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Thread: Elway's a fool for signing some FA's he has...

  1. #1
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    Default Elway's a fool for signing some FA's he has...


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    Yep, that's right. I think Elway's a fool for signing Ware and Talib in particular. I'm not alone, several pro analyst articles I've read have more or less said the same...the signings were "risky".

    I don't know why some Chiefs fans are worried and think the donkey signings were so great. Below is a quote from one pro analyst:

    "Ware was just released by the Dallas Cowboys Tuesday afternoon at the official start of the NFL free-agent period: the team didn't want to carry his $16 million salary cap figure for the 2014 season. Ware turns 32 before the start of the season, was hampered by quad injuries and finished with a career low six sacks in a career low 13 games."

    I don't know why some think the signing of Talib was all that great, either. The quote below is from another NFL pro analyst giving thoughts on the donkey's latest signings:

    "Talib is a risk, too. He's had hip injuries and also incurred some off field issues, which ran him out of Tampa Bay just a few years ago. Plus, last we saw of him he was being taken out in the playoff game by the Bronco' Wes Welker on a play Bill Belichick called one of the dirtiest he had ever seen. Clearly, Talib has forgotten, or was charmed by dollar signs, whatever."

    The donkey's signed two injury prone aging players. One of which has had off field issues, too, and another coming off his worst career year ever, and they spent $87 million to sign those two "risky" players. I don't call that making "great" moves on Elway's part, rather, call it foolish.

    Elway's ego has more to do with who he's signing than any other factor. He's trying to make a media splash because his ego LOVES the attention, but he's also trying to redeem himself & the franchise after their pathetic humiliating Super Bowl loss. He's really not that smart of a GM.

    He's been signing aging injury prone players, including Manning, at the end of their careers chasing one Super Bowl win, that's it. He's trying to build a one year SB winning team. He's not preparing for the future, nor for a team that can compete consistently for consecutive seasons. Hey, maybe it's worth it to some, but I'd rather have a wise GM like Dorsey, who builds more through the draft, homegrown young and healthy players who can compete for years to come, and win consistently and for more than one season. I want a Dorsey & Reid dynasty, like Green Bay & the Pats built...not a one year contender.

    "Official Chiefs Crowd / Historian/Correspondent / Ambassador"

    "The greatest accomplishment is not in never falling, but in rising again after you fall. The real glory is being knocked to your knees and then coming back. That's real glory. That's the essence of it." ~Vince Lombardi~

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    Quote Originally Posted by doobs_05 View Post
    I'm just not a blind homer who thinks every chiefs move is brilliant and every move by the opposing team is terrible
    Well, no sh!t, McDuff. Many of us here have questioned many of the Chiefs moves over the years. Personally, I didn't like the 2010 draft at all for the Chiefs and I've stated that many times. Many have stated they didn't like Bowe being signed to a big contact and there are many other examples.

    So tell us, who exactly are these "blind homers who thinks every chiefs move is brilliant and every move by the opposing team is terrible" that you speak of? I know of none.

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    Quote Originally Posted by doobs_05 View Post
    The manning and cassel comparison was more along the lines of when a team manning is QB for loses "lol manning sucks lost the game"

    When cassel was playing like crap all game "guys its not all cassel's fault, its other problems as well"
    I understand that mindset but theres a big difference in the two.

    One we are told is the best to ever play the game. He is the one that the team is suppose to count on to come up big and take the team to the win. So when he throws 2 picks and fumbles in the biggest game of the year with the build up he gets the backlash is going to be bigger.

    The other is nothing more then an average QB. the hype isnt as big you're not counting on him to come up huge for the team. You not getting anything more then expected. so to compare the backlash the two get is just not a good comparision


    As for the blind fan thing I can't say I've seen to many of that. Berdempsy has over time had things about the Chiefs he didn't like. Example is Brandon Albert. He was never high on him. I think pretty much everyone Bashed Pioli. I took some heat during the 2012 season when I "defended" Cassel when I said he wasn't the only problem with the team. I don't see many blind fans here that's just my opinion. Lots are critical of what Denvers doing but there are reasons that are vailid. What they are doing just hasn't worked. Not just in the NFL but in many sports. In the NBA the Knicks brought in name after name for a few years and are to this day a mess because of it. Can it work for Denver sure. But I think it's very fair to be critical of a team using a method that just hasn't worked in sports.
    ​BAN ROY


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    If I may, I'd like to try to inject just a touch of reason into all this sturm und drang.

