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Thread: Are the 2014 Chiefs better?

  1. #1
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    Default Are the 2014 Chiefs better?


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    The free agent offerings have been picked over. There's very little left. Maybe KC could get Sid Rice on a one-year prove it deal.

    There's the draft, of course. The draft may add an immediate contributor, but you shouldn't count on it. It unrealistic to expect immediate help coming at one or more positions. Eric Fisher did very little last year.

    This team has holes or question marks at LE, LILB, FS, LG, RG, LT, RT and WR2. They've either filled in the gaps with lesser talent (Joe Mays, Vance Walker) or are relying on unproven talent like Eric Fisher, Donald Stephenson, Rishaw Johnson, Sanders Commings and A.J. Jenkins.

    Yes, the cap is an issue. But what has John Dorsey done to address it? Why wasn't Eric Berry signed long term, creating cap space? Why are under-performing and overpaid 2013 FA busts Anthony Fasano and Donnie Avery still here?

    As it stands now, this team looks significantly worse than last year's team.

    John Dorsey, what have you done for me lately? What have you done at all?
    ...in my opinion

  2. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jap1 View Post
    You say you want him to cut Fasano and Avery to make cap space. Have you looked at their contracts? Fasano's cap hit is more than he makes being on the team. Avery's cap hit will only save us 150,000.

    Restructuring contracts just just pushes them off until next year. Right now we are not set up to do amazingly cap space in 2015, so restructuring is going to screw us.

    we don't have cap room for a big splashy name in FA. Not even one. I would have loved a DJax signing, but not one that would cripple us for the future. We kicked the tires, I'm satisfied with that. We tried for Emmanuel Sanders, and that fell through. We have about 3mil that we can spend before the draft. You will probably see one or two more backup/depth signings, but Dorsey would be foolish to do anything else.

    Maybe Dorsey knows what he is doing.
    Isn’t the cap +/- determined by the cap hit minus the dead money? If so, cutting both saves $1.76 if done before roster & workout bonuses are paid.

    Regardless, those two aren’t the bigger item.

    I’d rather have kept Schwartz and skipped all of the garbage signings like Mays, Walker and Linkenbach. I’d rather pay UFA’s the league minimum, if that’s the route we’re going – just getting bodies to fill a roster.

    Sign Berry long term and you could have had $8M in cap space. One simple, no brainer move could have helped solve a lot more problems. There are ways to create cap space. Dorsey did nothing except cut TJ, which was a no brainer. I was hoping to see some creativity.

    Maybe Dorsey knows what he is doing. Then again, maybe he doesn’t.
    ...in my opinion

  3. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    The free agent offerings have been picked over. There's very little left. Maybe KC could get Sid Rice on a one-year prove it deal.

    There's the draft, of course. The draft may add an immediate contributor, but you shouldn't count on it. It unrealistic to expect immediate help coming at one or more positions. Eric Fisher did very little last year.

    This team has holes or question marks at LE, LILB, FS, LG, RG, LT, RT and WR2. They've either filled in the gaps with lesser talent (Joe Mays, Vance Walker) or are relying on unproven talent like Eric Fisher, Donald Stephenson, Rishaw Johnson, Sanders Commings and A.J. Jenkins.

    Yes, the cap is an issue. But what has John Dorsey done to address it? Why wasn't Eric Berry signed long term, creating cap space? Why are under-performing and overpaid 2013 FA busts Anthony Fasano and Donnie Avery still here?

    As it stands now, this team looks significantly worse than last year's team.

    John Dorsey, what have you done for me lately? What have you done at all?
    First off, Dorsey doesn't owe you, me or anybody else SQUAT. He helped take a 2-14 team and make it a 11-5 team. After what we went through in '12, I'll take 11-5 every time.

    Stephenson is not "unproven" talent. The guy's gotten better every year. Fisher had to be the grown up willing to play RT when Albert whined, and towards the end of the year began to show improvement. This year he'll be at his natural position of LT, with a year's experience under his belt. Jenkins could very well challenge Avery for the role of speedy WR. We don't know much of anything about Commings until he's given the chance.

    IMO the Vance Walker move was pretty smart. We chipped away at a competitor's strong point (Raider's D line) and upgraded our D line in one move. Is Vance Walker going to make people forget Bruce Smith? Probably not. Is anyone in KC going to remember TJ's stellar play? Probably not.

    Fasano and Avery are still here for the same reason Bowe is; Reid is patient with players. I'm amazed that both Avery and Bowe survived being cut, given the drops. Fasano needs to stay on the field. Kelce needs to get ON the field. Again, with a draft class that's deep with good WR's, that could change in a month or so. This entire argument will get played out all over again.

  4. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seek View Post
    You are blinded by your own biased opinion that teams are won through over paying in free agency. Did you know that Walker is considered a top 40 d Lineman in the NFL. He is not a top Pass Rusher but a very sold run stuffer. He is an upgrade over T. Jackson and Devito, yet your so upset that he wasn't the best player in FA that you are calling him mediocre.

