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Thread: If the 2013 draftees step up?

  1. #1
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    Default If the 2013 draftees step up?


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    I find myself reading this board and it seems to be in such a panic. Rightfully so maybe, we got destroyed in the first off-season phase of free agency. We do have some holes primarily in depth some with more immediate needs. However if fisher, Kelce, commings, Cooper, Catapano if these guys can step up and some contribute some start and do well. How much stress does that relieve surrounding this team?

    Personally I think this team is not in bad shape and you have to love the freedom and flexibility we have with our first round pick. Ya we are limited with our number of picks but the potential to land any number of players at 23 or lower if we can trade back who can immediately contribute is crazy and at the end of the day that's all you can ask for.

    Bottum line we have to trust what Dorsey and Reid are doing and assume they have a plan until they prove otherwise. I'm excited for draft day because I have absolutely zero idea what te chiefs will do. However all the people that could be available I dot see very many that the chiefs could take and I would be upset because they could all contribute. It's gumna be exciting and I can't wait to see what happens.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post

    Patience? No, its called reality. Iím new to this board, but not to Chiefs chat. The most common thing Iíve noticed is that Chiefs fans drastically and desperately overrate the value of their players. For every Jared Allen or Brandon Carr there are scores of Boomer Grigsbys, Jessie Haynes, Bobby Sippios that the fan base just knew was about to be a breakout player.
    That smacks of two particular players that too many Chiefs fans have overrated the past 4 years & talked all this nonsense like the Chiefs franchise revolved around these two players. Can you guess who they are?

    I'll give you a hint -- their initials are B.A. and E.B.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctchiefsfan View Post

    Oh.....and Seek.....I'm not disagreeing with what you said. Just putting my own interpretation on it.
    I didn't think you were disagreeing, fact I think you supported my point that Reid's decline in Philly was not related specifically to him as a HC. While he may have played part to it, I did not believe it was his coaching. It was players like Michael Vick trying to compete with Matt Cassel as turn over king.

    I was not much of fan of his hiring but fact of the matter we were a play off team last year. Pending some key injuries the Chiefs dang near won a play off game on the road. I have no reason to complain about Reid or Dorsey given their success in one year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Reasonable? How long were Philly fans supposed to wait? The lunatic fringe in Philly gives the group as a whole a bad name. They are some of the most knowledgeable sports fans in the country. Reid was given control of the operations, got desperate after so many close failures and went on free agent spending sprees that led to his demise. He ran the team into the ground. Ask an Eagles fan.

    Along the way fans grew tired of his self-deprecating, say nothing, press conferences after losses. They grew tired of hearing how it was ďhis faultĒ and finally agreed, while asking ďWhat are you going to do about it?Ē

    Most Chiefs fans said the Chiefs were talented and were only credible leadership and quarterbacking away from contention. So, Reid may have just been in the right place at the right time.

    As for forgetting how to coach, most times itís more a case of going as far as youíre going to go. A change helps a coach in other sports. Very few have won a SB on a second team. The list shortens when you eliminate those who have been in the league more than 10 years. NFL coaches have a shelf life Ė overall, not just in one city.

    Keep that in mind before glorifying Dandy Andy.
    I will ask again if he ran them into the ground why did they go to the playoffs so quickly. Shouldn't they just be starting there rebuilding?

    I am not most Chiefs fans. Was I calling out Romeo in 2012 YEP. I was. But while so many were pointing to the offense I was the one sitting here saying the defense wasn't much better. I have been saying since the end of this season that our defense is SOFT. It wasn't just go get a new QB and coach and you can start to win. Reid is a part of that. Now will Reid lead the team to the super bowl I don't know. I don't know that he can't I just know what I saw he took a 2-14 team to the playoffs the next year. There's nothing to about with Reid at this point in time. When there is you bet I will just like I did with Romeo. I just haven't seen anything to be upset with Reid after year 1. Year 2 could be a different story.

    And I will again agree it was time for a change in Philly. But running them into the ground is a very large overstatment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Patience? No, its called reality. Iím new to this board, but not to Chiefs chat. The most common thing Iíve noticed is that Chiefs fans drastically and desperately overrate the value of their players. For every Jared Allen or Brandon Carr there are scores of Boomer Grigsbys, Jessie Haynes, Bobby Sippios that the fan base just knew was about to be a breakout player.

