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Thread: Are the 2014 Chiefs better?

  1. #1
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    Default Are the 2014 Chiefs better?


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    The free agent offerings have been picked over. There's very little left. Maybe KC could get Sid Rice on a one-year prove it deal.

    There's the draft, of course. The draft may add an immediate contributor, but you shouldn't count on it. It unrealistic to expect immediate help coming at one or more positions. Eric Fisher did very little last year.

    This team has holes or question marks at LE, LILB, FS, LG, RG, LT, RT and WR2. They've either filled in the gaps with lesser talent (Joe Mays, Vance Walker) or are relying on unproven talent like Eric Fisher, Donald Stephenson, Rishaw Johnson, Sanders Commings and A.J. Jenkins.

    Yes, the cap is an issue. But what has John Dorsey done to address it? Why wasn't Eric Berry signed long term, creating cap space? Why are under-performing and overpaid 2013 FA busts Anthony Fasano and Donnie Avery still here?

    As it stands now, this team looks significantly worse than last year's team.

    John Dorsey, what have you done for me lately? What have you done at all?
    ...in my opinion

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    as of right now, no

    Chiefs are in a "rebuild" mode right now. I bet they're really pushing for next years draft to come away with something.
    Last edited by doobs_05; 04-02-2014 at 12:36 PM.

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    Right now it's incomplete and that's the only thing you can say. As you said we still have the draft.

    Other things to consider is there will be some growth at least on offense in Reid's system. They have a year under their belts now and as we saw the offense got a lot better at the end of the year. Including in the playoffs even losing Charles very early in the game. They won't be adjusting to Reid's offense at the start of the year this year. Fisher won't be a rookie and like the offense he got better as the season went on. Now I have been vocal that I don't love that they are changing his position yet again but he knows how to play LT so it might not be a big deal. But there will be some growth from the players now knowing and understanding what they are going to be asked to do.

    As for the Berry thing it's one of those things easier said then done. Dorsey can't just say that hey I want to sign Berry to a long term deal and that's it. Berry to has to agree to that deal. Those things take time. It's something that is being worked on. The cap issue is overblown. This is going to be what we see from this team. Dorsey is one of the mindset that you don't spend a ton in the free agent market and build through the draft. You are going to have to go find anther team if you want all stars brought in for the most part. And as I have said that has a better history in the league then what Denver's doing. Even when there was the uncapped year and a number of teams loaded up the super bowl was Green Bay and Pittsburgh two teams who build through the draft and don't often bring in a lot of free agents. What is going to determine if Dorsey is a success or failure as a GM is if he drafts well. The free agent market just isn't going to do much to get us excited.

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    Seriously!!!! What has John Dorsey done for you lately or at all How about in one year took a 2-14 team to the play offs raising your standards by turning the roster over and over with affordable guys to counter the crappy expensive guys Pioli left him to clean up. He raised your standards for this team to the point you are expecting magic with the salary cap to sign players to cause more issues next year after the Donkies have to blow things up.

    I don't know if the Chiefs are any better as they aren't done yet, and have yet to practice or play. Amazing things happen in off season. Some times players get better, sometimes stars lose a step and completely fall off the radar. Highly Ranked Teams on paper fail to perform on the field. Teams rise up from the toilet bowl and exceed expectations. Look at how much Poe improved from last year. Look at how much K. Lewis declined in one year. Who knows what we have in some of these players.

    I just don't get what good does for you or to other fans to Claim doom and gloom before anything has taken place other than to be satisfied of the teams failure should it happen? I have concerns that is for sure, but what if Fisher becomes the LT some people think he could be.

    Remember he still has Alex Smith and Justin Houston to worry about. He will need cap space next year and the best way to do that is keep Salaries on the books as long as he can instead of deferring out to later years with restructured contract for Berry. You are just deferring money owed to him until there is a time when you will need it more but doing so, give that player more money. If there was a guy Dorsey Felt was a cant miss then he can fall back to restructures, which is why you heard rumors of Berry saying he was working a restructure prior to the new about the Chiefs saying No to D. Jackson. The numbers just didn't make sense.