    I can't tell you how many games Joe Hayes had me upset with him as a Donkie. The guy loves to hit and hit people hard and I was so mad at how hard he hit our players. We don't need a replacement for DJ. We needed a replacement for Jordan, which Hayes is. Even if he loses the starting role our second year player Johnson he provides great depth and blows people up on special teams.

    Husain Abdulah was resigned. I may be wrong but didn't he get just as many reps as K. Lewis and picked off a pass in the play off game and couple more later in the season as he got more playing time. There is no step back at safety right there other than depth.

    So as far as the regression that I see from last year, is the fact we play a tougher schedule, we lack interior oline depth, we lack FS depth and would like an upgrade at WR. I don't see us as bad as you feel. I do have concerns but there are still quality out there. I am also a little more optomistic with our receivers specially after J. Charles got hurt against Indy. Some people were asked to step up and they did. Jenkins may finally get his head on straight. If not, there is some cap room for next year.
    I don’t believe teams are bought through free agency. I see this team being decimated by it though.

    Who considers Vancy a top 40 DL? By what criteria is Walker a better run defender than either TJ or Devito? Please cite your sources. PFF grades him lower than either, particularly as a run defender. Devito grades superbly versus the run (19.1 OVR, 23 RUN). TJ (14.6 OVR, 15.5 RUN). Vancy scored 4.0 OVR and -.6 versus the run.

    Don’t like stats? Name one great defense Walker was a key part of. You can’t. He’s average.

    Husain Abdullah outplayed Kendrick Lewis, one of the worst safeties in the league. That’s your saving grace at safety? HA did not play even close to the number of snaps KLew logged (240 to 1072). Why? Because the coaches thought Lewis was better. They let him go and kept his backup.

    Joe Mays has been all over the league in a short time. DEN cut him in favor of moving their weakside LB to take over. A guy who is no longer on their team even though they had all of the cap room in the world.

    Joe Mays is a backup.

    I would love to be optimistic about where this team is headed in 2014. I don’t see any reason to be.
    ...in my opinion

  5. #14
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    Decimated?

    By losing a LT that was hurt often and not on the field anyway

    A guy who everyone before declared a total bust and Devito was was good not great?

    That's decimated? WOW ok

    As for the schedule thing. If Dorsey did nothing then why were they able to beat some of the teams in 2013 that handed it to them in 2012?

    Dorsey has been here 1 season In that season the Chiefs went to the playoffs after a 2 win year the season before . We haven't even reached training camp of season 2 and you're already about him? Take a chill pill. If dorsey hits in the draft the Chiefs will be just fine. But you have to give him that chance first. And this is what you're going to see out of Dorsey. BUILDING THROUGH THE DRAFT IS PROVEN TO WORK if you draft well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eydugstr View Post
    First off, Dorsey doesn't owe you, me or anybody else SQUAT. He helped take a 2-14 team and make it a 11-5 team. After what we went through in '12, I'll take 11-5 every time.

    Stephenson is not "unproven" talent. The guy's gotten better every year. Fisher had to be the grown up willing to play RT when Albert whined, and towards the end of the year began to show improvement. This year he'll be at his natural position of LT, with a year's experience under his belt. Jenkins could very well challenge Avery for the role of speedy WR. We don't know much of anything about Commings until he's given the chance.

    IMO the Vance Walker move was pretty smart. We chipped away at a competitor's strong point (Raider's D line) and upgraded our D line in one move. Is Vance Walker going to make people forget Bruce Smith? Probably not. Is anyone in KC going to remember TJ's stellar play? Probably not.

    Fasano and Avery are still here for the same reason Bowe is; Reid is patient with players. I'm amazed that both Avery and Bowe survived being cut, given the drops. Fasano needs to stay on the field. Kelce needs to get ON the field. Again, with a draft class that's deep with good WR's, that could change in a month or so. This entire argument will get played out all over again.
    Stephenson improved from below average to mediocre last year. "Improvement" doesn't make him good. He hasn't proven anything yet.

    So KC decides to improve their team by attacking one of the worst team in the league's strong suit? Great. You do realize the Raiders had all of the cap room in the world and let him walk? They resigned Pat Sims. They added 31 year old Antonio Smith and are giddy over late round pick Stacy McGee.

    I doubt the Raiders will lose any sleep over Vance Walker.
    ...in my opinion

  7. #16
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    Yes because Oakland's well known for making great football choices

  8. #17
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    Mongo, I think you are making a lot of assumptions that we just don't know about yet. how would you have answered this question a year ago at this time? Most were saying we were better if only because we replaced Cassel with Smith and replaced Romeo with Andy. We HAD to be better. We went 2-14 the year before. But did you see us winning 11 games?

