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Seek;133930 wrote:You are kidding right. Warner a HOF Qb. No way. He is a system Qb nothing less nothing more. Calling Warner a HOB QB is almost the same as Calling Trent Green a HOF Qb. Trent had a much better career minus the superbowl start.
I am not blaming Bowe for anything and really like him. But he is NO Fitzgerald. It is event close. The whole discussion to think so is absurd and highly unrealistic. He just does not have the hands like Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald works and works and works on catching the ball. One handed, two hands, upside down, on his back. It is why he almost always comes down with a jump ball.
Kurt Warner is absolutely a HOF QB. I actually can’t believe anyone would say he isn’t. He was one drive from becoming only the 2nd QB to win Super Bowls as the starting QB for 2 different teams. That’s ridiculous to call him a system QB man. Is Brady a system QB?
Seek;133930 wrote:You are kidding right. Warner a HOF Qb. No way. He is a system Qb nothing less nothing more. Calling Warner a HOB QB is almost the same as Calling Trent Green a HOF Qb. Trent had a much better career minus the superbowl start.I am not blaming Bowe for anything and really like him. But he is NO Fitzgerald. It is event close. The whole discussion to think so is absurd and highly unrealistic. He just does not have the hands like Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald works and works and works on catching the ball. One handed, two hands, upside down, on his back. It is why he almost always comes down with a jump ball.
Kurt Warner’s a two-time NFL MVP. He won one Super Bowl and started in two others. He’s one of only two QBs to start in the SB with two separate teams. He brought the Arizona Freakin’ Cardinals to the Super Bowl. His stats in every conceivable category are better than every QB of his era except Favre, Manning, and Brady. What are you talking about? A system QB? I’m not sure you know what that means. Warner’s a lock for the HOF at least by the 2nd ballot.
EDIT: What Yashi said
Bowe isn’t as good of an athlete at Fitz (or Moss or Burress for the matter). But he can be at least as good as Owens, Torry Holt, or any other number of great WRs of his era. What he lacks in athleticism he makes up for in toughness and instincts. With the exception of Calvin Johnson, there’s not another WR under 25 that I’d rather have on this team.
Seek;133930 wrote:You are kidding right. Warner a HOF Qb. No way. He is a system Qb nothing less nothing more. Calling Warner a HOB QB is almost the same as Calling Trent Green a HOF Qb. Trent had a much better career minus the superbowl start.I am not blaming Bowe for anything and really like him. But he is NO Fitzgerald. It is event close. The whole discussion to think so is absurd and highly unrealistic. He just does not have the hands like Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald works and works and works on catching the ball. One handed, two hands, upside down, on his back. It is why he almost always comes down with a jump ball.
Kurt Warner = HOF……..LOCK!!!! Would bet all you got on it!!!!
Seek;134280 wrote:Yes a system QB. Yes he has played in two superbowls. The last time I checked, his stint with Rams included Marshal Faulk one of the best all purpose running backs, two star receivers with Bruce and Holt and a stud offensive line. The defense wasn’t bad either.If he is truly a HOF QB. There is no way Marc Bulger pushes him out of St. Louis by out performing him. Warners performance since leaving the Rams was nothing but a joke, until He finds another team with a great system and the type of talent as what you saw years ago with the rams.
I am sorry. It was obvious in Kurts off years that his previous sucess was greatly contributed to the talent around him. Not him. Just as Marc Bulgers early success now failing.
He is a great cinderella story, but if he is a true HOF Qb. The value of the HOF isn’t that great in my opinion.
I think you’re severely mistaken. Look at the stats. Warner has had just two seasons that were “bad”, and they were a result of a nagging thumb injury that affected his ability to hold the ball. He was effectively on the shelf for two seasons, playing only 9 games in those years combined.
Bulger didn’t push anyone out of St. Louis. Warner’s thumb pushed Warner out of St. Louis.