    So be careful for what you ask. The time is coming that the Chiefs will release a key player or two as a cap casualty, such as Tamba or Brandon Flowers. You are basically demanding that from Dorsey now to fill other holes. He is filling holes with effective low bargain players. Quentin Demps, G. Schwartz, Mike Devito, FranK Zombo are guys who filled this role very well last year. He has signed some good players like Vance Walker and Joe Hays. Sorry they are not the over paid #1 guys, but very capable starters.

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    I agree with Matthewschiefs and Seek. It is still way too early to tell. We still have the draft, there are some decent players left in FA and the longer they go unsigned, the cheaper we can get them. We don't know if players that were on IR for most or all of last year will make the team better or worse (my hunch is better) and you are not taking into account that last year's rookies should improve, and we won't be learning a brand new offense and defense like we did last year.

    The only reason you would ask this question at this time is because you don't trust what Dorsey and Reid (who took us from 2-14 to 11-5) are doing. If the Chiefs struggle this year you can say, "see? I told you so. What did you expect?" And if the Chiefs do well, you will be pleasantly "surprised." It's a mind game that you are playing with yourself, lowering expectations to protect yourself from the pain of disappointment.

    Whatever will be, will be. Just take it as it comes, enjoy the highs and don't take the lows too seriously. It's just entertainment, after all. I don't know why anyone would want to expect the worst before the team ever sets foot on the field. That takes all of the fun out of it.
    ***Official Chiefs Crowd Game Thread Starter***

    Originally Posted by Name Withheld
    I don't think anything that's what wrong is nearly Smiths Falls we have no offense of line I think the coaches are free to call certain place I think he would absolutely do better with a different office of coordinator

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    Right now it's incomplete and that's the only thing you can say. As you said we still have the draft.

    Untrue. The only thing left are the scraps. The opportunity to improve this team has come and gone, save the draft. As I said, I don’t expect anything immediate to come from it, no matter who the GM is. The draft is for building long term.

    As for the Berry thing it's one of those things easier said then done. Dorsey can't just say that hey I want to sign Berry to a long term deal and that's it. Berry to has to agree to that deal. Those things take time. It's something that is being worked on.
    I know there are two sides to this. In the real world, there are deadlines for accomplishing things. Dorsey had all of last season until FA began to extend Eric Berry’s contract to create cap space. Unless, of course, Dorsey’s really not interested. Then KC fans have a bigger problem. The man would be a fool.

    The cap issue is overblown. This is going to be what we see from this team. Dorsey is one of the mindset that you don't spend a ton in the free agent market and build through the draft. You are going to have to go find anther team if you want all stars brought in for the most part. And as I have said that has a better history in the league then what Denver's doing. Even when there was the uncapped year and a number of teams loaded up the super bowl was Green Bay and Pittsburgh two teams who build through the draft and don't often bring in a lot of free agents. What is going to determine if Dorsey is a success or failure as a GM is if he drafts well. The free agent market just isn't going to do much to get us excited.
    I’m not talking about going “all Daniel Snyder” over FA. A key addition or two would be nice to minimize the losses. The Chiefs have lost far more than they’ve gained this offseason and that’s a problem because the replacements are either unknown or worse.
    ...in my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Untrue. The only thing left are the scraps. The opportunity to improve this team has come and gone, save the draft. As I said, I don’t expect anything immediate to come from it, no matter who the GM is. The draft is for building long term.



    I know there are two sides to this. In the real world, there are deadlines for accomplishing things. Dorsey had all of last season until FA began to extend Eric Berry’s contract to create cap space. Unless, of course, Dorsey’s really not interested. Then KC fans have a bigger problem. The man would be a fool.



    I’m not talking about going “all Daniel Snyder” over FA. A key addition or two would be nice to minimize the losses. The Chiefs have lost far more than they’ve gained this offseason and that’s a problem because the replacements are either unknown or worse.
    What exactly did this team lose?

    A lt (the best player they lost) who wasn't on the field for a good part of the season anyway because he got hurt often. And it's not like he was playing lights out anyway.

    then there is Tyson Jackson who most fans wanted ran out of town anyway but now he's a loss?

    This team didn't lose all that much. They are mostly intact. And the players they drafted last year should get a bit better. I for one am excited to see Marcus Cooper. Yes he struggled at the end of the year but he showed some flashes of being a damn good player I'm excited to see if he can grow into a good player.