    Last years schedule was supposed to be tough, too. The NFC East were all supposed to be good. Houston was a super bowl candidate. We "never win" in Florida (Jacksonville). Buffalo "has got our number." People had us losing to the Titans and even the Browns were supposed to be much improved. Guess what? We won all 8 of those games. In fact, outside of Denver and San Diego, the Chiefs went 11-1! Who would have predicted THAT? Oh, and our starters didn't even play in one of the San Diego games.

    I pulled up the prediction thread from last year. keep in mind that this was AFTER the draft and we had already played all of our preseason games. Here are some quotes:

    "The most i could see is 10 wins, the least i could see is 5."

    "7-9"

    "
    as low as 6-10."

    "Worst case 6 wins."

    "4 wins."

    "
    I predict a 8 and 8. However, I see us getting better in the second half of the season."

    "
    Worst case we go 5-11."

    I picked us to go 11-5, BTW.


    You can never tell how the season is going to go, especially this early when we don't know how our team or the teams we play will look at the beginning of the season. We will be adding a lot of players between now and training camp. And we will be cutting a lot of players after the preseason.

    I don't know how the off season will play out, and so far neither do you. Let's see what happens between now and September and then see where we stand.
    ***Official Chiefs Crowd Game Thread Starter***

    Originally Posted by Name Withheld
    I don't think anything that's what wrong is nearly Smiths Falls we have no offense of line I think the coaches are free to call certain place I think he would absolutely do better with a different office of coordinator

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    Yes because Oakland's well known for making great football choices
    LMAO

    You go stand by Coach Crennel. Feel the shame.

  10. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Stephenson improved from below average to mediocre last year. "Improvement" doesn't make him good. He hasn't proven anything yet.

    So KC decides to improve their team by attacking one of the worst team in the league's strong suit? Great. You do realize the Raiders had all of the cap room in the world and let him walk? They resigned Pat Sims. They added 31 year old Antonio Smith and are giddy over late round pick Stacy McGee.

    I doubt the Raiders will lose any sleep over Vance Walker.
    Okay, so what's your measuring stick for good? Must hold the Lombardi trophy in his rookie season? Numbers of holding calls?

    Yes KC decided to attack one of it's opponents via the front office. Go figure. Carl Peterson did a number on the Raiders and Seahawks over the years this way. And no, when it comes to bad decisions, the Raiders don't seem to lose much sleep over it at all. They also don't seem to learn much from them, either.

  11. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    Decimated?

    By losing a LT that was hurt often and not on the field anyway
    The LT that was hurt logged as many snaps as the guy replacing him, Eric Fisher. Stephenson logged even less. Neither played as well, overall.

    A guy who everyone before declared a total bust and Devito was was good not great?

    That's decimated? WOW ok
    Devito is a good player. So was TJ, that is, as a traditional run stuffing 34 DE. He wasn’t worth the $$$ and he certainly didn’t generate pass rush which is what gets you noticed. Vance Walker is not as good. Name one position where the Chiefs have upgraded this offseason.

    As for the schedule thing. If Dorsey did nothing then why were they able to beat some of the teams in 2013 that handed it to them in 2012?

    The team was 2-12 in 2012 under an idiot as a coach. Improvement was guaranteed by removing Romeo Crennel no matter who the GM, HC or QB was. So yes, we finally beat the Buffalo Bills. Whoopie.

    Dorsey has been here 1 season In that season the Chiefs went to the playoffs after a 2 win year the season before . We haven't even reached training camp of season 2 and you're already [IMG]file:///C:\Users\slloyd\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01 \clip_image001.gif[/IMG] about him? Take a chill pill. If dorsey hits in the draft the Chiefs will be just fine. But you have to give him that chance first. And this is what you're going to see out of Dorsey. BUILDING THROUGH THE DRAFT IS PROVEN TO WORK if you draft well.
    The 2013 team was not built by John Dorsey. None of the core players came though him. Not that I wanted Pioli to stay or Herman Edwards. Dorsey did a nice job filling in last year with Devito, Sean Smith and even Akeem Jordan. That’s it.

    You can attribute last year’s success to Andy Reid, if you want. You can give to Al Smith. You can’t give it to John Dorsey. He didn’t even hire Reid, for goodness sake. In truth, all three were in the right place at the right time.

    I’ve yet to see Dorsey hit in last year’s draft. I didn’t like the “Eric Fisher/Branden Albert maneuver”. Still don’t. I wanted Star Lotuleilei. I thought two R2 was too much for Al Smith. Still do. Kelce was hurt. And the rest, meh. Hopefully someone steps up in there. Otherwise it doesn’t look much better than Pioli’s drafts.

    This year, he’s impeded by the second R2 he overpaid for Al Smith. This, in one of the deepest drafts in years. We’ll see what he can do in this draft for sure. By my accounting we probably need 3 starters minimum (WR2, RG, FS).
    ...in my opinion

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