Chiefs 2009 salary cap figures

[texaschief]

Not including rookie contracts for those rookies coming in from the 2009 draft, these players have contracts with the Chiefs NEXT season. If the trend continues, the estimated salary cap for 2009 is $121.8 million. These salary cap figures are based on the contracts that they sign. They are not factored in with their "Cap Hit." Usually, a player's "Cap Hit" is larger than their salary number.


Albert, Branden- 493,750
Barth, Connor- 385k
Battle, Jackie- 460k
Boone, Alfonso- 1.4mil
Bowe, Dwayne- 460k
Bradley, Mark- 620k
Carnahan, Andrew- 385k
Carr, Brandon-385k
Charles, Jamaal- 385k
Colclough, Ricardo- 620k
Colquitt, Dustin- 900k
Cottam, Brad- 385k
Cox, Mike-385k
Croyle, Brodie- 530K
Darche, Jean-Philippe- 745k
Darling, Devard- 1mil
Dorsey, Glenn- 385k
Edwards, Donnie- 5mil
Edwards, Ron- 1.5mil
Flowers, Brandon-385k
Franklin, Will-385k
Gafford, Thomas-385k
Gatewood, Curtis-385k
Gonzalez, Tony- 4mil
Gray, Quinn-750k
Hali, Tamba-940k
Huard, Damon-2mil
Johnson, Derrick-1mil
Johnson, Larry-4.5mil
Johnston, Brian-385k
Leggett, Maurice-385k
Macklin, David- 745k
McBride, Turk-460k
McIntosh, Damion-2.1mil
Merritt, Mike-385k
Morgan, DaJuan-385k
Pollard, Bernard-530k
Richardson, Barry-385k
Robinson, Kevin-385k
Smith, Kolby-460k
Smith, Wade-620k
Studebaker, Andy-385k
Surtain, Pat-7mil
Taylor, Herb-460k
Thigpen, Tyler-460K
Tyler, Demarcus-460k
Washington, Tavares-385k
Waters, Brian- 3.6mil
Williams, Demario-1mil

Total committed salary for the 2009 season is:
$51,743,750

Not including the "cap hit" figures and signing bonuses for rookies, the Chiefs will have somewhere around $65 million in cap room to play with. The bargaining agreement requires teams to spend AT LEAST 86% of their salary cap. That figure comes out to be roughly $99.76 million if the cap est. is correct. "Cap Hit" numbers and signing bonuses with eat up a big portion of the $40 million the Chiefs have to spend, but that still leaves a big number for the Chiefs to make up just to get in compliance with the NFL/NFLPA agreement.

Some names the Chiefs will have to look at just from their own crop of free agents, will be:
Jason Babin- Starting DE
Rocky Boiman- Starting LB
Adrian Jones- Backup OG
Jon McGraw- Backup S
Rudy Niswanger- Starting C
Jarrad Page- Starting S
Pat Thomas- Backup LB
Jeff Webb- WR

Just from that list, you're looking at having to either re-sign or replace 4 or 5 starters to go along with the holes we already have.

Let's say we let all our free agents walk. What are we left with?

Defense:
LE- OPEN
LT- Tyler
RT- Dorsey
RE- Hali
LOLB- OPEN
MLB- OPEN
ROLB- D. Johnson
LCB- Carr/Leggett
RCB- Flowers
SS- Pollard
FS- OPEN

Offense:
WR- Bowe
LT- Albert/Taylor/OPEN
LG- Waters/OPEN
C- OPEN/Waters
RG- OPEN/Albert
RT- OPEN/Taylor/Albert
TE- Gonzo/Cottam
WR- Bradley
QB- Thigpen/OPEN
FB- Cox
RB- Johnson/Charles

Special
K-Barth
P-Colquitt
KR-Robinson/Charles

That leaves us with potentially 4 holes on defense and 3 holes on offense if we go with Thigpen. 7 holes to fill with either the guys we have, free agents or the 2009 draft class.

To recap, we'll have roughly $25-35 million in cap space. We're going to be drafting in the top 5 in April. We will have a new GM. We will have 7 holes to fill.