    Now we have ďThe BeastĒ Mike Catapano, FS savior Sanders Commings, Will Shields II after a game, Rishaw Johnson, and pre-season 2014 Comeback Player of the Year, A.J. Jenkins. Iíll believe it when I see it. I thought Missouri was the ďShow Me StateĒ

    Kniles Davis barely had enough moments to make a one minute highlight reel.
    If you want to talk about reality then you would know that it's reality that very few rookies come in and play like all pros on day 1. That's reality. NFL players have take time to grow into the players they will be more often then not.

    And what do you expect from Davis being Charle's backup him to be getting 20 carries running for 1,000 yards? Charles didn't do much his rookie year either man what a bust he was right? Patience yes have some. There's a difference in having patience and saying you have the next great thing. I'm not saying we have the great thing I'm just saying how about showing the slightest sign of patience before jumping all over a draft class.

    And I for one thought Carr was overrated. I still think that. I mean it's not like he's doing much in Dallas.
    ​BAN ROY


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    Quote Originally Posted by ctchiefsfan View Post
    How many here would really complain if Reid "ran the Chiefs into the ground" in a similar fashion?

    Matter of fact, the last time we got "run into the ground" in a similar fashion was under Marty and if I recall correctly at the end of the 2012 season there were a lot of people wishing Marty would come back and "run us into the ground" again.
    I suppose if you're okay with hamburger or even sirloin. I want porterhouse.
    ...in my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Why is everyone's opinion based on a good performance in one game? Do we even know Davis' health going into 2014?

    BTW: Davis was 18 carries for 67 yards in that game. A 3.7 YPG -- below average. Is that really "stepping up?"
    Add the 33 yards receiving and maybe mention the two TDs, and it sounds like a 100 yard day with a pair of TDs.

    Who WOULDN'T call that stepping up? At least for THAT game?

    I agree on the whole notion that we don't know we have a gem in this guy, or so many others. But I would call his performance in the playoff game a definite "step up".

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewschiefs View Post
    I will ask again if he ran them into the ground why did they go to the playoffs so quickly. Shouldn't they just be starting there rebuilding?
    They are rebuilding. Their success is attributed to Chip Kelly and the demise of the rest of the division. Kelly used Shady McCoy far more intelligently than Reid did. And we see that with Charles. Reid never establishes a run game except to close a game out.

    I am not most Chiefs fans. Was I calling out Romeo in 2012 YEP. I was. But while so many were pointing to the offense I was the one sitting here saying the defense wasn't much better. I have been saying since the end of this season that our defense is SOFT. It wasn't just go get a new QB and coach and you can start to win. Reid is a part of that. Now will Reid lead the team to the super bowl I don't know. I don't know that he can't I just know what I saw he took a 2-14 team to the playoffs the next year. There's nothing to about with Reid at this point in time. When there is you bet I will just like I did with Romeo. I just haven't seen anything to be upset with Reid after year 1. Year 2 could be a different story.

    And I will again agree it was time for a change in Philly. But running them into the ground is a very large overstatment.
    No it isnít. Again, ask an Eagles fan. Review the downward slide at the end of his time there. Facts are facts.

    As for Crennel, it was easy for everyone to ďcall him outĒ at the end of a 2 win season. What was your opinion after 2011? Did you want him as HC? I didnít because he was a bum and was told I was wrong. Just like I didnít want Herman Edwards and was told I was wrong.

    As you can tell I didnít want Reid either. Heís better than the aforementioned. Iím of the opinion that proven coaches are just that. Reid is B grade and will not get better. He will get KC to a respectable level quickly and taper off, just like he did in Philly. Hopefully mgmt recognizes when that happens and pulls the plug and hands the ball to someone to get this team over the top.

    Iíd hire 100 Todd Haleys groping to get the next Bill Belichek before ever hiring a proven Andy Reid.

    If you want to talk about reality then you would know that it's reality that very few rookies come in and play like all pros on day 1. That's reality. NFL players have take time to grow into the players they will be more often then not.

    And what do you expect from Davis being Charle's backup him to be getting 20 carries running for 1,000 yards? Charles didn't do much his rookie year either man what a bust he was right? Patience yes have some. There's a difference in having patience and saying you have the next great thing. I'm not saying we have the great thing I'm just saying how about showing the slightest sign of patience before jumping all over a draft class.

    And I for one thought Carr was overrated. I still think that. I mean it's not like he's doing much in Dallas.
    Fair enough. Kniles Davis is of no concern to me anyway. I just called you out for overvaluing his performance. This team is sunk if Charles is lost, because his talent cannot be replaced by anyone.

