Hardcore player evaluation.

[texaschief]

How bout a little group fun?

If this team is REALLY gonna take a couple years and "major reconstructive surgery" over that span to become a contender again, who should be on and stay on this team? Who will be too old when we are good? Who could we trade now to bring more draft picks?

Here's some fun to get started that will surely get some feathers ruffled.

Trade Tony Gonzales: He's been the ultimate Chief and it's a shame Peterson couldn't get him a ring. The best way he can do that now is to trade him to a contender for a #1 pick or a young, good player.

Trade Jared Allen: Negotiate a sign and trade with Allen. Tell him to list 10 teams he would accept a trade to and get the best possible bounty you can for arguably the best pass rusher in league. Perhaps a first rounder and more.

Trade Larry Johnson: Get ANYTHING you can for him. Huge contract with big questions after an injury laden 2007. This one may be best to move next season.

I think those 3 players, the best the Chiefs have to offer in the prime of their careers would bring huge bounty to help with the rebuilding. Bringing in a bunch of first rounders and more young players may require just one more "rebuilding year.

So, who else should stay and who else should go?

[texaschief]

Canada is one of the more positive Chiefs fans I know.

Is there anything positive to say about a team that is 4-12?

Exactly...this is the over all sentiment of this entire board. that record is the ONLY thing you people see. It's ridiculous. Until the Chiefs fell out of playoff contention, the Defense was in the top 10 in the league. The Super Star RB got injured. That alone took away at least half the offense. The line didn't perform. ok. With the defense this team has, once the line is rebuilt and we get a couple corners, this team is right back in contention....but the only thing being said is how awful this team is.

There hasn't been one thread posted about how the young players performed after the season ended. I try to talk about the future but so many of y'all are holding onto the past instead of discussing the future.

The only thing being said here is how bad the head coach is. I've posted several threads here trying to talk about other stuff and all i get back are how bad of a coach Herm is. It's ridiculous.

[Chiefster]

I would suggest that none of the TE's listed are nearly the player that Tony Gonzalez is. The only thing being discussed in the comparison is their receiving numbers...ummm anyone else notice that the only other competent blocker in that list was Jason Witten. And Witten has been in the league for a few years, but only has one really impressive year (this one).

For right now Tony Gonzalez is in a class of his own at the TE position. Gates is the only other receiving TE that has approached his excellence for more than a season or two, and Gates is a less than mediocre blocker.

Tony Gonzalez began a trend of NFL teams watching the NCAA ranks for solidly built basketball players that could translate to the football field. Before Gonzalez, the premier TEs in the game were guys like Brent Jones and Jay Novacek who were essentially oversized receivers, much like Shockey or Winslow Jr. The only two on that list that really could compare to Gonzalez down the road are Winslow Jr and Vernon Davis, and only if they put their minds to becoming complete players (receiving and blocking)

OUTSTANDING REPLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

As usual thoughtful and insightful!

Rep!

[texaschief]

I would suggest that none of the TE's listed are nearly the player that Tony Gonzalez is. The only thing being discussed in the comparison is their receiving numbers...ummm anyone else notice that the only other competent blocker in that list was Jason Witten. And Witten has been in the league for a few years, but only has one really impressive year (this one).

For right now Tony Gonzalez is in a class of his own at the TE position. Gates is the only other receiving TE that has approached his excellence for more than a season or two, and Gates is a less than mediocre blocker.

Tony Gonzalez began a trend of NFL teams watching the NCAA ranks for solidly built basketball players that could translate to the football field. Before Gonzalez, the premier TEs in the game were guys like Brent Jones and Jay Novacek who were essentially oversized receivers, much like Shockey or Winslow Jr. The only two on that list that really could compare to Gonzalez down the road are Winslow Jr and Vernon Davis, and only if they put their minds to becoming complete players (receiving and blocking)

again, remind me to bring this thread back in 8 years. honestly, y'all don't see the same skill level in any of those TE's as you see in Gonzo?

take off the rose colored lenses ppl.

[Canada]

Exactly...this is the over all sentiment of this entire board. that record is the ONLY thing you people see. It's ridiculous. Until the Chiefs fell out of playoff contention, the Defense was in the top 10 in the league. The Super Star RB got injured. That alone took away at least half the offense. The line didn't perform. ok. With the defense this team has, once the line is rebuilt and we get a couple corners, this team is right back in contention....but the only thing being said is how awful this team is.