On offense, we're going to need a:
Center
OG and/or
OT

On defense, we're going to need a:
DE
OLB
MLB
S



You are the new GM. Go have fun.

[jmlamerson]

In regards to JM's post:
First, I disagree with cutting Brodie Croyle. We will need a 3rd string QB, and Croyle makes less than Gray, so why not as long as Herm Edwards has lost his woody for Brodie.
Next, as we both know I disagree about cutting LJ, so I wont go into that too much.
I dont like the idea of Asomugha. Maybe I am just biased because I dont like any player wearing silver and black, or I just dont like paying a crap ton of money to CBs. Any CB can look good IF you get a decent pass rush. Look at the Giants last year. Plus Flowers and Carr are doing pretty good.
On the same note I am satisfied with our safeties. They wouldnt get burnt deep if the QB didnt have enough time to get a shiatsu massage with a "happy ending" before he throws the ball. I also hate the "Tampa 2" defense. It is useless unless you get pressure and sacks with just the 4 down linemen. But ANY defense should be good if you dont have to blitz to get pressure and can drop 7 guys into coverage. I prefer a mix of traditional cover 2 and 3 with an aggressive blitz strategy. But I digress ...
I think Albert should stay at T. Left or right is open for debate.

I don't want a QB controversy next year and I just don't see Croyle's value. He can't stay healthy through a single game anymore. Surely keeping Thigpen and Gray, along with drafting a QB low is enough that the Brodie Croyle experiment can finally be put out of its misery.

I see everyone's arguments with LJ. And there isn't a good answer. We won't get value for him - even if a GM decides to trade for him, we're only getting a low pick. If we keep him, we have clubhouse and possible suspension problems. If we cut him, we're cutting a RB with gas left in the tank, no replcement, and have a cap hit. There isn't a good solution to this problem.

I like Flowers, Leggett, and (especially) Carr. I just think Asomugha is the greatest CB of this era, and we're one of the few teams that will have the cap room to make him a good enough offer. Given the number of three-WR sets in the NFL now, moving Carr to the slot, and keeping Leggett as a reserve DB/special teams player isn't a terrible idea.

I agree with you wholeheartedly regarding the defense. I've seen enough of Pollard this year to realize that it's the scheme, more than his talent, that's holding him back. I don't like Page though. I think we can do better in the draft or in FA.

Albert at T is fine by me. I just had visions of an immense OL (1999-2003 style) of Oher/Albert/Mack/Waters/Gross that could dominate the league. If that doesn't come to pass (which it probably won't), I'm fine keeping Albert at RT.

If I were GM (Mr. Hunt, you can expect my resume and application in the mail haha), this is how I would rank our needs, in order of importance:
RDE
RT
2 LBs
RG/C
luxury upgrades:
LDT
WR (slot or #2)
KR
OL depth
LB depth
DL depth

I would get a pro-bowl or nearly pro-bowl caliber RT, RDE, and LB in FA. OLB v MLB depends on who is available, age and how DJ does at MLB (jury is still out in my opinion).

In the draft I would trade down in the first and pick-up a LB (Mauluga for MLB or Cushing (USC) for OLB) in the middle-late first round. A G/C and/or DL with our 2 2nd round picks (depending on what we get for the trade down). RT or LB in the 3rd round for OL depth. In the 4th round on I would draft the best players available. The majority of people in the fourth round never make it past their rookie contracts, let alone become starters.

I agree with your priorities and analysis. I don't think Maualuga lasts past the seven to eight spot, so we can't trade down that much and still get him. I think he'll be defensive rookie of the year next year, anfd can anchor our defense for the next decade.

[texaschief]

Our cap penalty isn't that much cutting those guys, as most are in the final years of their contracts. And we'll have more than enough cap room to stomach the hits. You don't know what you are talking about.

The sad part is that you ACTUALLY believe this. After you cut THAT many players with those big contracts, you're not going to have ANY room to maneuver. You say we have the room to take that kind of hit... and while you're right, we could take that hit and still come under the cap, we wouldn't have any room to sign all those free agents that you want or re-sign any of our own free agents... not that it matters though, right? We have nothing but busts on this team.

