Gazing into the crystal ball

[texaschief]

1 Tyson Jackson LSU
3 Alex Magee Purdue
4 Donald Washington Ohio State
5 Colin Brown Mizzu
6 Quinten Lawrence McNeese St.
7 Javarris Williams Tenn. St.
7 Jake O'Connell Miami OH
7 Ryan Succop USCarolina

Patriots:

1 Jerod Mayo Tennessee
2 Terrence Wheatley Colorado
3 Shawn Crable Michigan
3 Kevin O'Connell San Diego State
4 Jonathan Wilhite Auburn
5 Matt Slater UCLA
6 Bo Ruud Nebraska

2007
Rnd Name College Note
1 Brandon Meriweather Miami (Fla.)
4 Kareem Brown Miami (Fla.)
5 Clint Oldenburg Colorado State
6 Justin Rogers Southern Methodist
6 Mike Richardson Notre Dame
6 Justise Hairston Central Connecticut State
6 Corey Hilliard Oklahoma State
7 Oscar Lua USC
7 Mike Elgin Iowa

2006
Rnd Name College Note
1 Laurence Maroney Minnesota
2 Chad Jackson Florida
3 Dave Thomas Texas
4 Garrett Mills Tulsa
4 Stephen Gostkowski Memphis (kicker)
5 Ryan O'Callaghan California
6 Jeremy Mincey Florida
6 Dan Stevenson Notre Dame
6 Le Kevin Smith Nebraska
7 Willie Andrews Baylor

2005
Rnd Name College Note
1 Logan Mankins Fresno State
3 Ellis Hobbs Iowa State (traded)
3 Nick Kaczur Toledo
4 James Sanders Fresno State
5 Ryan Claridge Nevada-Las Vegas
7 Matt Cassel USC
7 Andy Stokes William Penn

2004
Rnd Name College Note
1 Vince Wilfork Miami (FL)
1 Ben Watson Georgia
2 Marquise Hill Louisiana State
3 Guss Scott Florida
4 Dexter Reid North Carolina
4 Cedric Cobbs Arkansas
5 P.K. Sam Florida State
7 Christian Morton Illinois

2003
Rnd Name College Note
1 Ty Warren Texas A&M
2 Eugene Wilson Illinois
2 Bethel Johnson Texas A&M
4 Dan Klecko Temple
4 Asante Samuel Central Florida
5 Dan Koppen Boston College
6 Kliff Kingsbury Texas Tech
7 Spencer Nead Brigham Young
7 Tully Banta-Cain California
7 Ethan Kelley Baylor

2002
Rnd Name College Note
1 Dan Graham Colorado
2 Deion Branch Louisville
4 Rohan Davey Louisiana State
4 Jarvis Green Louisiana State
7 Antwoine Womack Virginia
7 David Givens Notre Dame


So, not including this year's draft, of the 57 picks Pioli was a part of in NE, only 13 have stuck as starters. 6 of those starters were first round picks. 1 was a kicker. At least he doesn't miss on first rounders... I'll give him that. Here's hoping he had a big hand in the draft in 2005.

This seems to be the draft strategy from here on... throw a bunch of sh!t at the wall and hope something sticks.

[jmlamerson]

You're shorting the Dan Graham, Deion Branch, David Givens, Eugene Wilson, and Jarvis Green picks. All five picks were for players who were starters in the Pats 2003 and 2004 SB seasons. Also, Maroney is still a starter for them.

Ryan O'Callaghan, Wheatley, and Dave Thomas are valuable backups who see a lot of playing time.

[wichitaj]

the pats have been loaded with great talen for the past 10 years, it would be mucher harder to make it on that team, as oh say the chiefs. its called building.

[texaschief]

You're shorting the Dan Graham, Deion Branch, David Givens, Eugene Wilson, and Jarvis Green picks. All five picks were for players who were starters in the Pats 2003 and 2004 SB seasons. Also, Maroney is still a starter for them.

Ryan O'Callaghan, Wheatley, and Dave Thomas are valuable backups who see a lot of playing time.

So, what happened to those players? Herm could've found a couple 2 or 3 year starters before fading into oblivion. Ryan Sims was a starter for a few years too.

You won't find a depth chart that has Moroney as a starter. He wasn't last year and he won't be this year either.

