Current Roster Evaluation

[texaschief]

I've seen a lot of posts stating vast overreactions to the state of the current roster. I've seen posts that state we need 3 new O-linemen, that we need 3 new WRs, and that we need 2 new safeties to go along with 2 or 3 new LBs, 2 new DTs and a new CB, a new RB and a new QB.

SO, basically, we don't have a SINGLE good player on this team. I think otherwise. So, I'm going to run down the roster and try to identify who stays, who goes and who currently on the roster can either keep their starting roles or step into a starting role. After this exercise and ensuing discussion, we should have a BETTER idea as to what positions ACTUALLY have to be filled thru free agency and the draft.

Let's start with the offense.

WR- Dwayne Bowe, Mark Bradley, Will Franklin, and Kevin Robinson

Dwayne Bowe is a legitimate #1 WR in the making and shouldn't be looked at as someone who needs to be replaced. He could very well turn into a #2 WR if the Chiefs get Boldin or Crabtree or Houshmandzadeh, but the Chiefs don't HAVE to go out and find that #1 WR. They would probably better served by finding a less expensive #2 WR. Mark Bradley was the #2 last season and he impressed a lot of people but he fell off dramatically during the second half of the season and could serve as a good #3 in the future. Will Franklin and Kevin Robinson still need time to develop as most late round WRs do and it's probably too soon to tell what they're going to become.

RB- Larry Johnson, Jamaal Charles, Kolby Smith, Jackie Battle

Who knows what the hell is going on with LJ. He's still talented enough to be a great back for a couple more seasons and would probably be more valuable to the team if the Chiefs kept him instead of trying to trade him. All the reasons we want to get rid of him are all the reasons why teams won't give us fair value in a trade. He serves the team better staying as the featured back. Jamaal Charles probably solidified his position as the 3rd down back and #2 back. Kolby Smith will serve this team well as the #3 back if one of the first two were to get hurt. Jackie Battle is probably going to find himself stuck on special teams or the practice squad.

TE- Tony Gonzalez, Brad Cottam, Michael Merritt, Jed Collins

Tony is staying. Again, his value to the team is more as a player than a trade chip. Chances are, he at the very least puts up an average Tony Gonzalez year. Brad Cottam gets another year to learn from TG before becoming the future at that position. The Chiefs are set at TE for the foreseeable future. Michael Merritt probably cost himself a roster spot "over a little weed." So look for the Chiefs to grab another TE at somepoint during the off season. I know NOTHING about Jed Collins. Perhaps he can step into Merritt's role on the team.

LT- Branden Albert, Herb Taylor, Andrew Carnahan

Branden Albert played beyond expectations for a rookie who missed the entire preseason. He has the talent to be the franchise's LT for the next decade or so. However, his versatility and college background gives the Chiefs to option to move him inside or to the other OT position and draft the best available LT at #3. Herb Taylor did enough during his time on the line this season to warrant a look at a starting spot somewhere on the line. I know nothing about Carnahan.

LG- Brian Waters, Wade Smith

Brian Waters is a Pro Bowl OG and will be back for at least another season and possibly two. The Chiefs should find a LG for the future at some point this off season or next. Wade Smith is a good backup guard and should have a roster spot locked down.

C- Rudy Niswanger, Wade Smith

Rudy Niswanger is too big for the C position. This position IS one of the positions on the line that should be upgraded this season. I'd expect the Chiefs to draft or sign a new Center. Wade Smith would probably lose his job as backup to Niswanger.

RG- Adrian Jones, Wade Smith, Tavares Washington

Another position that will change next season. Although, the replacement might be found on the current roster. I'd actually expect Niswanger to take a step to his right and fill this position. His size, build, and talent could be perfect for the guard spot. Wade Smith is a good backup and Washington is probably a non-factor.

RT- Damion McIntosh, Herb Taylor, Barry Richardson

This could actually be one of the deeper positions on the line. McIntosh really came on toward the end of the season and COULD keep his spot. Herb Talyor is knocking on the door and could push for a starting position. Barry Richardson was drafted last season with the thought in mind that HE could be the future at that position. Then, depending on what they want to do with Albert, HE could be at this spot to start the season. I'm not sure the Chiefs will be looking to bring in another player to compete here.