So, you couldn't actually come up with any real objections? Pathetic.

Really? That's what you're gonna go with? LMAO

I don't want a QB controversy next year and I just don't see Croyle's value. He can't stay healthy through a single game anymore. Surely keeping Thigpen and Gray, along with drafting a QB low is enough that the Brodie Croyle experiment can finally be put out of its misery.

Really? YOU? You can't find value in ANYONE on this team...

I see everyone's arguments with LJ. And there isn't a good answer. We won't get value for him - even if a GM decides to trade for him, we're only getting a low pick. If we keep him, we have clubhouse and possible suspension problems. If we cut him, we're cutting a RB with gas left in the tank, no replcement, and have a cap hit. There isn't a good solution to this problem.

I like Flowers, Leggett, and (especially) Carr. I just think Asomugha is the greatest CB of this era, and we're one of the few teams that will have the cap room to make him a good enough offer. Given the number of three-WR sets in the NFL now, moving Carr to the slot, and keeping Leggett as a reserve DB/special teams player isn't a terrible idea.

That one sentence alone DESTROYED any creditability you had. Aso is a good CB for sure. Hell, he might even be a great CB, but "the greatest of his era?!!" Put the pipe down. I just watched a one win team and a rookie QB light his *** up!

Albert at T is fine by me. I just had visions of an immense OL (1999-2003 style) of Oher/Albert/Mack/Waters/Gross that could dominate the league. If that doesn't come to pass (which it probably won't), I'm fine keeping Albert at RT.

That would be a cool O-line... and an expensive one. But O-lines are worth it.

....

[hardcorechiefsfan]

Keep long term:

Albert, Branden- 493,750
Barth, Connor- 385k
Bowe, Dwayne- 460k
Bradley, Mark- 620k
Carr, Brandon-385k
Charles, Jamaal- 385k
Colquitt, Dustin- 900k
Cottam, Brad- 385k
Cox, Mike-385k
Dorsey, Glenn- 385k
Flowers, Brandon-385k
Gonzalez, Tony- 4mil
Johnson, Derrick-1mil
Leggett, Maurice-385k
Pollard, Bernard-530k
Thigpen, Tyler-460K
Waters, Brian- 3.6mil

Keep as backup until contract expires:

Battle, Jackie- 460k
Boone, Alfonso- 1.4mil
Edwards, Ron- 1.5mil
Franklin, Will-385k
Gray, Quinn-750k
Hali, Tamba-940k
Johnston, Brian-385k
McBride, Turk-460k
Merritt, Mike-385k
Morgan, DaJuan-385k
Richardson, Barry-385k
Robinson, Kevin-385k
Smith, Kolby-460k
Smith, Wade-620k
Taylor, Herb-460k
Tyler, Demarcus-460k

Resign (if reasonable):

Jason Babin- As backup DE
Rocky Boiman- As backup LB
Rudy Niswanger- As backup C/OG

Cut/Trade/Let leave as FA:

Croyle, Brodie- 530K
Darling, Devard- 1mil
Edwards, Donnie- 5mil
McIntosh, Damion-2.1mil
Huard, Damon-2mil
Johnson, Larry-4.5mil
Surtain, Pat-7mil
Williams, Demario-1mil
Adrian Jones- Backup OG
Jon McGraw- Backup S
Jarrad Page- Starting S
Pat Thomas- Backup LB
Jeff Webb- WR

Don't Know/Care:

Carnahan, Andrew- 385k
Colclough, Ricardo- 620k
Darche, Jean-Philippe- 745k
Gafford, Thomas-385k
Gatewood, Curtis-385k
Macklin, David- 745k
Studebaker, Andy-385k
Washington, Tavares-385k

Our focus going into this offseason should be:

Defense:
LE- NEED STARTER
LDT- NEED STARTER
RDT- Dorsey
RE- NEED STARTER
LOLB- NEED STARTER
MLB- NEED STARTER
ROLB- D. Johnson
LCB- Carr/Leggett
RCB- Flowers
SS- Pollard
FS- NEED STARTER