[jmlamerson]

So, what happened to those players? Herm could've found a couple 2 or 3 year starters before fading into oblivion. Ryan Sims was a starter for a few years too.

You won't find a depth chart that has Moroney as a starter. He wasn't last year and he won't be this year either.

Everyone I mentioned, except Maroney, was a productive member of the Pats SB teams. Unlike Sims, who was a unproductive member of some bad Chiefs defenses.

Most left as FAs. Jarvis Green is still a backup, I think. The Pats traded Branch for a 1st rounder to Seattle.

They were players that fit Belicheck's scheme. They were drafted for such. They weren't drafted for the schemes they left for/got traded to. This isn't hard.

[jmlamerson]

You won't find a depth chart that has Moroney as a starter. He wasn't last year and he won't be this year either.

Here you are:

Yahoo! Sports - NFL - New England Patriots - Depth Chart

[Hayvern]

1 Tyson Jackson LSU
3 Alex Magee Purdue
4 Donald Washington Ohio State
5 Colin Brown Mizzu
6 Quinten Lawrence McNeese St.
7 Javarris Williams Tenn. St.
7 Jake O'Connell Miami OH
7 Ryan Succop USCarolina

Patriots:

1 Jerod Mayo Tennessee
2 Terrence Wheatley Colorado
3 Shawn Crable Michigan
3 Kevin O'Connell San Diego State
4 Jonathan Wilhite Auburn
5 Matt Slater UCLA
6 Bo Ruud Nebraska

2007
Rnd Name College Note
1 Brandon Meriweather Miami (Fla.)
4 Kareem Brown Miami (Fla.)
5 Clint Oldenburg Colorado State
6 Justin Rogers Southern Methodist
6 Mike Richardson Notre Dame
6 Justise Hairston Central Connecticut State
6 Corey Hilliard Oklahoma State
7 Oscar Lua USC
7 Mike Elgin Iowa

2006
Rnd Name College Note
1 Laurence Maroney Minnesota
2 Chad Jackson Florida
3 Dave Thomas Texas
4 Garrett Mills Tulsa
4 Stephen Gostkowski Memphis (kicker)
5 Ryan O'Callaghan California
6 Jeremy Mincey Florida
6 Dan Stevenson Notre Dame
6 Le Kevin Smith Nebraska
7 Willie Andrews Baylor

2005
Rnd Name College Note
1 Logan Mankins Fresno State
3 Ellis Hobbs Iowa State (traded)
3 Nick Kaczur Toledo
4 James Sanders Fresno State
5 Ryan Claridge Nevada-Las Vegas
7 Matt Cassel USC
7 Andy Stokes William Penn

2004
Rnd Name College Note
1 Vince Wilfork Miami (FL)
1 Ben Watson Georgia
2 Marquise Hill Louisiana State
3 Guss Scott Florida
4 Dexter Reid North Carolina
4 Cedric Cobbs Arkansas
5 P.K. Sam Florida State
7 Christian Morton Illinois

2003
Rnd Name College Note
1 Ty Warren Texas A&M
2 Eugene Wilson Illinois
2 Bethel Johnson Texas A&M
4 Dan Klecko Temple
4 Asante Samuel Central Florida
5 Dan Koppen Boston College
6 Kliff Kingsbury Texas Tech
7 Spencer Nead Brigham Young
7 Tully Banta-Cain California
7 Ethan Kelley Baylor

2002
Rnd Name College Note
1 Dan Graham Colorado
2 Deion Branch Louisville
4 Rohan Davey Louisiana State
4 Jarvis Green Louisiana State
7 Antwoine Womack Virginia
7 David Givens Notre Dame


So, not including this year's draft, of the 57 picks Pioli was a part of in NE, only 13 have stuck as starters. 6 of those starters were first round picks. 1 was a kicker. At least he doesn't miss on first rounders... I'll give him that. Here's hoping he had a big hand in the draft in 2005.

This seems to be the draft strategy from here on... throw a bunch of sh!t at the wall and hope something sticks.

This post means absolutely jack &(*& without comparing to how other teams have done. How many picks did any other team make that turned into productive players?

[Bike]

This post means absolutely jack &(*& without comparing to how other teams have done. How many picks did any other team make that turned into productive players?

