed, I don't think Smith is on par with Cassel, but I do think they are in teh same boat. There are a ton of things identical between the two and we just gave up 2 high draft picks for an average veteran qb. This site, like Chiefs Planet should be pissed off.

    He is a manager Matt, that is what he is. He has made good decisions but has had the number 1 rushing attack and defense, he just reminds me of Matt Cassel, and we are trading 2 high draft picks for him. The whole situation makes me sick.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FranciscoD'anconia View Post
    Can some one explain this to me:

    "Because there exists a QB who became a worse player after his best season, therefor anyone who had a season comparable to that player's best season must be a bad player."

    That's what I'm hearing over and over. Matt Cassel had a good season and then he sucked. We all know that. Why does that have to do with anything else? Does every personnel guy who studies game film have to go, "Wait. This guy had a season who's numbers are comparable to this Matt Cassel guy's numbers from his best season. Hold on. That must mean that this guy is going to become a bad player." Huh? What? Why would Dorsey or Reid care one bit about what happened to one specific guy who has nothing to do with their 2013 KC Chiefs? So this particular guy we're talking about happens to have been a Chief. How does that mean he has some magical ability to rub off his lack of mojo onto some one else any more than anyone else? Why not cherry pick some QB who then went on to be a better player? Who cares about Matt Cassel!

    I don't like Smith because he is not a franchise calibur qb. He needs a GREAT ground game and a good defense to win. He is an average quarterback that we just traded 2 high draft picks for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MyManHali View Post
    I don't like Smith because he is not a franchise calibur qb. He needs a GREAT ground game and a good defense to win. He is an average quarterback that we just traded 2 high draft picks for.
    Weren't you stoked to have acquired the services from someone who helped build the packers. If he pulled the trigger on the deal they must have some faith. You are showing very little on someone you thought very highly of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nigeriannightmare View Post
    Weren't you stoked to have acquired the services from someone who helped build the packers. If he pulled the trigger on the deal they must have some faith. You are showing very little on someone you thought very highly of.

    Yes, I was very happy with the Reid and Dorsey hire. I am not happy at all with this move. Giving up our high draft picks for an average injury prone qb is not a step forward.

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    As a lifelong 49er fan let me tell you guys you either got a band aid or a slow painful death. Alex Smith has the ability to be serviceable for a team that caters to his strengths and builds an entire team and game plan around him. Your coach has got to be smart and I mean damn smart to win with him.

    I really feel for you guys burning a 2nd round pick on him. That is a ripoff in my opinion as I would have given no more than a mid 3rd early 4th on a good day for him. Who knows though Andy Reid might gel with Alex but only if he takes a page from Harbaugh's book and gives him a good defense/special teams, paired with a strong running game and short play action passes.

    Good luck to you guys. Blows when your team is drafting first overall I know this and been there done that. I like Alex Smith and will be rooting for him to succeed as long as it isn't against my team. I really don't have a lot of hate for the Chiefs anyway, we never play you guys and when we do the games usually mean nothing. Take care.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayArea View Post
    ...Good luck to you guys. Blows when your team is drafting first overall I know this and been there done that. I like Alex Smith and will be rooting for him to succeed as long as it isn't against my team. I really don't have a lot of hate for the Chiefs anyway, we never play you guys and when we do the games usually mean nothing. Take care.
    Appreciate the sentiment!


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    Quote Originally Posted by BayArea View Post
    As a lifelong 49er fan let me tell you guys you either got a band aid or a slow painful death. Alex Smith has the ability to be serviceable for a team that caters to his strengths and builds an entire team and game plan around him. Your coach has got to be smart and I mean damn smart to win with him.

    I really feel for you guys burning a 2nd round pick on him. That is a ripoff in my opinion as I would have given no more than a mid 3rd early 4th on a good day for him. Who knows though Andy Reid might gel with Alex but only if he takes a page from Harbaugh's book and gives him a good defense/special teams, paired with a strong running game and short play action passes.