QB- Tyler Thigpen, Quinn Gray, Brodie Croyle, Damon Huard

Your guess is as good as mine here. If Pioli is as good of a talent evaluator as everyone says he is, he'll see that the value we'd have to give up for Cassel isn't nearly worth the difference between he and Thigpen. I doubt the Chiefs trade a pair of firsts for Cassel. Gray was a good back up and should be retained. Croyle would be a cheap, young and talented 3rd QB if no other QB were brought in to compete. Damon Huard probably doesn't have a spot next season.

Defense

LE- Tamba Hali, Wallace Gilberry, Turk McBride

Tamba Hali plays good at LE. I doubt they'll look to replace him. I can't see Turk McBride staying on the team. He just hasn't done enough. I know nothing about Gilberry.

LT- Tank Tyler, Alfonso Boone

Tank is developing nicely and I think the Chiefs got a steal in the 3rd, drafting this guy. Alfonso Boone is a good rotational player and he'll have a roster spot.

RT- Glenn Dorsey Ron Edwards, Derek Lokey

Everyone is freaking out about Dorsey and worrying that he could be Ryan Sims part Deux. That's not the case. Dorsey is going to be a great DT. The problem with him and Tyler going forward is that the Chiefs may not keep the 4-3 and that might spell doom for both players. Edwards is a good rotational player and should have a roster spot next season. I don't know much about Lokey other than he was above average at Texas.

RE- Jason Babin, Andy Studebaker, Brian Johnston

Jason Babin really surprised some people last season and may have won a roster spot going into next season. Although, I seriously doubt he'll be looked at as THE starting LDE. I don't know enough about Studebaker and Johnston to be able to give an informed opinion.

LOLB- Demarrio Williams, Curtis Gatewood

Williams needs to be a backup and the Chiefs need to fill their linebacking positions through free agency.

MLB- Pat Thomas Weston Dacus

See above

ROLB- Derrick Johnson

Johnson is the only good LB the Chiefs have on their team. Since being drafted 15th overall, he has underachieved. This season is going to be a huge year for him as it pertains to his future as a Chief.

LCB- Brandon Carr, Pat Surtain, Maurice Leggett

Brandon Carr and Maurice Leggett did enough last season to be considered for a starting position next season. Look for Pat Surtain to be released.

RCB- Brandon Flowers

Starter.... for a WHILE

SS- Bernard Pollard, DaJuan Morgan

Personally, I like Pollard. His mistakes seem to be basic. If he can figure out how to wrap up, I think we've got a SS for a long time.

FS- Jarrad Page, DaJuan Morgan, Jon McGraw

I wouldn't be surprised to see Page come back. But, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Morgan become the new FS.


The way I see it, the Chiefs NEED only a few players from free agency and the draft, while any other players they bring in would be considered upgrades and would render the players they replace as depth... WHICH IS A GOOD THING!!

This is how I see the roster:

FA/D= Free Agent/Draft

Offense
QB- Thigpen
RB- Johnson
TE- Gonzalez
WR- Bowe, FA/D, Bradley
LT-Albert or D
LG-Waters
C-FA/D
RG-Niswanger/Albert
RT-Taylor/Albert/McIntosh

Defense
LDE-Tamba Hali/Jason Babin
LT-Tyler
RT-Dorsey
RDE-FA/D
ROLB-FA/D
MLB-FA/D
LOLB-Johnson
LCB-Carr/Leggett/FA/D
RCB-Flowers/FA/D
SS-Pollard
FS-Morgan

So, as far as in players the Chiefs NEED to bring in, they really just NEED five players to complete the starting squad (excluding depth). We need a RDE, ROLB, MLB, #2 WR and a Center. The rest of the team CAN be filled through players already on the team.

[texaschief]

Don't be too sure he was talking about the defense. The big difference between the two was that our offense was competent last year. Our defense wasn't.

Our defense was not exactly great against the pass, sure, but we weren't good against the run either (30th in the league). A guy like Peppers won't fix that. I know you love Vilma, but he won't fix that. We need someone to eat up space in the middle of the field.

And I fully agree. If Aso isn't franchised, we need to offer him the moon.