    There is reason to be excited about this team if they get some of the help they need in the draft they should be a good team that only has a upside. That begins with drafting well. Bashing Dorsey is just INSANE right now.

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    You say you want him to cut Fasano and Avery to make cap space. Have you looked at their contracts? Fasano's cap hit is more than he makes being on the team. Avery's cap hit will only save us 150,000.

    Restructuring contracts just just pushes them off until next year. Right now we are not set up to do amazingly cap space in 2015, so restructuring is going to screw us.

    we don't have cap room for a big splashy name in FA. Not even one. I would have loved a DJax signing, but not one that would cripple us for the future. We kicked the tires, I'm satisfied with that. We tried for Emmanuel Sanders, and that fell through. We have about 3mil that we can spend before the draft. You will probably see one or two more backup/depth signings, but Dorsey would be foolish to do anything else.

    Maybe Dorsey knows what he is doing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seek View Post
    Seriously!!!! What has John Dorsey done for you lately or at all How about in one year took a 2-14 team to the play offs raising your standards by turning the roster over and over with affordable guys to counter the crappy expensive guys Pioli left him to clean up. He raised your standards for this team to the point you are expecting magic with the salary cap to sign players to cause more issues next year after the Donkies have to blow things up.
    He didn’t raise my standards that high. Last year’s team was an aberration caused mostly by a weak schedule. Seems either your memory or mine is jaded but what “expensive, crappy Pioli guy” either than Matt Cassel did Dorsey jettison? Am I missing someone?

    It’s a shame that many have to justify what the Chiefs are currently doing by referring to the “inevitable” fall of the Broncos. The Broncos are defending AFC champions. That justifies anything they are currently doing. As for the future, not that it matters, but the contracts given by DEN do not cause them future cap distress. Seems Elway’s pretty good at what he does.

    I’d like the Chiefs to beat DEN on the field, not by attrition. The team is moving backwards.

    I don't know if the Chiefs are any better as they aren't done yet, and have yet to practice or play. Amazing things happen in off season. Some times players get better, sometimes stars lose a step and completely fall off the radar. Highly Ranked Teams on paper fail to perform on the field. Teams rise up from the toilet bowl and exceed expectations. Look at how much Poe improved from last year. Look at how much K. Lewis declined in one year. Who knows what we have in some of these players.

    I just don't get what good does for you or to other fans to Claim doom and gloom before anything has taken place other than to be satisfied of the teams failure should it happen? I have concerns that is for sure, but what if Fisher becomes the LT some people think he could be.
    Things have taken place. The 2014 season began March 11 and the Chiefs are worse off than they were last year. This upcoming season doesn’t offer the cupcakes last year did. The NFCW is going nowhere whereas the NFCE fell apart.

    Yes “miracles” happen every year in the NFL. Just getting tired of wishing for them instead of the Chiefs being their own miracle.


    Remember he still has Alex Smith and Justin Houston to worry about. He will need cap space next year and the best way to do that is keep Salaries on the books as long as he can instead of deferring out to later years with restructured contract for Berry. You are just deferring money owed to him until there is a time when you will need it more but doing so, give that player more money. If there was a guy Dorsey Felt was a cant miss then he can fall back to restructures, which is why you heard rumors of Berry saying he was working a restructure prior to the new about the Chiefs saying No to D. Jackson. The numbers just didn't make sense.

    So be careful for what you ask. The time is coming that the Chiefs will release a key player or two as a cap casualty, such as Tamba or Brandon Flowers. You are basically demanding that from Dorsey now to fill other holes. He is filling holes with effective low bargain players. Quentin Demps, G. Schwartz, Mike Devito, FranK Zombo are guys who filled this role very well last year. He has signed some good players like Vance Walker and Joe Hays. Sorry they are not the over paid #1 guys, but very capable starters.
    Devito is a good player. Schwartz turned out to be too. Zombo is ok. Walker is mediocre at best. Mays is below average. I wouldn’t call either a “capable starter”. More like “effective backup”

    Extending Eric Berry and restructuring his deal are two different things. You see, other draft-centric teams do resign their own players. Guess what? The deals are almost always backloaded to provide immediate cap space.

    You sign Berry for 4-6 years now. You guarantee three years of it. Give him a $10M bonus stretched over four years. His first year salary is the minimum. In year four or five you have a large salary than can be renegotiated then.