    I think Connie Jo's calling Elway's recent free agent signings foolish was perhaps a little over the top. In fact, Elway had no choice but to spent every dime he could scrape together on big name free agents. When the donks signed a $96 million contract with manning they made a simple statement. They said "The future is the next 5 years and the success or failure of those 5 years will only be measured by whether we win one or more Super Bowls." Well 2 seasons later, they have spent $38 million on manning and they haven't won a Super Bowl. So by the donks own measurement, the last 2 years have been a failure for them. A $38 million failure.

    They have manning under contract for 3 more seasons. If they don't win a Super Bowl in those 3 years they will have essentially wasted $96 million. Manning isn't getting any younger so Elway had no choice but to "go all in" to try to get some free agents that could help them win a Super Bowl RIGHT DAMN NOW. With the lower end draft picks their record gets them they simply do not have the luxury of trying to draft and develop to fill their needs. Elway has no choice but to try to buy big name free agents to get them over the top and win a Super Bowl. And frankly, if he has to violate the salary cap to do it I am sure he will. Elway has sold the donkey's soul to the devil for a shot at a Super Bowl so he needs to move fast before the devil comes to collect his payment.

    The donkeys are going to spend a good while rotting in the AFC West cellar as a result of what they have done. But that is OK with them SO LONG AS THEY WIN A SUPER BOWL with manning.

    It's a gamble. Nothing more. Some people like that kind of gamble. Some don't.

    I've heard (not in this thread) the manning signing compared to the Chiefs signing Joe Montana. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO COMPARISON! Adjusted for inflation and making it a 5 year contract instead of 3, Montana's contract was approx $43 million for 5 years. We got Montana for less than half what the donks paid for manning. And so far they have ABSOLUTELY no more return on investment than we got.

    So.....did Elway do a smart thing signing manning or was it the stupidist move ever made by a GM? I dunno. Nobody knows yet. But having signed manning to the deal he did, Elway would have been a MORONIC CRETIN not to spend money like a drunken sailor on free agents. Elway took a huge gamble when he signed manning. Once you have made that gamble and been BLOWN OUT in a Super Bowl what choice do you have but to double down on your original bet????? There is no choice.

    Me? I'm pretty happy with Reid/Dorsey. I expect the 2014 season to be a step down (record wise) from 2013 but I honestly think they are building a team that will dominate the AFC West for a decade or more.

    Will that get us a Super Bowl? DUNNO. But I feel pretty confident it will get us more playing time and wins in January than we have seen in a long long time. And I am OK with that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    I understand that mindset but theres a big difference in the two.

    One we are told is the best to ever play the game. He is the one that the team is suppose to count on to come up big and take the team to the win. So when he throws 2 picks and fumbles in the biggest game of the year with the build up he gets the backlash is going to be bigger.

    The other is nothing more then an average QB. the hype isnt as big you're not counting on him to come up huge for the team. You not getting anything more then expected. so to compare the backlash the two get is just not a good comparision


    As for the blind fan thing I can't say I've seen to many of that. Berdempsy has over time had things about the Chiefs he didn't like. Example is Brandon Albert. He was never high on him. I think pretty much everyone Bashed Pioli. I took some heat during the 2012 season when I "defended" Cassel when I said he wasn't the only problem with the team. I don't see many blind fans here that's just my opinion. Lots are critical of what Denvers doing but there are reasons that are vailid. What they are doing just hasn't worked. Not just in the NFL but in many sports. In the NBA the Knicks brought in name after name for a few years and are to this day a mess because of it. Can it work for Denver sure. But I think it's very fair to be critical of a team using a method that just hasn't worked in sports.
    Alright, i'll apologize to anyone i upset with my words

    The buying out players has worked for NY Yankess in the past (then again i dont know if they were BIG spenders in their other WS appearences).

    ctchiefsfan put (in way better words) what i was trying to say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brdempsey69 View Post
    But, doobs_05 is a Donkeys fan & it wouldn't matter if your original post was put into braille and shoved up his arse. He still wouldn't comprehend what you were pointing out.
    brdempsey....I am glad to see you back. You've been MIA for a while and I was just about to send out a search party. You've been on a real tear all through this thread. And lemme be clear......doobs_05 annoys the hell out of me sometimes. But I think calling him a donkeys fan is being a little harsh. For me at least he has come nowhere near being as annoying as MMO/MMH was. I mean....if you called me a Raiders fan I'd probably stroke out right at my keyboard. I'm not telling you what to do. I've no standing here to do that, but could you maybe tone it down just a little? Again. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just asking that as a fellow Chiefs fan could you maybe consider turning down the heat a little?

