Sounds like we have a new QB !

[YZILLA]

My pick for QB to pick up since Croyle went down is about to come true it seems barring a physical . heres the link :

http://www.bobgretz.com/

[Darth CarlSatan]

I am one who would be thrilled to wait on a QB. And there are three main reasons.

1.) I don't know what we have with our current QBs.

You said it. A great QB does better in almost all situations. Even Favre played like garbage when the situation was bad enough. ('05)

Combine that with the beginning of a QBs career, and it's even harder to see what you have.

Croyle started eight games, and had a bad go of it. (0-8) But Troy Aikman went 0-11, with twice as many INTs as TDs. Peyton Manning didn't do much better. He was 3-13 as a rookie. (He did get some decent stats though.)

Injury prone? That is certainly arguable. But I find it hard to label him as injury-prone, when Herm Edwards has proven himself to be hazardous to his own QBs health, more than Croyle has been injured.

So I play the odds on this, and lay the fault on Herm. (Who has hurt more QBs than Reggie White and Deacon Jones combined.)

It certainly doesn't help that Croyle was forced to play, when he said that his body wasn't ready.

2.) I hate the idea of forcing another rookie to come in and take the beating right away. I prefer to create an environment that allows a QB to be successful.

You bring in some rookie QB and get his eggs scrambled right off the bat, how is that guy gonna be a leader?

Give the guy a chance. Protect him.

I don't want him thrown in the fire, I want him to have a minimum one-year "residency", so to speak. Obviously, he'll need to put in some field time, but I'll leave that to the coaches to define the time and place. The sooner we can at least accomplish that, the better prepared our "QB of the future"( Good God that phrase is starting to wear thin on me )will be when the time comes to unleash him.

3.) Finding great o-linemen is easier than finding a great QB, and far less risky.

How many QBs did The browns draft before they decided to draft Joe Thomas instead of another QB?

How many QBs did The Dolphins draft, before they decided to take Jake Long?

Everybody thinks that you have to have a super-human QB. But it seems to be the O-linemen that wind-up making the difference for them. And that super-human QB only comes around once, every ten years or so.

There is a top-notch o-lineman in just about every draft, and he usually gets drafted after a QB that winds-up being a nothing. (Because he didn't have the o-line to be successful.)
It is a crap-shoot, no doubt about it. Someone here at one point actually threw Lienart's name out as a prospect! What do you want to bet that Arizona would be ungodly generous in that trade-scenario( take my wife, please! lol. )
That said, I do believe that if we use the proper criteria in judging the college prospects, we would be better off in picking up a new kid than a free agent for the long haul.
I just realized that 'SLC' did mention that Stafford plays behind a "horrible" O-Line, and that probably has a lot to do with why his numbers in certain areas barely surpass 50% So at least one thing we should place in a high priority is the kid who can turn sh*t to shinola.
Build and athleticism are just as important. Guys like McCoy and Bradford make it look so easy, so natural, and so "All-World", but as you say yourself; they're working under almost ideal conditions. They have better arms and reading/adjustment skills than most other college QB's, and much swifter and surgical delivery than Croyle did at Alabama. But put them behind our current line, and they're Linebacker Lunch all day long. They go to join Brodie on the farm sooner rather than later.
I'm kind of torn between a guy like Stafford who weighs in on the "husky" side of the scale versus a guy like "Juice" who is skin and muscle, and as a result is a lot faster in the backfield.
I sure would like to pick up another VT stud that has enough of both; that program is just crankin' em out like nobody's business when it comes to guys who can shift right on in to the NFL without missing a beat.
As a side-note, their fan-base is phenominal. I was watching some footage on you tube today, and they were blasting out vintage Arrowhead volume and then-some. Great Program.
So in short; fast and tough with the ability to scramble and throw surgically on the run works for me.

4.) It's easier to make a great QB from a great o-line, than to make a great o-line from a great QB.

No explanation needed. Trent Green.

As for great Chiefs performers... 4? Including Green?

Len Dawson, Art Still, DT, Willie Lanier, Will Shields, Emmitt Thomas, Christian Okoye, Jan Stenerude, Buck Buchanan, Albert Lewis, Bobby Bell, Dave Hill, John Alt.... Which four are you seeing? There are six Hall Of Fame guys on my list, and none of them is DT.