Correct

[chief31]

Everyone I mentioned, except Maroney, was a productive member of the Pats SB teams. Unlike Sims, who was a unproductive member of some bad Chiefs defenses.

Most left as FAs. Jarvis Green is still a backup, I think. The Pats traded Branch for a 1st rounder to Seattle.

They were players that fit Belicheck's scheme. They were drafted for such. They weren't drafted for the schemes they left for/got traded to. This isn't hard.

So Belichick is going to be coaching us? That makes me feel alot better about everything.

Patriots:

1 Jerod Mayo Tennessee
2 Terrence Wheatley Colorado
3 Shawn Crable Michigan
3 Kevin O'Connell San Diego State
4 Jonathan Wilhite Auburn
5 Matt Slater UCLA
6 Bo Ruud Nebraska

2007
Rnd Name College Note
1 Brandon Meriweather Miami (Fla.)
4 Kareem Brown Miami (Fla.)
5 Clint Oldenburg Colorado State
6 Justin Rogers Southern Methodist
6 Mike Richardson Notre Dame
6 Justise Hairston Central Connecticut State
6 Corey Hilliard Oklahoma State
7 Oscar Lua USC
7 Mike Elgin Iowa

2006
Rnd Name College Note
1 Laurence Maroney Minnesota Just to be nice, I'll let this one slide.
2 Chad Jackson Florida
3 Dave Thomas Texas He started 10 games for The Pats in 2008. That is the starter.
4 Garrett Mills Tulsa
4 Stephen Gostkowski Memphis (kicker)
5 Ryan O'Callaghan California
6 Jeremy Mincey Florida
6 Dan Stevenson Notre Dame
6 Le Kevin Smith Nebraska
7 Willie Andrews Baylor

2005
Rnd Name College Note
1 Logan Mankins Fresno State
3 Ellis Hobbs Iowa State (traded)
3 Nick Kaczur Toledo
4 James Sanders Fresno State
5 Ryan Claridge Nevada-Las Vegas
7 Matt Cassel USC
7 Andy Stokes William Penn

2004
Rnd Name College Note
1 Vince Wilfork Miami (FL)
1 Ben Watson Georgia
2 Marquise Hill Louisiana State
3 Guss Scott Florida
4 Dexter Reid North Carolina
4 Cedric Cobbs Arkansas
5 P.K. Sam Florida State
7 Christian Morton Illinois

2003
Rnd Name College Note
1 Ty Warren Texas A&M
2 Eugene Wilson Illinois Still a starter today.
2 Bethel Johnson Texas A&M
4 Dan Klecko Temple
4 Asante Samuel Central Florida
5 Dan Koppen Boston College
6 Kliff Kingsbury Texas Tech
7 Spencer Nead Brigham Young
7 Tully Banta-Cain California
7 Ethan Kelley Baylor

2002
Rnd Name College Note
1 Dan Graham Colorado 80 career starts (Over 11 starts per season), including 31 starts in the past two seasons. This guy is a bonfide starter in the NFL. No fading into oblivion.
2 Deion Branch Louisville He is still a starter for The Seahawks. A couple of injuries have slowed him the past couple of years, but he is a starter in he NFL after seven seasons.
4 Rohan Davey Louisiana State I'll give you this one, because he is not the starter. But the guy does get some starts every season. And remaining on The Patriots for seven seasons and playing is a pretty big accomplishment.
4 Jarvis Green Louisiana State
7 Antwoine Womack Virginia
7 David Givens Notre Dame Injury is the only reason this playoff super-star is no longer around. He was a big piece of two of The Patriots' Super Bowl runs. I'd be thrilled to get that out of a seventh round pick.

Ad those five guys to your 13, and you get 18.

Now, I was about to believe you, and started to look at several other teams' results over that same period. And every team was at, or above, the 13 starters that you had mentioned. (Arizona, Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Philadelphia, Minnesota and Miami, plus Herm's seven drafts)

But then I started to think about it, and remembered how you used to dismiss Vermiel picks like Mitchell and Fujita. (Both are still full-time startes in The NFL.)

But I learned, that by comparison to the other teams I looked at, 18 starters is very good. It is the most that I counted, through those that I checked. Tied with Herm.

[Vanilla Garilla]

This thread is pointless