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    Quote Originally Posted by doobs_05 View Post
    Alright, i'll apologize to anyone i upset with my words

    The buying out players has worked for NY Yankess in the past (then again i dont know if they were BIG spenders in their other WS appearences).

    ctchiefsfan put (in way better words) what i was trying to say.
    When they won in 09 they were huge spenders so it worked out for them in the late 90s early 00s they won with guys that worked through there system or they found that were not highly thought of the Jeters,Riveras and such. Guys they drafted or made into stars. In the time they have really went out and spent 200 million they have missed the playoffs twice to 1 ws win. So if thats working for you then sure it works for them. The Yanks and Redsox both have made it work at times but at the same time it has come back to bite them at times.
    ​BAN ROY


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    Quote Originally Posted by doobs_05 View Post
    ctchiefsfan put (in way better words) what i was trying to say.
    Thanks for the mention. I have been watching this thread blow up and I apologize for how long my post was but I sorta think maybe I understand what elway is doing. Like many on this board, I was all hot to trot for us to buy manning. 2 years later, with a new head coach and a new GM, I am glad we didn't. But that is just me and how I think. I'm not a gambler. Never even been to Vegas or wanted to.

    As pished as I will be if the damned donks win a Super Bowl with manning, I honestly think Reid and Dorsey are charting a path that will make me happy as a Chiefs fan for a much longer time than anything Elway is doing in donkeyland.

    But that is just me and I can certainly understand a Chiefs fan that would be in favor of "risking it all" for a shot at the Super Bowl. Not my way of thinking, but I understand it.

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctchiefsfan View Post
    brdempsey....I am glad to see you back. You've been MIA for a while and I was just about to send out a search party. You've been on a real tear all through this thread. And lemme be clear......doobs_05 annoys the hell out of me sometimes. But I think calling him a donkeys fan is being a little harsh. For me at least he has come nowhere near being as annoying as MMO/MMH was. I mean....if you called me a Raiders fan I'd probably stroke out right at my keyboard. I'm not telling you what to do. I've no standing here to do that, but could you maybe tone it down just a little? Again. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just asking that as a fellow Chiefs fan could you maybe consider turning down the heat a little?
    Sorry, but in case anyone hasn't noticed, this is a Chiefs fans website, not a site for defending the Donkeys like he does continually with stupid & illogical posts time and again, even with substantiated evidence put right in front of his face. When he stops doing that, then I'll stop the attack. And I did tell him before not to post responses to me, but he chose to disregard that. So be it, but I suggest that he and other like him consider a statement that Ho Chi Minh made prior to the French-Indochina war when he told the French: "If you want to fight, then we will fight. For every 10 men of ours that you kill, we will kill one of yours, BUT IN THE END, YOU WILL BE THE ONE WHO WILL TIRE OF IT".

    Even in this thread, he chose to rip things out of context. Connie Jo is quite correct about Elway being a fool for handing out 87 mill in contracts to two players ( and I believe it's over 40 mill in guaranteed money ) that probably will not be much of an upgrade over the two guys they'll most likely be replacing & could ultimately wind up being a downgrade, and of course doobs_05 defended it like a dog defends its food when it senses the threat of it being taken away -- completely illogical and anybody with any sense of diplomacy can see that.

    So what if the Donkeys gave Manning a 5-yr 96 mill contract? Are you telling me that because of that, the playing field should be tilted unfairly in the Donkeys favor like Connie Jo provided pictorial evidence of, or that it excuses Elway for paying a whopping amount to these two players that would not have made any difference in their SB loss to Seattle? Sorry, but I'm not buying into any that. Connie Jo is simply telling the truth, she's not giving her opinion, as one might believe.