Also Marshall Faulk. He wasn’t that great with the Colts. He goes to the Rams and is immediately the best RB in the league. Why? Warner forced defenses to play conservatively, leaving Faulk with plenty of room to work with. His career sure went downhill fast after Warner was out of the picture.
Then with the Giants, it was clear from day 1 he was just buying time for Eli to start. After a couple bad games, they put in Manning and didn’t look back.
Take a look at some career QB ratings.
John Elway – 79.9
Joe Montana – 92.3
Tom Brady – 92.9Kurt Warner 93.8.
Also note that Leinart has never looked anything less than unspectacular with the exact same offense Warner’s playing in now. Seriously, the guy led the Cardinals to the Super Bowl and almost beat the Steelers. They have a below average defense, no running game, and mediocre offensive line (which was abysmal a few years ago). Yes, they have Larry Fitzgerald and Anquan Boldin, but great WRs can’t help a team if the ball doesn’t get to them.
Seek;134280 wrote:Yes a system QB.I don’t think you know what that term means.
Peyton Manning’s always had Marshall Faulk/Joseph Addai/Marvin Harrsion/Reggie Wayne/Dallas Clark and other superstars. That doesn’t mean he’s a “system QB.”
Seek;134280 wrote:Yes he has played in two superbowls.No, he has played in three Super Bowls. And he won two MVP awards.
Seek;134280 wrote:The last time I checked, his stint with Rams included Marshal Faulk one of the best all purpose running backs, two star receivers with Bruce and Holt and a stud offensive line. The defense wasn’t bad either.The Rams were a great team. They wouldn’t have won anything without Warner at QB. Look at what they descended to with the likes of Bulger.
Seek;134280 wrote:If he is truly a HOF QB. There is no way Marc Bulger pushes him out of St. Louis by out performing him.Warner was injured, and the Rams, thinking they’re smarter than they were, cut him in a pathetic attempt to duplicate Montana/Young. As is obvious, it backfired terribly.
Seek;134280 wrote:Warners performance since leaving the Rams was nothing but a joke, until He finds another team with a great system and the type of talent as what you saw years ago with the rams.Warner had the Giants at 6-2 before Coughlin benched him for Manning. In those eight games, he had a better statline than Eli ever has with the Giants.
He next went to the Cards, where he has posted phenomenal numbers. Do you think it’s an accident that he can post Pro Bowl numbers in Arizona when QBs like McNown, Leinert, and the other goobers who have played QB there couldn’t?
Seek;134280 wrote:I am sorry. It was obvious in Kurts off years that his previous sucess was greatly contributed to the talent around him. Not him. Just as Marc Bulgers early success now failing.What off years? Except for the two years he was battling injuries, he’s put up great numbers. He leads all active NFL QBs not named Peyton or Brady in almost every possible statistic. He took the Rams to two Super Bowls. He took the Cards to a Super Bowl. And he had the Giants winning in his brief tenure there.
Seek;134280 wrote:He is a great cinderella story, but if he is a true HOF Qb. The value of the HOF isn’t that great in my opinion.Did Kurt Warner rape your dog or something? That’s the only reason I can come up for why you’re ignoring Warner’s career. In every statistical category, including TDs, passer rating, passing yards, and passing efficiency, Warner is one of the top-5 QBs of his generation. He’s been to more Super Bowls than either Peyton Manning or Brett Favre. He won more MVPs than Tom Brady.
This really isn’t debateable. Your belief that he’s just a “system QB” isn’t backed up by any facts.
EDIT: What yahsi wrote
I guess I just don’t see it. I never really see him making a plays or doing something electric to win a game. I just see him as a manager of the game and lets his team mates win the games. I understand, that is what his job is, but when you talke about HOF Qb. I think of a QB who fights off a sack, scrambles around and makes a oustanding play when his team is down.
I can’t recall watching a game and thinking that Kurt Warner is the reason they won. I can recall them losing a superbowl, because they chose to throw the ball with a lead and used Marshall Faulk only 4 times the entire second half afte he destroyed the Pats the first half.