Offense:
WR- Bowe
LT- Albert
LG- Waters
C- NEED STARTER
RG- NEED STARTER
RT- NEED STARTER
TE- Gonzo
WR- Bradley
QB- Thigpen
FB- Cox
RB- NEED STARTER

Special
K-Barth
P-Colquitt
KR-NEED STARTER

A new 1WR and 1CB would be nice too (I'm growing on the idea of signing Housmanzadah and I love the idea of Asomugha locking down out CB slot for the next decade). I think Pollard will improve as soon as we can Gunther, so he can remain a starter. Fill the defensive problems through FA (except maybe LB), and draft the offense. I'm for moving Albert to LG, Waters to RG, and drafting Andre Smith or Oher if they're available when we pick. I don't like Robinson or Charles as our KR/PR, and I think we can do better in the draft. We might as well hope and pray Dorsey improves against the run and builds some upper body strength this offeason.

Aren't most if not all of these guys getting paid more than the president of United States?

[jmlamerson]

The sad part is that you ACTUALLY believe this. After you cut THAT many players with those big contracts, you're not going to have ANY room to maneuver. You say we have the room to take that kind of hit... and while you're right, we could take that hit and still come under the cap, we wouldn't have any room to sign all those free agents that you want or re-sign any of our own free agents... not that it matters though, right? We have nothing but busts on this team.



Really? That's what you're gonna go with? LMAO



....

We are going to have over $50M of cap room if we do my cuts. About $20M will be eaten up with dead cap space from cutting LJ, Surtain, Edwards, etc. (remember, cap hits are prorated and Edwards, Surtain, etc. are near the end of their contracts - only LJ and Williams would be sizable cap hits). We have no one we need to extend this year (unless we really want to reward Page for all of his work), and that $20M in dead cap will be off the books after 2009. Given our immense cap room, we can cut all of the overpriced deadwood and still sign our rookie class, some top FAs, and extend who ever you think is worth extending. Who, by the way, needs extending this offseason? Niswanger, Babin, Thigpen, DJ, and Bradley, maybe. That's it. None of those is exactly going to break the bank.

I listed seventeen players (I think) who I thought should be part of our long term plans. I listed another 15 or so who we should let go after they hit FA. I listed another 10 or so I didn't know or care about. That leaves about 15 I said we should cut or let leave in FA this year. With the exception of LJ, these are all players who have no trade value and who are not producing at a pro level.

The team isn't entirely busts, but we've busted in the draft much more often than not during Herm's tenure. The players we have worth keeping are almost entirely free agents, undrafted guys, or pre-Herm guys. I'll go through the entire analysis again if you need it, but we have five guys from Herm's draft who are useful to our team right now (Carr, Flowers, Pollard, Bowe, and Albert). We have another three who show some promise but aren't convincing as starters yet (Cottam, Charles, and Robinson). We have one for whom its too to early to say "bust," but who is playing way below his draft hype (Dorsey). That's it. We have had three pretty awful drafts under Herm, and the next GM will have an awful jobs filling the massive holes Herm's left on this team.

Name a better CB than Asomugha from this decade.

Look, you clearly don't understand how a salary cap works. You clearly overestimate talent if you think Brodie Croyle still has any value to a NFL franchise. You were massively wrong about how Herm's team would perform this year. You don't know what you are talking about.

[Big Daddy Tek]

I never said we should keep Page. I've said all year we need to let him go. You don't know what you are talking about.

I've also said all year that Pollard needs to go if we keep the Cover 2. As I said above, after we can Herm and Gunther, we'll probably go to a real defense. You don't know what you are talking about.

Our cap penalty isn't that much cutting those guys, as most are in the final years of their contracts. And we'll have more than enough cap room to stomach the hits. You don't know what you are talking about.

You know less about football than anyone else on these boards.