    Donkeys can not and will not win any SB without the deck stacked in their favor somehow and here's an article that proves they were cheating the salary cap from 1996-1998 for which they got fined for and lost draft picks and if you read Bowlen's statements you can easily see he's nothing more than a clever liar.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2004Sep17.html

    BTW, Joe Montana's contract with the Chiefs was 3 yrs, 10 mill., not 43 mill, and the Chiefs didn't have the playing field tilted in their favor in any way, shape, or form while Montana played in KC.

  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by doobs_05 View Post
    WE'VE BEEN SAYING THAT FOR 3 ****ING YEARS NOW! And nothing has happen to Peyton *inb4, the line holds all the damn time* This is what i'm talking about. It's always going to happen, "denver will lose to kc in arrowhead" denver wins "denver will lose in the first round" wins "NE will beat Denver, brady has Peytons number" denver wins "they'll lose in the super bowl" they lose "hahahah see i told you" yeah after you guessed it so many times.

    The "broncos made the NFL" should of been super bowl, my bad lol
    Yeah, the Broncos have skirted disaster. A combination of getting rid of the ball fast & holding no-calls has kept Peyton on the field. If I was an Offensive lineman for the Broncos, and my paycheck revolved around me keeping Peyton upright, I'd be holding, too. I'd also be expecting to get flagged & fined as well. Strangely enough that part just doesn't seem to happen to the Broncos. None of which makes Elway a genius GM. Doesn't make anything I stated untrue, either.

    As far as the "win now" theory...Sounds great, as long as you win, and/or figure out a way to stick someone else with the tab.

  11. #30
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    brdempsey....C'mon....you know I am not picking a fight with you. I consider you a friend and one that I usually agree with.

    On Montana's contract....

    Quote Originally Posted by brdempsey69
    BTW, Joe Montana's contract with the Chiefs was 3 yrs, 10 mill., not 43 mill, and the Chiefs didn't have the playing field tilted in their favor in any way, shape, or form while Montana played in KC.
    Yes I know that. But if you take that 3 years/$10 million, adjust it for inflation since '93 when we signed Montana and then multiply it to reach 5 years it comes out to roughly $43 million for 5 years in today's dollars. I was merely trying to make a fairly honest comparison between the two contracts. Y'know....apples to apples? Guess I didn't do a good enough job of making that clear in my earlier post.

    As to these new free agent signings by Elway.....I tend to agree that they were foolish. But not doing them would have been even more foolish. Elway's choice was "dumb or dumber". He chose dumb. The true stupidity was signing manning to a $96 million contract.

    Elway has burned through 40% of the contract with manning and elway has no more "outs" for passing physicals. And if Elway doesn't produce a Super Bowl win with manning then he looks like the biggest jackass excuse for a GM to ever walk the planet. Which he probably is.

    He has no choice but to "double down" and bring in a bunch of overpriced free agents. Because if he burns $96 million on manning and doesn't get a Super Bowl win to show for it then he looks like he should be riding on the "short bus". Which he probably should. I'm not much impressed with the free agents he bought. He should have done much better for the cash he spent. These signings make me think of a John that spends $300 for 20 minutes with a streetwalker.

    As to the "special consideration" that manning has without a doubt received from the zebras and maybe from the NFL....there is NO DOUBT it is there. Only a complete fool wouldn't recognize that. But it is what it is and as rotten as it sounds to say, that is part of what the damned donks paid $96 million for. YES! An uneven playing field. And right now it looks like they may not even get what they thought they were paying for. They thought they were paying for a Super Bowl win. So far, all they have gotten is a SUPER EMBARRASSMENT.

    Lighten up brdempsey.....I'm not picking a fight with you. I'm just calling things the way I see them. I *THINK* I understand what elway is doing and if I was in his shoes I'd probably do the same thing. Because once he bought manning he was screwed if he didn't win a Super Bowl. And after this year it's starting to look like he won't.

    Personally, I think there is a real good chance that about 5-6 years from now there will be planes flying over Mile High towing banners saying "FIRE ELWAY." The moron has screwed himself. If after spending $96 million on manning the donks don't win a Super Bowl denver will run elway out of town on a rail.

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