    Good luck to you guys. Blows when your team is drafting first overall I know this and been there done that. I like Alex Smith and will be rooting for him to succeed as long as it isn't against my team. I really don't have a lot of hate for the Chiefs anyway, we never play you guys and when we do the games usually mean nothing. Take care.

    Thank you for your condolonces.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MyManHali View Post
    I don't like Smith because he is not a franchise calibur qb. He needs a GREAT ground game and a good defense to win. He is an average quarterback that we just traded 2 high draft picks for.
    Geno Smith couldn't win with 2 NFL caliber WR's at his disposal. Everything you like about Geno Smith, you should like about Alex Smith. There are very few differences.

    Quote Originally Posted by MyManHali View Post
    As the QB position goes it is a slight upgrade, but a downgrade for our team. Because we traded so much for him, it basically says THIS is our qb for a good amount of years. I just don't see how Smith + Joeckel if we go that route like everyone says we will is better than resigning Albert, drafting Geno and drafting a good CB in the second round.


    But whatever.
    Alex and Geno are similar players. You don't see how spending only 800 draft points on a similar QB is better than spending 3000? You don't see how spending only $4m/yr on a LT UPGRADE is better than spending the $15m/yr Albert is rumored to be asking for? You're getting the consensus BEST QB option available in Alex Smith AND you're getting an upgrade at LT in Joekel for essentially 1/4 of the price. There's ABSOLUTELY NO WAY you can justify spending 4x the amount of draft points on Geno over Alex OR justify spending 4x the amount of money on Albert over Joekel. Even if you argue Geno is better than Alex, he's not 4x better. Any argument is immediately rendered invalid when put in this context.

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    Quote Originally Posted by texaschief View Post
    Geno Smith couldn't win with 2 NFL caliber WR's at his disposal. Everything you like about Geno Smith, you should like about Alex Smith. There are very few differences.



    Alex and Geno are similar players. You don't see how spending only 800 draft points on a similar QB is better than spending 3000? You don't see how spending only $4m/yr on a LT UPGRADE is better than spending the $15m/yr Albert is rumored to be asking for? You're getting the consensus BEST QB option available in Alex Smith AND you're getting an upgrade at LT in Joekel for essentially 1/4 of the price. There's ABSOLUTELY NO WAY you can justify spending 4x the amount of draft points on Geno over Alex OR justify spending 4x the amount of money on Albert over Joekel. Even if you argue Geno is better than Alex, he's not 4x better. Any argument is immediately rendered invalid when put in this context.

    Alex Smith and Geno Smith are 2 complete different quarterbacks. Alex Smith is a conservative, check down qb who is accurate in the short to intermediate range while Geno is more of an aggressive, look down field type of qb. The only comparison you could make is their mobility.

    I don't know how much Albert wants and neither do you. You left out some important details like losing our 34th overall pick as well as a possible third round pick in 2014 because of the Smith trade. Now let's consider all things. Luke Joeckel had a medicore combine, in fact in many mocks he has been bumped from the number 1 spot and some have Eric Fisher to be the better prospect.

    Now let's compare what we did to what we could have. Even IF Geno and Smith were the same exact players you still get more from not trading for smith.

    Resigning Albert + Geno + 34th pick (2nd round pick of 2013) + Third rounder in 2014 vs. Alex Smith and Luke Joeckel.

    Who do you think wins?

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    Just because you're trading a cannon of an arm and a gunslinger mentality for accuracy, ability to read defenses and make plays in the short and intermediate passing game doesn't mean you aren't getting a potential "franchise QB". This is what Reid's system is and Alex Smith was born to play in this type of a system. Geno Smith does not go through his progressions well enough to run Reid's system. Don't believe me? Just youtube "Geno Smith" and watch his "highlights". You never see him throw to his second or third option. Do the same with Andrew Luck or any other high draft pick over the last several years and they do. This would not work in Reid's system. Alex Smith, on the other hand, would be more effective in Reid's system than in the ones he's come from. A guy who can post a 104 QB rating in a system not designed for him can do quite a bit of damage with coach Reid.

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