So, you're telling me that the new coaching staff should come in and cut every player on a defense that was built to run a 4-3, just to switch over to the 3-4. This is something else that I haven't seen being said here. How could you justify changing a defensive scheme from a 4-3 to a 3-4 after that team just put up the fewest amount of sacks EVER? The 4-3 is designed to put pressure on the QB. The 3-4 is designed to stop the run and generally has to blitz in order to put pressure on the QB.

If we switch over to the 3-4, you have to cut Dorsey, Tank, Edwards, Boone, Hali, McBride, Pollard, and Babin.

Then what? Instead of taking the time to develop these players, you're taking a disastrous step backward while you scramble to try and sign/draft players who fit the new system. In order to do this, you're going to have to COMPLETELY neglect the offensive side of the ball. This just wouldn't make football sense.

You've already got solid, young players in place in Dorsey, Tank, Pollard, Hali, Johnson, Flowers, Morgan, Carr, and Leggett. Building a franchise from scratch with rookie players doesn't happen over night. Again, how many DTs play at a Pro Bowl level their first few seasons in the league? It took Haynesworth 7 seasons to get to where he's at now... and he was hurt almost half the time. You give up on players way too quickly.

[jmlamerson]

So, you're telling me that the new coaching staff should come in and cut every player on a defense that was built to run a 4-3, just to switch over to the 3-4. This is something else that I haven't seen being said here. How could you justify changing a defensive scheme from a 4-3 to a 3-4 after that team just put up the fewest amount of sacks EVER? The 4-3 is designed to put pressure on the QB. The 3-4 is designed to stop the run and generally has to blitz in order to put pressure on the QB.

If we switch over to the 3-4, you have to cut Dorsey, Tank, Edwards, Boone, Hali, McBride, Pollard, and Babin.

Then what? Instead of taking the time to develop these players, you're taking a disastrous step backward while you scramble to try and sign/draft players who fit the new system. In order to do this, you're going to have to COMPLETELY neglect the offensive side of the ball. This just wouldn't make football sense.

You've already got solid, young players in place in Dorsey, Tank, Pollard, Hali, Johnson, Flowers, Morgan, Carr, and Leggett. Building a franchise from scratch with rookie players doesn't happen over night. Again, how many DTs play at a Pro Bowl level their first few seasons in the league? It took Haynesworth 7 seasons to get to where he's at now... and he was hurt almost half the time. You give up on players way too quickly.

Whoa. When did I ever say we should move to a 3-4? I said that we can't start making FA plans until we know the scheme that the new DC will run. Given Pioli's history with the Pats, it's certainly a consideration. And you're right, we have very few 3-4 players. Pollard would be a perfect 3-4 SS, Carr, Leggett, and Flowers would work out, and DJ might work. But you're right, the rest of the front seven would have to go, or at least be moved to backup roles.

We have solid young players on defense in DJ, Pollard, Carr, Leggett, and Flowers.

We have question marks in Dorsey, Tank, and (especially) Morgan. What, exactly, did Morgan do to impress you in 2008?! He's our backup SS and a special teams player, not a starter.

We have a massively underachieving Hali, who looks like he needs Pro Bowlers opposite him to be effective.

I agree that many times a DT needs time to improve. Not always - look at Vince Wilfork, Luis Castillo, Casey Hamption, Kevin Williams, Warren Sapp, etc. - but a lot of the time. That's why I said that that Dorsey and Tank need to massively improve, not that they need to be replaced. And do you disagree that they do need to massively improve? That we need a physical presence in the center of our defense?

Unless Tank and Dorsey improve massively from their 2008 performances, our unless we upgrade the DT position, our team will be run on the entire 2009 season. Does anyone really disagree with that?

[balto]

drafting Eugene Monroe with our 1st pick would be ok with me. Monroe AND Albert where room mates in college and they STILL get together and hang out. I'm guessing Albert would have no problems with him coming to the Chiefs.

I know Waters got to the Pro Bowl this year, but I think a lot of that was his name...

I know I might get killed for this idea BUT why not move Waters BACK to his spot a "C"?

The Coaches talked about it the last couple of years, but never did it. If Center is our biggest need why not do this with our best guy?

Think about this,

FA: (We can afford 1 from each spot and still have a TON of Cap Left over)
Best DE we can get (Peppers, Suggs, Canty, Smith)
Best LB we can get (Vilma, Dansby, Crowder, Scott, Hill)
Best OL guy we can get (Gross"RT", Andrews"RT", Evans "G", Brown"C")

Players around the NFL know Pioli and Haley are serious about getting the Chiefs to the Super Bowl FAST and I think KC will be a hot spot for players wanting to come to.