You dont know who I am or what i do. If you did, you would be very surprised how much I know. but thats irrelevant little guy. "Our cap penalty isnt that much cutting those guys"? Hold on a second, can you proof read that and make sure that I didnt jumble your quote. Oh, that is what you said? Good, because if you knew anything, you would know that the Chiefs justed wasted 19 MILLION DOLLARS in GUARANTEED money to LJ if they just release him, not to mention that this was his first year in a long term contract worth nearly 50 million. So yeah, little buckaroo, the cap hit on this would be in record proportion. This isnt the Madden video game pal. By the way Lil' Carl, the strongest position on this team for now and the future is at cornerback. You want to make a major trade to the Raiders for Namdi? And then fill the holes for the great players that we had to get rid of, to get him. Like we dont have enough holes. Well atleast we will have 4 good cornerbacks huh? Its really evident that you just started watching the Chiefs this year and didnt go through the transition with us in the off season. If you did then you would know where we are at as a franchise. We didnt make any moves in the offseason last year and played with a bunch of rookies and sophmores so that when the foundation comes together, which it has, we can go out THIS OFFSEASON and build the house with huge cap room. Thats how pro football works. Like I said in my last post, that made you so sad... Dont worry, you'll get it one day lil' buddy.

[chief31]

You dont know who I am or what i do. If you did, you would be very surprised how much I know. but thats irrelevant little guy. "Our cap penalty isnt that much cutting those guys"? Hold on a second, can you proof read that and make sure that I didnt jumble your quote. Oh, that is what you said? Good, because if you knew anything, you would know that the Chiefs justed wasted 19 MILLION DOLLARS in GUARANTEED money to LJ if they just release him, not to mention that this was his first year in a long term contract worth nearly 50 million. So yeah, little buckaroo, the cap hit on this would be in record proportion. This isnt the Madden video game pal. By the way Lil' Carl, the strongest position on this team for now and the future is at cornerback. You want to make a major trade to the Raiders for Namdi? And then fill the holes for the great players that we had to get rid of, to get him. Like we dont have enough holes. Well atleast we will have 4 good cornerbacks huh? Its really evident that you just started watching the Chiefs this year and didnt go through the transition with us in the off season. If you did then you would know where we are at as a franchise. We didnt make any moves in the offseason last year and played with a bunch of rookies and sophmores so that when the foundation comes together, which it has, we can go out THIS OFFSEASON and build the house with huge cap room. Thats how pro football works. Like I said in my last post, that made you so sad... Dont worry, you'll get it one day lil' buddy.

LJ is finishing the second year of that contract.

The Raiders CB is due to be a FA. Therefore, no trade to be made.

When you come to bring all the big talk and prove that you know what you are talking about, shouldn't you actually find out what you are talking about first?

[Big Daddy Tek]

LJ is finishing the second year of that contract.

The Raiders CB is due to be a FA. Therefore, no trade to be made.

When you come to bring all the big talk and prove that you know what you are talking about, shouldn't you actually find out what you are talking about first?

Your right, LJ is finishing his 2nd year. My bad, typo. Contract was 45 mil + incentives for 6 years, which would mean the cap hit would be tremendous if we let him go this early like I said. My point is still right on and very correct. As far as Nnamdi, your outta your mind if you think that the Raiders let him hit the open market. Im very aware of his contract status and fully aware of him being franchise tagged last year and he will be signed this year. He would barely be tradeable after that, but if JM wanted him, it would have to be through trade.

[jap1]

Anybody know if there will be any big name guards available in FA this offseason?

Also, a lot of people think we need a new FS. Im not sure there is anyone available in FA or the draft other than the USC kid (Mays?) who will probably go in the 1st. For those reasons I think we should keep Page and focus on other problems. I still think if we get some pressure on the QB and a few sacks, then the entire secondary will look ten times better.

[texaschief]

We are going to have over $50M of cap room if we do my cuts. About $20M will be eaten up with dead cap space from cutting LJ, Surtain, Edwards, etc. (remember, cap hits are prorated and Edwards, Surtain, etc. are near the end of their contracts - only LJ and Williams would be sizable cap hits).



We know that unless the contract guarantees money, the contracts are not automatically guaranteed. Larry's contract guarantees him 19 million alone. He received 12 of that in his signing bonus and 7 of it is guaranteed salary. The signing bonus is distributed evenly over his contract, which means the Chiefs are probably still on the hook for at least 13 million of his contract when you account for his other 7 guaranteed.