Four Quarterbacks.

Lastly, I don't care how much 'gruff' you want to 'broker', The Denver Donkos were the biggest reason for the outcome of that game. (I do like our young CBs...so far.)

If you are going to use the Donkos game as the 'end-all, be-all' for measuring our team, then Damon Huard is awesome! And that LJ guy kicks *** too! Not to mention, we have a dominant o-line!

Not to measure the team. But to measure the LB's, Secondary, and Herb Taylor?
All Day, Every Day, and for the Rest of My Life YES.
I'm not a slave to statistics alone. There are a great number of intangibles that come with this sport. And my greatest strength, though I'm working to increase my knowledge in the Science of the game, is an almost flawless ability to see them, measure them, and judge them accordingly as they relate to the overall strength or weakness of the team.
Shortly after the draft, I went online to watch footage of our top four picks. As you can imagine, it was "Dorsey Mania" all day long, 24/7. So I watched Glenn's footage and as a result, I felt a little bit better about the long-term rammifications of the Jared Allen fallout.
I moved on to Albert. He looked solid, but I honestly didn't have enough know how to evaluate an Offensive Lineman because I'm a Defense Junkie, and it's hard for me to get excited about the offensive side of the line.
On to Charles. Kid looked fast and tough, though he obviously favored shuck and jive over plowin' through the traffic. I pegged him as a worthy candidate for return duty.
Lastly, I arrived at the 'underdog' pick; Brandon Flowers. I watched his reel ONE TIME, and I couldn't wipe the smile off of my face for an hour because I knew right then and there; he was the home-run.
I promptly raced my a** over to the Forum I was a member of at the time, and I threw it down:
"THIS guy is the star, this guy RIGHT HERE".
And back it came:
"Too short". "Not Fast Enough". "Not a Shut-Down Guy".

Blah......Blah......Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh" etc.

I would NOT be swayed:
"You are wrong, I am right, and you WILL learn the error of your ways, I promise".

Two days in to Camp? The "It"-Guy. Few days later? BUZZ-BUZZ-BUZZ-BUZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ etc.
Game after game? Consistent, and more so than any other rookie in the bunch.

The Denver game showed me that our defensive roster that day had the necessary chemistry and Mojo to be succesful. And I will bank on that roster without hesitation all-day, every-day until I'm proven wrong.

I knew Barth was the right man for HIS job, and I couldn't believe he was passed over!
Well guess who's back in town?
And I can call this sh*t correctly ALL DAY LONG.
Throw Herm's "Magic 8-Ball" in the dumpster and send him directly to The Source; ME.
With the proper information, I am NEVER wrong about these things. Ever.

[Darth CarlSatan]

And, just for clarity, I am the one who says that poor protection will get you poor QB play from just about any QB.
Does this mean that good protection will get you good QB play from just about any QB? Not necessarily. A good QB needs many other credentials besides a functional OL to be successful. Some of these intangibles might include the ability to lead, to command respect from your teammates, to command respect from your opponent, to know and take advantage of your teams strengths and your opponents weaknesses. Must possess the ability to make sound decisions in a split second. Must instill confidence in your teammates.
And on and on.
And I have yet to mention any physical skills needed such as accurately throwing or scrambling.
Hell, I think George Patton or Norman Schwartzkoff would had both been great QB's in the NFL, and I've never seen either one throw or run.
Its the way they led men in battle that set them apart. Their men wanted to fight - and win.
Leadership is the key, and we have zero at the moment.
Find our field general first, then bring in the infantry!
(Sorry to butt in on your debate.)

Valid points all. I think we're getting close to a consensus( not that anything WE say or do will ever have any pull with the franchise...)however.

[Chief from the North]

A legend in your own mind.