Draft: (Do what ever we can to Trade down, but if not)
1) Eugene Monroe"LT"
2) Duke "G" OR Mack "C" OR Phil Loadholt "RT" (which ever is on the board still and need)
3) Best LB on the Board
4) Ramses Barden "WR" (ya I'm on his Bandwagon too hehe)
5) BPA
6) BPA
7) Chase Patton "QB" (Our QOTF I'm telling ya)

With us getting our BIGGEST needs done in FA DE, LB, 1 OL guy we can focus our first 2 picks on fixing the Oline then filling other holes later.

Just think about this:

Monroe---Albert---Waters/Mack/Brown----Duke/Evans/Waters----Gross/Andrews/Phil

My choice would be this:

Monroe----Albert----Mack----Waters----Andrews

Then spend the BIG FA money on DE and LB, since Andrews won't cost us near as much as Gross.

I also think Waters is good enough to play ANY inner spot and since he only has a year or two left why not USE that versitility?

OH plus we got our QOTF in the 7th with Patton

[topgonzo]

I just have a quick comment in regards to the whole Dorsey thing that seems to be a current topic. The feeling that he is a bust or not that good. I think that the hardest postition to adjust to the pro level may be DT. The blocking schemes, the team and what the coaches expect or want you to do. Dorsey was coming into one of the worst situations in the league. Young defense unproven and being asked to step up and block, and learn what the chiefs expected him to do. Gap assignments and stuffing the run with monsters inside isnt easy. If there were more team players up and down the line maybe he would of had more chances to flourish and shine. There are quite a few Lineman all around the NFL that didnt do good the first few years. Hell do you remember Neil Smith? He wasnt worth a handful of mud the first few years he played until our COMPLETE defense came together with DT and Saleamua and well many others. Give the guy some time and I think he will be a dominant force. Pioli I believe is going to want to be very careful on FA and try to continue bringing in and building the team from the draft. I think well im sure that just as in the HC that there is a basica blueprint that Pioli has been working on non stop since arriving at Arrowhead. We have dealt with Carl Peterson and Herm with countless other BS for years. This is a new age and any change is a good change when you finish the year 2-14. Light a fire under these kids and lets see what they can do. I believe the chiefs should have been able to win at least 6 games last year had they been better coached. All of the blame doesnt reside with the coach but I think a hell of alot of it does. The coach is the backbone of the team. His dicipline and ideas have to be accepted by the players and be put into action not just a idea that leaves you yawning.

[yashi]

I just have a quick comment in regards to the whole Dorsey thing that seems to be a current topic. The feeling that he is a bust or not that good. I think that the hardest postition to adjust to the pro level may be DT. The blocking schemes, the team and what the coaches expect or want you to do. Dorsey was coming into one of the worst situations in the league. Young defense unproven and being asked to step up and block, and learn what the chiefs expected him to do. Gap assignments and stuffing the run with monsters inside isnt easy. If there were more team players up and down the line maybe he would of had more chances to flourish and shine. There are quite a few Lineman all around the NFL that didnt do good the first few years. Hell do you remember Neil Smith? He wasnt worth a handful of mud the first few years he played until our COMPLETE defense came together with DT and Saleamua and well many others. Give the guy some time and I think he will be a dominant force. Pioli I believe is going to want to be very careful on FA and try to continue bringing in and building the team from the draft. I think well im sure that just as in the HC that there is a basica blueprint that Pioli has been working on non stop since arriving at Arrowhead. We have dealt with Carl Peterson and Herm with countless other BS for years. This is a new age and any change is a good change when you finish the year 2-14. Light a fire under these kids and lets see what they can do. I believe the chiefs should have been able to win at least 6 games last year had they been better coached. All of the blame doesnt reside with the coach but I think a hell of alot of it does. The coach is the backbone of the team. His dicipline and ideas have to be accepted by the players and be put into action not just a idea that leaves you yawning.

Good post. Quite frankly I think anyone willing to call Dorsey a bust already needs to go back and watch some of his college tape. It's too soon to judge him, and the chances of him being great are much higher than being a bust, in my opinion.