There hasn't been one thread posted about how the young players performed after the season ended. I try to talk about the future but so many of y'all are holding onto the past instead of discussing the future.

The only thing being said here is how bad the head coach is. I've posted several threads here trying to talk about other stuff and all i get back are how bad of a coach Herm is. It's ridiculous.

dude that is the first time it has been posted in a loooooong time. Fact is we were 4-12. Recognizing problems does not make one pessimistic. Just cause some disagree with your assessment of getting rid of LJ, Tony and Jared, does not make us pessimistic. I would love to think Herm is the greatest coach ever. Fact is, he isn't. Yes, the defense has been rebuilt. Is it perfect? NO. Is the offensive line is shamble?? YES Does that make me pessimistic? NO. Ask me at the start of next season who I think will win the SuperBowl and I will tell everyone like I have the last 19 years that it is gonna be the CHIEFS.

[prough91]

HA! Why you're right; how stupid of me.

Or, we never had a QB knocked unconscious for 10 minutes this year. Bowe. Herm was never photographed while drooling. Jared Allen. Not once did they not arrive at the stadium to play. Tony Gonzalez. They never tried a cheerleader out at left tackle. Count your blessings fellas.

[Canada]

again, remind me to bring this thread back in 8 years. honestly, y'all don't see the same skill level in any of those TE's as you see in Gonzo?

take off the rose colored lenses ppl.

NO. I am sick and tired of people comparing young players to the all time greats. (That is what Tony is) Denver has the next Elway in Cutler. AP is the next jim Brown. As far as a TE that compares to Tony...he dosen't exist.

[Chiefster]

Exactly...this is the over all sentiment of this entire board. that record is the ONLY thing you people see. It's ridiculous. Until the Chiefs fell out of playoff contention, the Defense was in the top 10 in the league. The Super Star RB got injured. That alone took away at least half the offense. The line didn't perform. ok. With the defense this team has, once the line is rebuilt and we get a couple corners, this team is right back in contention....but the only thing being said is how awful this team is.

There hasn't been one thread posted about how the young players performed after the season ended. I try to talk about the future but so many of y'all are holding onto the past instead of discussing the future.

The only thing being said here is how bad the head coach is. I've posted several threads here trying to talk about other stuff and all i get back are how bad of a coach Herm is. It's ridiculous.

'Bout the only thing I have said is, mainly, how the O-line stunk it up, and they did.

I hate to break it to ya but the head coach is bad, very bad, and as far as living in the past goes: the season just ended last month; people are still frustrated. The Coach saying things right after the last game of this miserable season like: "Get over it" didn't exactly help fill everyone with bright hopes of optimistic future.

[texaschief]

NO. I am sick and tired of people comparing young players to the all time greats. (That is what Tony is) Denver has the next Elway in Cutler. AP is the next jim Brown. As far as a TE that compares to Tony...he dosen't exist.

That's right....and nobody compared to Shannon Sharpe when he played either right?....oh wait....i remember some guy wearing red making waves as Sharpe was in his twilight.

[hermhater]

Exactly...this is the over all sentiment of this entire board. that record is the ONLY thing you people see. It's ridiculous. Until the Chiefs fell out of playoff contention, the Defense was in the top 10 in the league. The Super Star RB got injured. That alone took away at least half the offense. The line didn't perform. ok. With the defense this team has, once the line is rebuilt and we get a couple corners, this team is right back in contention....but the only thing being said is how awful this team is.

There hasn't been one thread posted about how the young players performed after the season ended. I try to talk about the future but so many of y'all are holding onto the past instead of discussing the future.

The only thing being said here is how bad the head coach is. I've posted several threads here trying to talk about other stuff and all i get back are how bad of a coach Herm is. It's ridiculous.

I would warrant you haven't been around long enough to see the ineptness that Carl breeds.

I don't think it was you, but someone else said give Herm a few more years to see what he can do.

Well it looks like that is what is happening, and I am CERTAIN things will not improve into us even reaching the playoffs, let alone going to the SB.

[hermhater]

again, remind me to bring this thread back in 8 years. honestly, y'all don't see the same skill level in any of those TE's as you see in Gonzo?

take off the rose colored lenses ppl.

Are you serious?