Not to measure the team. But to measure the LB's, Secondary, and Herb Taylor?
All Day, Every Day, and for the Rest of My Life YES.
I'm not a slave to statistics alone. There are a great number of intangibles that come with this sport. And my greatest strength, though I'm working to increase my knowledge in the Science of the game, is an almost flawless ability to see them, measure them, and judge them accordingly as they relate to the overall strength or weakness of the team.
Shortly after the draft, I went online to watch footage of our top four picks. As you can imagine, it was "Dorsey Mania" all day long, 24/7. So I watched Glenn's footage and as a result, I felt a little bit better about the long-term rammifications of the Jared Allen fallout.
I moved on to Albert. He looked solid, but I honestly didn't have enough know how to evaluate an Offensive Lineman because I'm a Defense Junkie, and it's hard for me to get excited about the offensive side of the line.
On to Charles. Kid looked fast and tough, though he obviously favored shuck and jive over plowin' through the traffic. I pegged him as a worthy candidate for return duty.
Lastly, I arrived at the 'underdog' pick; Brandon Flowers. I watched his reel ONE TIME, and I couldn't wipe the smile off of my face for an hour because I knew right then and there; he was the home-run.
I promptly raced my a** over to the Forum I was a member of at the time, and I threw it down:
"THIS guy is the star, this guy RIGHT HERE".
And back it came:
"Too short". "Not Fast Enough". "Not a Shut-Down Guy".

Blah......Blah......Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh" etc.

I would NOT be swayed:
"You are wrong, I am right, and you WILL learn the error of your ways, I promise".

Two days in to Camp? The "It"-Guy. Few days later? BUZZ-BUZZ-BUZZ-BUZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ etc.
Game after game? Consistent, and more so than any other rookie in the bunch.

The Denver game showed me that our defensive roster that day had the necessary chemistry and Mojo to be succesful. And I will bank on that roster without hesitation all-day, every-day until I'm proven wrong.

I knew Barth was the right man for HIS job, and I couldn't believe he was passed over!
Well guess who's back in town?
And I can call this sh*t correctly ALL DAY LONG.
Throw Herm's "Magic 8-Ball" in the dumpster and send him directly to The Source; ME.
With the proper information, I am NEVER wrong about these things. Ever.

[Bike]

And I can call this sh*t correctly ALL DAY LONG.
With the proper information, I am NEVER wrong about these things. Ever.

Never say never. Ever.
If you have to remind us how you are NEVER wrong in your posts, you will lose credibility - fast.
I guess since you are always correct, I will put everybody else on my ignore list!!
Hindsight is 20/20, bro.

[jerhart]

Never say never. Ever.
If you have to remind us how you are NEVER wrong in your posts, you will lose credibility - fast.
I guess since you are always correct, I will put everybody else on my ignore list!!
Hindsight is 20/20, bro.

Nice.

[Darth CarlSatan]

Never say never. Ever.
If you have to remind us how you are NEVER wrong in your posts, you will lose credibility - fast.
I guess since you are always correct, I will put everybody else on my ignore list!!
Hindsight is 20/20, bro.

I never said my posts here we're flawless. What I said is, that I can pick em. And I will stand by that today, tomorrow, and until I am proven wrong.

[Darth CarlSatan]

Nice.

Can we please READ the post before skimming to the last paragraph and putting our two cents in?:rolleyes:

[Darth CarlSatan]

Without an army, that General gets killed pretty quickly by the other army. How long would Patton have survived without an army?

And a decent QB with a great o-line becomes a General in a hurry.

General Patton could have walked through the streets of Tokyo in broad daylight by himself, killed Tojo, and got back home in time to have a round of 'over-the-phone' chess with Truman before going to bed.

Greatest American Warrior Ever.

[jerhart]

Can we please READ the post before skimming to the last paragraph and putting our two cents in?:rolleyes:

...well you tend to write novels...and dont bold words such as "me....never.....ever" if you dont want people skimming and jumping to the last paragraph...Dont bold words at the end of your novel.


...and btw...you will be wrong on this forum...

Take it easy today during the game brudda, and dont let your ego get you down...

[spiman]

Never say never. Ever.
If you have to remind us how you are NEVER wrong in your posts, you will lose credibility - fast.
I guess since you are always correct, I will put everybody else on my ignore list!!
Hindsight is 20/20, bro.

Never seems like a long time.. Never say never. Allways Right: Everyone is right about God. All concepts of God are correct. All ways to God are right. God is always right.