[N TX Dave]

Good post. Quite frankly I think anyone willing to call Dorsey a bust already needs to go back and watch some of his college tape. It's too soon to judge him, and the chances of him being great are much higher than being a bust, in my opinion.

Those same people that are calling Dorsey a bust are the same one's that will be in here two years from now if we don't win the SB saying I told you so Pioli & Haley are busts we should have never hired two untested people to run our Chiefs.

[Codac]

Very nice post. I agree with you on pretty much everything. I think drafting an OT with the #3 pick is not the right way to go. MLB, LOLB, and RE is what we need more than anything.

I think Bradley may still be a legit #2 WR. He was a little banged up and didn't get the chance to see the ball nearly as much at the end of the season. Hence his stats went down and people thought he was a fluke.

I'm still confused on what to do with LT. Albert did good there. But if we can find another solid LT we might move him to RG.

[KottkeKU]

its going to be interesting to see who our Defensive coordinator turns out to be...

if it is someone who traditionally runs the 3-4, we are going to have to make some serious changes on defense this offseason if thats what they intend to deploy...we would need 4 new linebackers (DJ is not nearly strong enough to be a LB in a 3-4) and possibly a few new lineman....that would suck having to replace DJ, Dorsey, and possibly even Turk also...Hali and Tank i think are capable of being a DE, and a DT in a 3-4 respectively...but Dorsey isnt strong enough to be DT, and not quick enough to be a DE in that particular scheme am i wrong? we would be taking many steps back if that is what the route they take....so basically what im saying is that i dont really think they have a choice but to run a 4-3 on defense....thats just the personnel we currently have drafted in the last few years...

[yashi]

its going to be interesting to see who our Defensive coordinator turns out to be...

if it is someone who traditionally runs the 3-4, we are going to have to make some serious changes on defense this offseason if thats what they intend to deploy...we would need 4 new linebackers (DJ is not nearly strong enough to be a LB in a 3-4) and possibly a few new lineman....that would suck having to replace DJ, Dorsey, and possibly even Turk also...Hali and Tank i think are capable of being a DE, and a DT in a 3-4 respectively...but Dorsey isnt strong enough to be DT, and not quick enough to be a DE in that particular scheme am i wrong? we would be taking many steps back if that is what the route they take....so basically what im saying is that i dont really think they have a choice but to run a 4-3 on defense....thats just the personnel we currently have drafted in the last few years...

A 3-4 DE resembles a 4-3 DT more than a 4-3 DE, so I think Dorsey would be able to play the position. But the question is would he be as good there as he would as a 4-3 DT? Probably not, unfortunately.

Originally I really liked the idea of switching to a 3-4, but the more I think about I realized that the current players with the most potential don't fit the scheme, particularly DJ and Dorsey. Not to mention we would essentially be forced to take Raji with the 3rd overall pick, rather than Monroe who is currently far and away the guy I want there.

I guess we'll just see what happens.

[ChiefsFanFromNY]

If it's a franchise QB we want to get this season, I'd talk to the Cardinals or Eagles about trading a 2010 conditional draft pick for Leinart or Kobb.

There is no way I agree with that. Stafford and Sanchez are MUCH better prospects and have higher ceilings than Leinart and Kobb. They are not franchise QB's. I don't see how we don't get value with either Sanchez or Stafford at #3. Both have run pro-style offenses. Both can make all the NFL throws and have great arms. Stafford's decision making is questionable, but he won't be available when we pick anyway. Sanchez has been coached by one of the best and has shown his talent and ability to lead a football team throughout the year. I hear he loves the game, studies and has a good head on his shoulders. That's the makeup of a franchise QB. Many of the "experts" have him rated in their top 5 players available. I don't see how we are not getting value. We have a franchise LT in Albert, and I was once for drafting one of the LT's in this draft, but why move a guy in Albert who played great? Doesn't make any sense.

And you really think Jevad Snead can even compare with either one of these guys? I don't see it. Matt Ryan had just as many questions as these guys coming out. He threw a lot of picks in his senior year and many questions about his decision making. The Falcons took a risk and it worked out. Every time a QB is drafted it is a risk, but we are in position to draft a very talented one this year and I think it's worth it. Not trying to change your opinion or anything, but this is just my stance on it. The key to a successful football team starts at QB and we will have a really good one on the board when we pick.