    Year one Berry receives $10.73M, but his cap hit is only $3.23M. Eight million in cap savings. Years 2-4 offer modest, escalating salaries plus 2.5M added to their cap hit. Year five you redo the whole thing all over again. Who cares then?

    All teams do that type of deal, not just Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder. The cap rises every year. You budget against it. Cap problems come with success. The success softens the blow.

    I like Berry. I want him in KC a long time. Sign him now so you don’t have to worry about both he and Houston next year. You might need to franchise Houston. Personally, I’d wait for Alex Smith, but I’m not as impressed as others are.

    In conclusion, the thing is this: You, yourself, called the Chiefs a playoff team. If you are aren’t moving forward in the NFL, you’re going backwards.
    ...in my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    He didn’t raise my standards that high. Last year’s team was an aberration caused mostly by a weak schedule. Seems either your memory or mine is jaded but what “expensive, crappy Pioli guy” either than Matt Cassel did Dorsey jettison? Am I missing someone?

    It’s a shame that many have to justify what the Chiefs are currently doing by referring to the “inevitable” fall of the Broncos. The Broncos are defending AFC champions. That justifies anything they are currently doing. As for the future, not that it matters, but the contracts given by DEN do not cause them future cap distress. Seems Elway’s pretty good at what he does.

    I’d like the Chiefs to beat DEN on the field, not by attrition. The team is moving backwards.


    Things have taken place. The 2014 season began March 11 and the Chiefs are worse off than they were last year. This upcoming season doesn’t offer the cupcakes last year did. The NFCW is going nowhere whereas the NFCE fell apart.

    Yes “miracles” happen every year in the NFL. Just getting tired of wishing for them instead of the Chiefs being their own miracle.



    Devito is a good player. Schwartz turned out to be too. Zombo is ok. Walker is mediocre at best. Mays is below average. I wouldn’t call either a “capable starter”. More like “effective backup”

    Extending Eric Berry and restructuring his deal are two different things. You see, other draft-centric teams do resign their own players. Guess what? The deals are almost always backloaded to provide immediate cap space.

    You sign Berry for 4-6 years now. You guarantee three years of it. Give him a $10M bonus stretched over four years. His first year salary is the minimum. In year four or five you have a large salary than can be renegotiated then.

    Year one Berry receives $10.73M, but his cap hit is only $3.23M. Eight million in cap savings. Years 2-4 offer modest, escalating salaries plus 2.5M added to their cap hit. Year five you redo the whole thing all over again. Who cares then?

    All teams do that type of deal, not just Jerry Jones and Dan Snyder. The cap rises every year. You budget against it. Cap problems come with success. The success softens the blow.

    I like Berry. I want him in KC a long time. Sign him now so you don’t have to worry about both he and Houston next year. You might need to franchise Houston. Personally, I’d wait for Alex Smith, but I’m not as impressed as others are.

    In conclusion, the thing is this: You, yourself, called the Chiefs a playoff team. If you are aren’t moving forward in the NFL, you’re going backwards.
    You are blinded by your own biased opinion that teams are won through over paying in free agency. Did you know that Walker is considered a top 40 d Lineman in the NFL. He is not a top Pass Rusher but a very sold run stuffer. He is an upgrade over T. Jackson and Devito, yet your so upset that he wasn't the best player in FA that you are calling him mediocre.

    I can't tell you how many games Joe Hayes had me upset with him as a Donkie. The guy loves to hit and hit people hard and I was so mad at how hard he hit our players. We don't need a replacement for DJ. We needed a replacement for Jordan, which Hayes is. Even if he loses the starting role our second year player Johnson he provides great depth and blows people up on special teams.

    Husain Abdulah was resigned. I may be wrong but didn't he get just as many reps as K. Lewis and picked off a pass in the play off game and couple more later in the season as he got more playing time. There is no step back at safety right there other than depth.

    So as far as the regression that I see from last year, is the fact we play a tougher schedule, we lack interior oline depth, we lack FS depth and would like an upgrade at WR. I don't see us as bad as you feel. I do have concerns but there are still quality out there. I am also a little more optomistic with our receivers specially after J. Charles got hurt against Indy. Some people were asked to step up and they did. Jenkins may finally get his head on straight. If not, there is some cap room for next year.

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