    As for Carr, his career has far exceeded the reasonable expectations of his draft status. Itís rare. Thatís the point. When people start thinking that you can move a bunch of third day draftees, UDFA, and waiver wire garbage into several key spots on the team and not feel pain, well, they just arenít being realistic.

    Unfortunately, as per your assertion, the Chiefs have funneled themselves into a very tough 2014 campaign. They are reliant on having 2-3 rookies step immediately into key roles impatiently since the talent on this team has diminished since last year. I hope it works out.
    ...in my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by brdempsey69 View Post
    That smacks of two particular players that too many Chiefs fans have overrated the past 4 years & talked all this nonsense like the Chiefs franchise revolved around these two players. Can you guess who they are?

    I'll give you a hint -- their initials are B.A. and E.B.
    The difference is the universe agrees about those players.
    ...in my opinion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    The difference is the universe agrees about those players.
    What universe? The universe of hero-worshiping fantasy football kiddies? Got news for you, a great many that have been following the Chiefs for a long time know differently. And it's not an opinion because I've seen the evidence manifest itself on the football field time and again. Both those players have done or did very little to change the Chiefs fortunes since they were drafted.

  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    They are rebuilding. Their success is attributed to Chip Kelly and the demise of the rest of the division. Kelly used Shady McCoy far more intelligently than Reid did. And we see that with Charles. Reid never establishes a run game except to close a game out.


    No it isn’t. Again, ask an Eagles fan. Review the downward slide at the end of his time there. Facts are facts.
    It depends on your view of running them into the ground I guess. His low point was his last year there at 4 wins. A lot like us they had more talent then a 4 win team in 2012 but like I said it just wasn't working anymore there. His track record of all the playoff years and wining in the playoffs can't be ignored. I don't see one terrible year as running them into the ground sorry.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    As for Crennel, it was easy for everyone to “call him out” at the end of a 2 win season. What was your opinion after 2011? Did you want him as HC? I didn’t because he was a bum and was told I was wrong. Just like I didn’t want Herman Edwards and was told I was wrong.
    Boy I wish you were here in 2012 because A lot of people didn't want to here anything but the QB holding this team back. In fact in one of my many rants either here or on the Chiefscrowd facebook I was told that I myself had to be Matt Cassel for saying he wasn't the biggest thing holding this team back. So it wasn't that easy for everyone.

    I wasn't thrilled about Romeo being the guy. But I always am of the mind not to pretend they fail until they fail. I didn't want Herm either but I gave him a chance. He failed and I was sure to talk about him failing.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
    Fair enough. Kniles Davis is of no concern to me anyway. I just called you out for overvaluing his performance. This team is sunk if Charles is lost, because his talent cannot be replaced by anyone.

    As for Carr, his career has far exceeded the reasonable expectations of his draft status. It’s rare. That’s the point. When people start thinking that you can move a bunch of third day draftees, UDFA, and waiver wire garbage into several key spots on the team and not feel pain, well, they just aren’t being realistic.

    Unfortunately, as per your assertion, the Chiefs have funneled themselves into a very tough 2014 campaign. They are reliant on having 2-3 rookies step immediately into key roles impatiently since the talent on this team has diminished since last year. I hope it works out.
    All I said was Davis steped up in the playoffs. Scoring 2 tds as a rookie I would call stepping up. You seem very down on the 2013 rookie class but you didn't even mention his pick. Davis was the backup to Charles he didn't do a bad job. Did you know he scored more tds then Charles did in his rookie year. All I'm saying is give this class a chance to develop into the players they are going to be before writting them off. Before game 1 of year 2 is just not the time to do that.

    And I will again ask what exactly did this team really lose. The "best player" we lost was Albert who A. Wasn't even able to play every game and B. Wasn't exactly great. Yes he went to the pro bowl but that's about as waterdowned as you can get these days. There's a reason most people don't care about the pro bowl these days.
    ​BAN ROY


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    Quote Originally Posted by brdempsey69 View Post
    What universe? The universe of hero-worshiping fantasy football kiddies? Got news for you, a great many that have been following the Chiefs for a long time know differently. And it's not an opinion because I've seen the evidence manifest itself on the football field time and again. Both those players have done or did very little to change the Chiefs fortunes since they were drafted.

    there is fantasy football with OL and Defensive Players?

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