Pat Surtain's cap hit is going to be somewhere around 8 million due to his signing bonus when he re-negotiated his contract.

Donnie Edwards got a signing bonus worth 10million. He'll be owed some 3.3 million.

Damion McIntosh received an 18.5 million dollar signing bonus. With 4 years left on his contract, he'll account for a 12 million dollar cap hit.

DeMario Williams got 5 million for his signing bonus and still has 4 years left on his contract. He would be a 4 million dollar hit.

Damon Huard will count for a 1 million dollar cap hit.

Devard Darling will count for a 1 million dollar cap hit.

Croyle and all others would be minimal and would probably only count for 1 or 2 million combined.

The players you want to cut would be a $43 million cap hit AT THE VERY LEAST!




We have no one we need to extend this year (unless we really want to reward Page for all of his work), and that $20M in dead cap will be off the books after 2009. Given our immense cap room, we can cut all of the overpriced deadwood and still sign our rookie class, some top FAs, and extend who ever you think is worth extending. Who, by the way, needs extending this offseason? Niswanger, Babin, Thigpen, DJ, and Bradley, maybe. That's it. None of those is exactly going to break the bank.

First, it wouldn't be 20 million, it'd be 40 or so. Then, with all that money off the books, the Chiefs would have to go out and spend HUGE MONEY in free agency just to get in compliance with the CBA. That would completely go against EVERYTHING the Chiefs are trying to accomplish. To spend that kind of money, the Chiefs would have to give LJ type contracts to each FA they signed in 2009. No thank you. That gives the Chiefs zero maneuverability in the future to re-sign our own players. The LJ, Edwards, McIntosh and Surtain contracts are burden enough for this team. I couldn't imagine having half a team with those kind of contracts and run the risk of them performing like those guys two or three years down the road.

FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL FAIL

I listed seventeen players (I think) who I thought should be part of our long term plans. I listed another 15 or so who we should let go after they hit FA. I listed another 10 or so I didn't know or care about. That leaves about 15 I said we should cut or let leave in FA this year. With the exception of LJ, these are all players who have no trade value and who are not producing at a pro level.

The team isn't entirely busts, but we've busted in the draft much more often than not during Herm's tenure. The players we have worth keeping are almost entirely free agents, undrafted guys, or pre-Herm guys. I'll go through the entire analysis again if you need it, but we have five guys from Herm's draft who are useful to our team right now (Carr, Flowers, Pollard, Bowe, and Albert). We have another three who show some promise but aren't convincing as starters yet (Cottam, Charles, and Robinson). We have one for whom its too to early to say "bust," but who is playing way below his draft hype (Dorsey). That's it. We have had three pretty awful drafts under Herm, and the next GM will have an awful jobs filling the massive holes Herm's left on this team.

YES. PLEASE. I need you to go back through your analysis again. You talk like these undrafted free agents that are on the team aren't players Herm and his staff identified and brought in. IMO, finding talent from the pool of UDFA's shows more talent identification ability than finding talent in the first couple rounds. Your "pre-herm" guys aren't exactly helping your case here. Unless you are just talking about Gonzo and Waters. Can anyone show me a DT who made the Pro Bowl his rookie season? How about second year? Tommie Harris.... any others? How many DTs have made the Pro Bowl 4 consecutive seasons?

You expect WAY too much from rookies.

Name a better CB than Asomugha from this decade.

Champ Bailey
Chris McCallister
Asante Samuel
Ty Law
Rasheen Mathis



Look, you clearly don't understand how a salary cap works. You clearly overestimate talent if you think Brodie Croyle still has any value to a NFL franchise. You were massively wrong about how Herm's team would perform this year. You don't know what you are talking about.

Whatever you say there, hoss.

[texaschief]

So, with $43 million in cap penalties and probably only $116 million in total alloted salary space, who are we going to sign this year as a free agent? Don't forget their cap numbers as well while you're rackin up the bill.

Also don't forget that you have 11 starters needed between rookies (who will have large signing bonuses) and free agents.

How is this a step in the right direction again?