Maybe My standard of HOF QB is much higher, but Warner is no Elway, Marino,Farve or Montana. Not even close. You can put career stats up all you want, but he does not compare.
No he didn’t rape my dog. I just don’t see it the love for him. I don’t hate him, but he just doesn’t do anyting for me. He is a product of having great talent around, just as Trent Green was in KC. Yes, he was stocking grocery stores one year and in the superboowl the next. I truly believe his history has skewed peoples opinions of him.
Seek;134302 wrote:I guess I just don’t see it. I never really see him making a plays or doing something electric to win a game. I just see him as a manager of the game and lets his team mates win the games. I understand, that is what his job is, but when you talke about HOF Qb. I think of a QB who fights off a sack, scrambles around and makes a oustanding play when his team is down.I can’t recall watching a game and thinking that Kurt Warner is the reason they won. I can recall them losing a superbowl, because they chose to throw the ball with a lead and used Marshall Faulk only 4 times the entire second half afte he destroyed the Pats the first half.
Maybe My standard of HOF QB is much higher, but Warner is no Elway, Marino,Farve or Montana. Not even close. You can put career stats up all you want, but he does not compare.
No he didn’t rape my dog. I just don’t see it the love for him. I don’t hate him, but he just doesn’t do anyting for me. He is a product of having great talent around, just as Trent Green was in KC. Yes, he was stocking grocery stores one year and in the superboowl the next. I truly believe his history has skewed peoples opinions of him.
If Warner doesn’t belong in the HOF, why does Peyton Manning? Why does Favre? Both annually choke(d) in the post-season. Both went to the big game fewer times. Both had some significant down years.
In his ten year career, Warner has a 93.8 passer rating,
3 Super Bowls, and 2 MVPs. Warner won several big games just on his arm. Against the Eagles in the NFC championship (twice). Against the Bucs in the NFC Championship. Against the Titans in the Super Bowl. Against the field in the 2008 playoffs. You’re acting like Warner called the plays in the Rams/NE super bowl.If anyone could do what he did, why didn’t they? Why did guys like Leinert, Bulger, McNown, and Rattay all fail with exactly the same guys Warner had?
What did you want him to do that he didn’t do? He accomplished everything a QB in the NFL can. If nothing else, besides Favre, Manning, Brady and maybe Rothlisberger, has there been a better QB in the past ten years?
And Green was awesome for KC. We won games on his arm, not because of the talent we surrounded him with. Tony G., Priest Holmes, and a half-year of Larry Johnson were the only talented skill players he had. Was our OL great? Sure. But KC’s WR corps was the worst in the NFL while Green was our QB. As much as I respect Kennison, he’s a 3WR on any other team. You can’t really believe that Green could have been easily replaced and we could have still racked up a 13-3 season, can you?
Vanilla Garilla;134297 wrote:Kurt Warner is a no brainer for the HOF! Duh!Its not easy to lead your team to SB with different teams.
And you know what else, (and someone might want to check this out for certain). Kurt Warners been to the SB 3 times. Guess who owns the top 3 passing yd. performances in a SB…….thats right, Im pretty sure its Warner.
jmlamerson;134307 wrote:If Warner doesn’t belong in the HOF, why does Peyton Manning? Why does Favre? Both annually choke(d) in the post-season. Both went to the big game fewer times. Both had some significant down years.I just don’t see it. On paper he is a good Qb, but on the field. I just don’t see it.
Where did I mention anything about Peyton Manning? Well other than the astronomical amount of TD’s that he he throws, and watching him read a defense call and audible and then pick the defense apart would be something, I haven’t seen Warner do.
I personall don’t care for Peyton, but he is a dang good QB. Just watching him, he looks like he levels above Warner.
I have seen Brett Farve single handely take a team that was struggling and took it upon himself to get the job done by running the ball, and getting first downs or a TD, knowing that he is going to be hit hard. It energized the whole team and they started playing better. And when you guys make excuses for Warner having bad years because of an injury. Farve still played on and stil put up good numbers. He also holds the record for most interceptions.
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